North Korea and US politics

[vorcirion]

I must admit I don't like these fact checker sites, they have an inherent liberal bias, the old saying there are 'lies, damned lies and statistics' comes to mind, we never needed fact checking newspapers pre the internet or even these websites for the first 20 years of the internet.

Imagine we had the same situation on here, with a big marking on a post, saying please refer to this fact checker if you read this post, it would be silly and a blatant form of thought control.

If trump is going to take action against twitter and facebook he will get applauded by many who are getting sick and tired of tech companies interfering in politics for one side. [esp when they have a monopoly, google should never been allowed to buy youtube, just concentrates too much power into one company's hands]

[ All over this scarborough story too, more soap opera issues that will not affect people's lives one jot, got to laugh really trump and his battles with the media ]

Can you name any president from any country who has lied as much as Trump has? With these kind of presidents you really need fact checking 'cause they put people's lives in danger.
It wouldn't be responsible for media just to report what Trump says and let people think whatever they want from that. If someone lies and the media knows it...they need to tell it. Media's role should be informing people and not spreading propaganda.

 

[vorcirion]

trump has more enemies than I've ever known a modern day politician to have, more battles, he's fought republicans in jeb etc..hillary, the deep state, tv shows, actors, comedians, the list goes on and on

He's got old rudy, joe digenova and his wife plus lou dobbs fighting his corner, it's like a mad pantomime that never ends.

In this there's only right and wrong side of things. Whoever defends Trump in this is a shitty person imo. Similar to attacking McCain AFTER he had died already. Or attacking Khan's family. It's just disgusting behaviour.

 

[mack341]

Can you name any president from any country who has lied as much as Trump has? With these kind of presidents you really need fact checking 'cause they put people's lives in danger.
It wouldn't be responsible for media just to report what Trump says and let people think whatever they want from that. If someone lies and the media knows it...they need to tell it. Media's role should be informing people and not spreading propaganda.

Yes but just do it within an article, I noticed them appearing in the brexit run up, they are so blatant the way they are worded as well, not even pretending to be neutral, like having the bbc on steroids. It's a sign of the liberal establishment losing the arguments and so using these sites to back up their positions.

I don't have a problem with Trump being exposed as lying or making mistakes, that's what journalists are there for, to hold power to account, but they waste time on silly things like attacking him for playing a round of golf, when exercise and relaxation are important for everyone's health.

I don't think I've heard one issue the msm have raised that relates to everybody's day to day life, it's always about russia or ukraine, some past poor taste comments etc...If they had spent as much time on the healthcare issue as russia then positive changes may have come about, but no that's too boring and about real life.

 

[ladyhawke]

[…]
Imagine we had the same situation on here, with a big marking on a post, saying please refer to this fact checker if you read this post, it would be silly and a blatant form of thought control.

That is the most absurd response I have ever read.

What you appear to be suggesting is that someone can twist facts, cast malicious slurs, lie with impunity, and should never be called to account.

The fact that Trump was allowed to say whatever he wanted in the first place, and the tweets still remain is surely a prime example of free speech.

The fact-check marker is only a suggestion made by Twitter. It is not compulsory to obey.

Many people will believe the content of the tweet without bothering to consult the fact-checker. Many others will read the fact-checker and either believe it unequivocally, or follow it up with further research of their own, or disregard it as being malicious and believe the content of the original tweet without further consideration.

The existence of a fact-checker marker gives everyone a choice, but you are implying that we should not be allowed this particular avenue to confirm what is being tweeted is accurate, and thus make up our own minds, as this is a 'blatant form of thought control'.

What absolute rubbish.

What is a 'blatant form of thought control' are the misleading, lying comments Trump tweeted in the first place, just because he could.

 

[mack341]

In this there's only right and wrong side of things. Whoever defends Trump in this is a shitty person imo. Similar to attacking McCain AFTER he had died already. Or attacking Khan's family. It's just disgusting behaviour.

I must have forgotten this, khan?

 

[mack341]

That is the most absurd response I have ever read.

What you appear to be suggesting is that someone can twist facts, cast malicious slurs, lie with impunity, and should never be called to account.

The fact that Trump was allowed to say whatever he wanted in the first place, and the tweets still remain is surely a prime example of free speech.

The fact-check marker is only a suggestion made by Twitter. It is not compulsory to obey.

Many people will believe the content of the tweet without bothering to consult the fact-checker. Many others will read the fact-checker and either believe it unequivocally, or follow it up with further research of their own, or disregard it as being malicious and believe the content of the original tweet without further consideration.

The existence of a fact-checker marker gives everyone a choice, but you are implying that we should not be allowed this particular avenue to confirm what is being tweeted is accurate, and thus make up our own minds, as this is a 'blatant form of thought control'.

What absolute rubbish.

What is a 'blatant form of thought control' are the misleading, lying comments Trump tweeted in the first place, just because he could.

