Pharaohs Casino - resolved - fraudster II

[Stanford]

The fact that they have not responded, even to bryan (or am i mistaken and has boss contacted him with a decent explanation) is troubling. They really need to explain why they seem to be labeling all or most israeli players fraudulent without showing proof. They can certainly do this without releasing any sensitive information.

What seems to be undisputed is that deposits are confiscated. This is very serious. Even if the players are not desired, they should return the deposits. And winnings. If they think the bonus was taken outside the terms and they keep that, that is a different matter.

I see little justification to withhold winnings. None for a deposit.

imho,
Stanford

 

[Casinomeister]

TO JPM please look at these link and see what Bryan said:

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/casinolux-resolved-fraudster.5828/?t=5828

And I said this:The majority of the complaints I have from Israeli players have several indicators that they are coming from the same group of fraudulant players/player.

I said majority, not all. Just take a look at this forum as an example. Many of the Israeli posters are probably the same person - there are a number of indicators that lead me to believe this. When I have enough solid evidence, I will deal with this in an appropriate manner. Believe me I will.

As for a follow up on this situation, I'll be looking into this today - hopefully all of this will be settled by the end of the week.

 

[halix]

My English isn't better than the one from the Israeli player(s) , but I will add my two cents...

What makes me wondering...:
All the complaints from Israel have the same outfit:
Small/mid deposit (100$, 200$, 1000$) - and a BIG win (4000$, 5000$).

No complaints from players, who had mid-size or low winning amounts...

Sorry to say, but all in all beside some other odd facts this SMELL's a little bit...

bali, which game exactly did you play?
Single-player table? Multi-player-table?

 

[Stanford]

"No complaints from players, who had mid-size or low winning amounts...

Sorry to say, but all in all beside some other odd facts this SMELL's a little bit..."

You will have to spell it out for me. Some people bet large - win large but bust often.

Other people bet small. Win small but protect their bonus as they are more intent on keeping the bonus then anything else.

There isn't anything wrong with either approach.

If you think it smells that a casino doesn't pay out large wins - yeah that smells. Keeping winnings and deposits is a worrysome in any case though.

imho,
Stanford

 

[jerseyguy11]

i can certainly see what bryan is saying. in fact if id have to bet, it probably is the same person or 2 posting here. but you have to treat each player innocent until proven guilty. and im waiting for boss to prove these ppl guilty !

 

[Black21Jack]

What you people are not understanding is that it most likely a lot more involved, and complex than just a simple email being sent out to all players from Israel. I am sure that Boss has evidence proving that all these players are linked, if not the same person using multiple accounts and aliases. The posts here are all very similar in wording, and I think that it is more than a coincidence. Give Boss time to finish the investigation, it is just like when police are investigating a case, they do not release evidence until the investigation is complete. This is usually done to protect identities and to make sure that the investigation is not tainted. If there is fraudulent activity going on with these accounts then the casino has every right to void winnings, and hold on to initial deposits until they are done.

 

[jetset]

And I said this:The majority of the complaints I have from Israeli players have several indicators that they are coming from the same group of fraudulant players/player.

I said majority, not all. Just take a look at this forum as an example. Many of the Israeli posters are probably the same person - there are a number of indicators that lead me to believe this. When I have enough solid evidence, I will deal with this in an appropriate manner. Believe me I will.

As for a follow up on this situation, I'll be looking into this today - hopefully all of this will be settled by the end of the week.

I take your point, Bryan...but nevertheless Boss Media's silence on a serious accusation like this is troubling and needs to be addressed. Perhaps during your communications with them you could underline this?

 

[lola]

suspect investigation results!

hi !
i m still waiting for my 2200$ from players club casino.
they sent to me that email with all their questions about their investigation.
i replied to them that i m not linked to any other player, but they decided to
lock my account anyway.
Now, i saw that they are no longer opened to players from israel.
as i understood from what is written here at the forum, there was some
kind of a fraud activity from israeli players.
i do respect the casino worries, but if they find out in their investigation that
there are couple of linked accounts they should lock them. for all the other accounts, they should pay. their decision to close their casino to israeli players make me think they didn't find any evidence, so they decided this is the best to mark a whole country !
i m calling the meister to ask those casinos who made the investigation
to publish their results openly, so everyone can see.[/SIZE]i want to know if this is what we call "an investigation which its results are known from the beginning".
i would love to know if their are some israeli players who actually have been paid by those casinos after their investigation.
and last thing, i would like to know if players that lost their money at those casinos have also accepted this questionnaire email and have been investigated too.

 

[Stanford]

What you people are not understanding is that it most likely a lot more involved, and complex than just a simple email being sent out to all players from Israel. I am sure that Boss has evidence proving that all these players are linked, if not the same person using multiple accounts and aliases. The posts here are all very similar in wording, and I think that it is more than a coincidence.

They don't seem that similar to me other than it appears that english isn't the first language.

But I think everyone believes there may be two sides. But this is very serious. This isn't one casino stiffing a player. This is a concerted effort by a software provider and/or cash processor. And we are not talking stiffing bonuses but rather taking winnings and deposits.

I don't think I have ever seen anything quite like this. I am troubled.

imho,
Stanford

 

[Dirk Diggler]

This isn't one casino stiffing a player. This is a concerted effort by a software provider and/or cash processor. And we are not talking stiffing bonuses but rather taking winnings and deposits.

I don't think I have ever seen anything quite like this. I am troubled.

imho,
Stanford

I agree - if they have got proof of fraud/multiple accounts then fine, let those involved know specifically what proof they have and confiscate their winnings.