Why do you want to nanny everyone, to make them conform to your views and outlook on life?

Are people so retarded they can't go and look something up now, they need to be handheld and taken to the msm's 'fact checker site'

And how can you fact check someone's opinion, are you so naive to think govt's never get anything wrong, what would a fact checker have said prior to the 2nd gulf war about weapons of mass destruction, they would have damn well said there is strong evidence they exist, years later the public find out it was all BS.

edit: I'm sorry if the above sounds harsh but that is what I am picking up, the end result is we will have no debate, it's shrinking as it is. I don't mind someone challenging trump, that's the role for a journalist or writer, but not these robotic sites, it's the approach the russians and soviet style countries would embrace. The thin end of the wedge of orwellian.

 

[vorcirion]

I must have forgotten this, khan?

I know you like wikipedia so here you go! But it's accurate at least.

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They didn't like Trump's muslim ban proposal and criticized him over it. Then Trump basically suggested that maybe mr. Khan didn't let mrs. Khan to speak 'cause of religion or whatever.

 

[dionysus]

 

[mack341]

That is the most absurd response I have ever read.

Many people will believe the content of the tweet without bothering to consult the fact-checker. Many others will read the fact-checker and either believe it unequivocally, or follow it up with further research of their own, or disregard it as being malicious and believe the content of the original tweet without further consideration.

I think just to add, impying joe scarborough a major tv host had murdered his former personal assistant, will not be taken at face value by readers of trump's tweet, surely?

Going on the kind of posts trump makes, the fact checkers are going to have a busy job and his feed littered with fact checker links.

what next boris johnson, the queen, they are all capable of telling porkies; another thing trump was cleared of colluding with russia [no evidence was found] but will twitter go round adding a fact checker link to every post [even just the notable accounts of pundits and journalist, bloggers etc..] accusing donald of collusion? No they won't, I'm 100% certain they will never do that, but if they are consistent and not biased they would.

 

[sufferinsilence]

I think just to add, impying joe scarborough a major tv host had murdered his former personal assistant, will not be taken at face value by readers of trump's tweet, surely?

Going on the kind of posts trump makes, the fact checkers are going to have a busy job and his feed littered with fact checker links.

what next boris johnson, the queen, they are all capable of telling porkies; another thing trump was cleared of colluding with russia [no evidence was found] but will twitter go round adding a fact checker link to every post [even just the notable accounts of pundits and journalist, bloggers etc..] accusing donald of collusion? No they won't, I'm 100% certain they will never do that, but if they are consistent and not biased they would.

Sadly alot of people take what Trump says at face value.

Anyway, the tweets that were flagged were about fraud with mail-in ballots. The funny part about that is his whole family used mail-in ballots in 2016.

 

[ladyhawke]

Why do you want to nanny everyone, to make them conform to your views and outlook on life?

Huh? You are beginning to be like Trump. Distorting things to conform to your own agenda, as my post suggests nothing of the sort.

Are people so retarded they can't go and look something up now, they need to be handheld and taken to the msm's 'fact checker site'

Why would people think of fact-checking something when the American President tweets all sorts of meaningless rubbish as if it is based on fact? Which is similar to what you do yourself, as you support Trump almost unreservedly, no matter what he says or does. So one can only assume that you fit your own description above.

And how can you fact check someone's opinion, are you so naive to think govt's never get anything wrong, what would a fact checker have said prior to the 2nd gulf war about weapons of mass destruction, they would have damn well said there is strong evidence they exist, years later the public find out it was all BS.

That, regrettably, will always be the case. But there is no comparison to the way Trump operates. His tweets only have one aim, and that is to belittle, denigrate and divide.

edit: I'm sorry if the above sounds harsh but that is what I am picking up, the end result is we will have no debate, it's shrinking as it is. I don't mind someone challenging trump, that's the role for a journalist or writer, but not these robotic sites, it's the approach the russians and soviet style countries would embrace. The thin end of the wedge of orwellian.

The robotic sites that allow Trump free reign regarding free speech? Your arguments are beginning to sound spurious in the extreme.

I think just to add, impying joe scarborough a major tv host had murdered his former personal assistant, will not be taken at face value by readers of trump's tweet, surely?

Surely you are not that naïve?

Going on the kind of posts trump makes, the fact checkers are going to have a busy job and his feed littered with fact checker links.

As it should be, when he libels people by lying without thought and spreads conspiracy theories as if they are the truth.

In fact, anyone who follows his MO should also have their tweets subjected to fact-checking. Otherwise you will allow lies and deflection a platform to eventually destroy integrity and honesty.

what next boris johnson, the queen, they are all capable of telling porkies; another thing trump was cleared of colluding with russia [no evidence was found] but will twitter go round adding a fact checker link to every post [even just the notable accounts of pundits and journalist, bloggers etc..] accusing donald of collusion? No they won't, I'm 100% certain they will never do that, but if they are consistent and not biased they would.

Oh FFS. That really is reaching.

Sadly alot of people take what Trump says at face value.

>>>THIS!!! I rest my case.

 

[Harry_BKK]

So...after suffering the indignity of being fact-checked by Twitter, this is Trump's response:

Trump will sign an executive order on social media companies: White House spokeswoman

Apparently this EO is going to "strongly regulate" or "close down" Social Media platforms.

Is he not trying to undermine the fundamental principle of free speech with this action, as Twitter did not ban his tweet, but simply flagged them with the fact-checker marker. So he is still able to make his ludicrous, unhinged claims, which surely is free speech at its 'finest'.

An interesting question is: Can an Executive Order like this one be issued against private companies?

Hello!!!

Free Speech means you are "Free to speak when you praise the Chosen One to the moon and back!"

To answer your question: No but he could squeeze the authority (FCC or something) to declare Twitter a publisher as editing content is considered publishing.

 

[Harry_BKK]

I think just to add, impying joe scarborough a major tv host had murdered his former personal assistant, will not be taken at face value by readers of trump's tweet, surely?

Going on the kind of posts trump makes, the fact checkers are going to have a busy job and his feed littered with fact checker links.

what next boris johnson, the queen, they are all capable of telling porkies; another thing trump was cleared of colluding with russia [no evidence was found] but will twitter go round adding a fact checker link to every post [even just the notable accounts of pundits and journalist, bloggers etc..] accusing donald of collusion? No they won't, I'm 100% certain they will never do that, but if they are consistent and not biased they would.

Mate, you seem to be either losing the plot or falling in love with Mr T.

The outrage about the Scarborough thing is not so much about Scarborough but the family (parents, husband, etc) of that woman who died. For nearly 20 years, they were never left in peace, first, it was the Democrats, who gave up once it was fully investigated, then the Republicans picked it up and Mr T is carrying the torch now till the end of time or as long as it serves his political agenda.

Imagine your wife/brother/sister etc dies and for two decades all you hear are people talking about how she was murdered when it is clear that she wasn't. Would you feel all fine and dandy? And then your dear Boris starts posting tweets and never relents. Would you be again all fine and dandy?

Are you that cruel like Mr T? Or do you strive on perverse fantasies of people suffering? Or just too naive that you don't see who is getting hurt most with these tweets?

FACT CHECK: Russian collusion - read the damn' report mate. It does not say there was no collusion. They didn't find sufficient evidence to indict (e.g. because they considered Donni JR and Sunnyboy too dumb to know the law) but that Mr T welcomed the help from Russia.

 

[Harry_BKK]

This shows some of fauci's inconsistencies and he has been advising the govt and trump.:

One last thing to this, to show you the level Mr T and his cronies are going to cover up their mistakes.

Nancy Messonnier, the head of the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention's National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases said on 25th Feb: “Disruption to everyday life might be severe.”

Mr T went berzerk and she has never been seen again in any of the briefings. The Director of the agency responsible for exactly this kind of thing was muted!!!

You can look though for the nonsense Mr T and his cronies said on 26th Feb. I'll give you a hint, it was the day of his visionary "15 to zero very soon" comment. Followed-up on the 27th Feb with “It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear.”

You can listen to what she said here:

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[sufferinsilence]

 

[cncas2123]

Mate, you seem to be either losing the plot or falling in love with Mr T.

The outrage about the Scarborough thing is not so much about Scarborough but the family (parents, husband, etc) of that woman who died. For nearly 20 years, they were never left in peace, first, it was the Democrats, who gave up once it was fully investigated, then the Republicans picked it up and Mr T is carrying the torch now till the end of time or as long as it serves his political agenda.

Imagine your wife/brother/sister etc dies and for two decades all you hear are people talking about how she was murdered when it is clear that she wasn't. Would you feel all fine and dandy? And then your dear Boris starts posting tweets and never relents. Would you be again all fine and dandy?

Are you that cruel like Mr T? Or do you strive on perverse fantasies of people suffering? Or just too naive that you don't see who is getting hurt most with these tweets?

FACT CHECK: Russian collusion - read the damn' report mate. It does not say there was no collusion. They didn't find sufficient evidence to indict (e.g. because they considered Donni JR and Sunnyboy too dumb to know the law) but that Mr T welcomed the help from Russia.

Harry he doesn’t read the reports he only looks at the headlines and the sound bites and picks the ones that fit his agenda.
In this thread and the coronavirus thread he continually posts sound bite headlines from dubious sources and states that they are fact and that everyone else is involved in conspiracy.
He’s not for changing regardless of how much fact you put in front of him.
Thankfully I don’t see his content but I can guess what it is from reading the threads .