However sending an email out saying that they're closing your account and threatening to contact the local authorities because of fraud, without mentioning the specifics, seems extremely unfair to me. They are being judge and jury without giving the player a chance to prove themselves innocent. They should inform them of the specific evidence they've got and then if the player can't disprove it, fine confiscate the winnings.

It seems to me that they are tarring all Israeli's with the same brush no matter what. I'd be very surprised if it turned out that all these players were commiting fraud - more likely that many of them are a group of bonus hunters that have won lots of money off Boss casino's and they don't like it.

Anyway - I for one will be avoiding BM casino's until it is shown that they definitely treated the players fairly.

 

[caruso]

Boss are already well known for their stunt-pulling. A while back they tried to covertly reset a load of slot jackpots to the tune of $100,000. They got caught, pulled out a lame excuse which everyone found hilarious - read it on page 6 of the WOL thread linked below (and why is that thread now LOCKED??) and reinstated the jackpots. Now they appear to be trying to pull in some additional funds by ripping off the entire country of Israel - presumably because there's been some sporadic fraudulent activity detected, and this seemed a neat opportunity to rake in some badly-needed profits from the entire country.

This is standard Boss dirty dealing.

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[Stanford]

I agree - if they have got proof of fraud/multiple accounts then fine, let those involved know specifically what proof they have and confiscate their winnings.

I agree - except for winnings. They can take back their bonus if taken under fraudulent conditions. Allowing confiscation of winnings is a dangerous precedent. And they should never take deposits.

There are many casinos that can't/won't see the difference between what they consider bonus abuse and real fraud.

When a card counter in Las Vegas is shown the door - they don't take his winnings.

imho,
Stanford

 

[Casinomeister]

When a card counter in Las Vegas is shown the door - they don't take his winnings.

We're not dealing with card counting here but definite fraud. I am privy to some information that I cannot divulge, but I assure you that this is a case of massive player fraud.

I understand the suspicions - this is only natural. But let us not resort to the typical knee-jerk reactions.

A word to the fraudsters: Players who think they can abuse this board and my time and resources will be banned for life, and I will also invoice you for the time spent on reviewing your fraudulent complaints. The wise thing to do right now would be to drop the whole issue. The more you post, the more information I am able to collect - the same goes for your emails. I didn't just jump off of some boat, y'know.

The legitimate claims will be taken care of, of course.

 

[Black21Jack]

We're not dealing with card counting here but definite fraud. I am privy to some information that I cannot divulge, but I assure you that this is a case of massive player fraud.

That is exactly what I was going to say. You cant compare card counting which is legal but against the casinos rules to stealing and fraud, using multiple alises to defraud a business out of money etc. Not even close.

I understand the suspicions - this is only natural. But let us not resort to the typical knee-jerk reactions.

A word to the fraudsters: Players who think they can abuse this board and my time and resources will be banned for life, and I will also invoice you for the time spent on reviewing your fraudulent complaints. The wise thing to do right now would be to drop the whole issue. The more you post, the more information I am able to collect - the same goes for your emails. I didn't just jump off of some boat, y'know.

The legitimate claims will be taken care of, of course.

Just as I said in my previous post, there has got to be a lot more to it and people 'in the know' who are behind the scenes must have evidence of fraudulent activity. Instead of just posting assumptions and believing that the players were ripped off we should all just wait to see what information is given when they are done their investigation.

 

[jen]

If I have understood the case correctly Boss implies that two or more players from Israel conspired to bet simultaneously one on Red while another player on Black in multi-player roulette: it looks like two different playes play. If one loses another conspirator wins so they fulfill WR and fraudulently keep the bonuses which they split afterwards probably in a bar. Correct?

I am puzzed by one thing. No way any of them could win thousands this way. Plus remember the zero. If there is fraud there must be a sort of hacking attack.

BTW, dear Boss Media please pass it to Webdollar that I have not received yet about $100 that Webdollar overcharged my wires, mainly my winnings at Challenge Casino. That was maybe three or four years ago.

 

[Stanford]

That is exactly what I was going to say. You cant compare card counting which is legal but against the casinos rules to stealing and fraud, using multiple alises to defraud a business out of money etc. Not even close.

It is very close. Card counters use aliases and play after being told not to play. They break the house rule but they don't alter the game. The game is straight. They just persist in playing it in a manner that deteriates the house edge.

I am not passing judgement yet on the Boss situation. I am just saying I am not sure how you can have this massive Fraud (big F) when the game is straight. I do believe that a bonus given that doesn't meet the terms and conditions should be revoked (little F).

The offset in roulette is not persausive and would not be fraud (any F).

Players should be very careful about agreeing to casinos taking winnings and deposits. In the unregulated market it is a very slippery slope.

BTW, glad to you here again Jetset. I have noticed you have been gone for awhile from the various boards.

imho,
Stanford

 

[jetset]

Thanks, Stanford - did a little business in the States and decided to have a most enjoyable holiday seeing I was over there.

Whilst I appreciate Boss Media's position regarding the fraudsters out there I think it is very dangerous to remain aloof when allegations such as these are being made - they need to make a statement imo.

 

[jerseyguy11]

agreed, and if just one innocent player is wrongfully labeled a fraudster, thats one too many. Boss, you better make sure your 100% right, thats all I have to say.

 

[Casinomeister]

agreed, and if just one innocent player is wrongfully labeled a fraudster, thats one too many. Boss, you better make sure your 100% right, thats all I have to say.

They have provided me undeniable proof that we have some a-hole players out there. I know who they are, and they can expect to be hearing from me in the next couple of days.

 

[jpm]

I love watching the meister lower the boom on fraudsters! Can't wait for this one...