 

[Harry_BKK]

A fitting meme for your post was posted on that Twitter thread.

 

[Kroffe]

Request from Owl.

 

[Harry_BKK]

The Mr T clan is trying to outdo each other for the most stupid and tone-deaf tweet on the day when the number of death surpassed 100,000 in the US.

 

[ladyhawke]

So the EO seeking to alter the Protections Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act has now been signed by Trump. This Act protects Internet companies from being sued over content that appears on their platforms and allows for content moderation.

The essence of the EO is that if Social Media companies restrict certain voices on their platforms, the companies should be stripped of their legal immunity. That in turn could open Social Media companies to a wave of lawsuits over content seen as defamatory.

There are many dissenting voices from the Federal Communications Commission, American Civil Liberties Union, and even Nancy Pelosi, among others, e.g.

"An Executive Order that would turn the Federal Communications Commission into the President's speech police is not the answer."

"This EO is an attempt to punish social media companies for posts that displease the president."

"By exposing companies to potential liability for everything that billions of people around the world say, this would penalize companies that choose to allow controversial speech and encourage platforms to censor anything that might offend anyone," Facebook spokesman Andy Stone said in a statement.

And this from Pelosi, who supports Twitter's initiative to flag tweets that contain falsehoods; "Trump's order directs the federal government to dismantle efforts to help users distinguish fact from fiction."

So as mentioned above, the Communications Decency Act protects Internet companies from being sued over content that appears on their platforms and allows for content moderation.

And this is what I don't understand, and I really would appreciate it if someone would/could enlighten me.

Trump lies and slanders on Twitter with impunity, so if his EO actually was passed into law, and Trump continues tweeting in the manner to which he has become accustomed, could not his frequent defamatory tweets "result in Twitter being subjected to a wave of lawsuits over the defamatory content"?

In other words, won't his own tweets, and possibly his own Twitter account, become a casualty of his own EO?

 

[Harry_BKK]

So the EO seeking to alter the Protections Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act has now been signed by Trump. This Act protects Internet companies from being sued over content that appears on their platforms and allows for content moderation.

The essence of the EO is that if Social Media companies restrict certain voices on their platforms, the companies should be stripped of their legal immunity. That in turn could open Social Media companies to a wave of lawsuits over content seen as defamatory.

There are many dissenting voices from the Federal Communications Commission, American Civil Liberties Union, and even Nancy Pelosi, among others, e.g.

"An Executive Order that would turn the Federal Communications Commission into the President's speech police is not the answer."

"This EO is an attempt to punish social media companies for posts that displease the president."

"By exposing companies to potential liability for everything that billions of people around the world say, this would penalize companies that choose to allow controversial speech and encourage platforms to censor anything that might offend anyone," Facebook spokesman Andy Stone said in a statement.

And this from Pelosi, who supports Twitter's initiative to flag tweets that contain falsehoods; "Trump's order directs the federal government to dismantle efforts to help users distinguish fact from fiction."

So as mentioned above, the Communications Decency Act protects Internet companies from being sued over content that appears on their platforms and allows for content moderation.

And this is what I don't understand, and I really would appreciate it if someone would/could enlighten me.

Trump lies and slanders on Twitter with impunity, so if his EO actually was passed into law, and Trump continues tweeting in the manner to which he has become accustomed, could not his frequent defamatory tweets "result in Twitter being subjected to a wave of lawsuits over the defamatory content"?

In other words, won't his own tweets, and possibly his own Twitter account, become a casualty of his own EO?

Mr T is acting on the principle: "Bark the loudest and it will stir commotion" but the much older saying is that "Barking dogs don't bite".

Just another "SEE THERE" CON FROM THE DON to divert attention. It will end up like his election fraud committee, which in itself was a "SEE THERE" CON.

 

[wbritton]

Mr T is acting on the principle: "Bark the loudest and it will stir commotion" but the much older saying is that "Barking dogs don't bite".

Just another "SEE THERE" CON FROM THE DON to divert attention. It will end up like his election fraud committee, which in itself was a "SEE THERE" CON.

Harry you have big time T.D.S

 

[ladyhawke]

A further comment to add to my earlier post regarding Trump's newest EO:

"Legal experts believe it is unconstitutional because it risks infringing on the First Amendment rights of private companies and because it attempts to circumvent the two other branches of government."

And from Dem Senator Ron Wyden (Oregon), the architect of the original 1996 Communications Decency Act legislation:

"Trump is trying to steal for himself the power of the courts and Congress to rewrite decades of settled law. He decides what's legal based on what's in his interest."

Never a truer word was spoken.

Anyway not sure why I am so bothered by this. By the time the EO gets to court and goes through all the necessary legal procedures, Trump and his cronies will be long gone from the WH.

 

[dionysus]

 

[ladyhawke]

View attachment 132770

Only problem with this is- he is missing his lipstick.