North Korea and US politics

[mack341]

edit: double post

 

[vorcirion]

I think we're on a totally different page regarding flynn being jailed, it's pointless debating a legal case involving the fbi, that touches on russiagate etc..you think it's a fair election but millions believ there was fraud of some kind to help sniffer biden get 80 odd million votes, an all-time record.

You just have to wait until biden is sworn in, the legal cases are being dealt with, no problem for the establishment I'd have thought.

So supporting a coup is okay with you? Or what should happen to Flynn?

 

[mack341]

It is disinformation. And lies. Your opinion of this election is misinformed. It’s not a label.

your unwillingness to accept this as fact doesn’t surprise me. It makes me wonder why you so readily accept this claim of fraud and not the one that was proven by the USA intelligent agencies for the 2016 election. It’s called bias.

Did AG Barr not say yesterday there is no fraud? Or is he part of the deep state now?

most people realize there is cheating going on??? Are these the same people who thought JFK jr was gonna show up at a political rally? Or maybe the ones who think that Obama is running somedeep state operation?

you state it’s impossible that Biden won fairly It’s impossible because of how many votes were cast.
Must be fraud. No. The get out the vote campaign works. It’s been happening since 2008. More people are coming out to vote. It’s not an impossibility.

And Where is your proof of this cheating. 29 days. And not one shred of proof. What’s impossible is your unwillingness to accept this fact. Get us proof. Why is there no proof. The president of the USA, the most powerful man in the country can have access to any info he wants. Surely he can set up some special group to find this proof. And yet. No. Nothing. Not a special group. Not a shred of anything. Just a bunch of incompetent lawyers who can’t spell.

And. The biggest threat to the world right now is not a virus but the misinformation about the virus

In 24 hrs I've posted the result of a rasmussen poll and a spectator article, and given my opinion [stemming from those two sources of information]
to which you've seen fit to label as lies and misinformation. The type of thing that obviously either causes a heated row or discouragement to post.

 

[mack341]

So supporting a coup is okay with you? Or what should happen to Flynn?

I think you should leave mike flynn alone for the meantime, and try to stop imagining a coup is about to happen.

 

[cncas2123]

What perplexes me the most is that the Deep State theorists tell us that there where millions of fraudulent votes casts but so far I think the only proven fraud was 34 votes for Donald.
Not one poll watcher , not one republican governor, senator or congressman man, not Billy Barr, a Trump hand pick, have seen a single fraudulent vote for Biden , but we are meant to believe there were 10 million?
What BS, pure fantasy and the radicals that promote this must have lost the power of free will a long time ago.
I’m sure they dread the knock at the door when the men in black come to take them away as the seem to have discovered the deep state con that nobody with a degree of sanity can see.
I’ll say it again , 10 million votes have been fraudulently cast for Biden but you can’t find real evidence? Say it out loud and see how daft it sounds.

 

[vorcirion]

I think you should leave mike flynn alone for the meantime, and try to stop imagining a coup is about to happen.

I think you should learn to answer a question. Flynn is advocating for a coup. That should be taken seriously since there can be a lot of bloodshed from that kind of talk.

 

[mack341]

 

[Steviedoo]

In 24 hrs I've posted the result of a rasmussen poll and a spectator article, and given my opinion [stemming from those two sources of information]
to which you've seen fit to label as lies and misinformation. The type of thing that obviously either causes a heated row or discouragement to post.

Mack. But you see my side as some deep state operation. So basically I say lies and misinformantion and you say deep state. Tomato. Tomato.

you can post all the articles and polyou want.

a poll is not proof there was fraud.

An article is not proof there was fraud.

trump and lawyers screaming fraud is not proof of fraud.

your feeling that there too many votes in this election so it must be fraud also not proof of fraud.

Where is the PROOF?

a shred. A hint. Anything.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Wasn't the accusation levelled at trump more russian collusion, I doubt some facebook memes mocking hillary, posted by russians, made all the difference in 2016.

Recent Ramsussen poll results [19nov ]

"How likely is it that Democrats stole votes or destroyed pro-Trump ballots in several states to ensure that Biden would win?"
Democrats - 30% - 20% say Very Likely (VL)
Unaffiliated - 39% - 29% say VL
Republicans - 75% - 61% say VL
All Voters - 47% - 36% say VL

So even at least 1/5 democrat voters believe it was very likely fraud/election crime went on to harm trumps re-election.

Rasmussen is a Republican leaning poll, even the D's they poll are most likely R leaning

 

[sufferinsilence]

Mack. But you see my side as some deep state operation. So basically I say lies and misinformantion and you say deep state. Tomato. Tomato.

you can post all the articles and polyou want.

a poll is not proof there was fraud.

An article is not proof there was fraud.

trump and lawyers screaming fraud is not proof of fraud.

your feeling that there too many votes in this election so it must be fraud also not proof of fraud.

Where is the PROOF?

a shred. A hint. Anything.

Only on pressers and Twitter. Once in court they reply there is no evidence of fraud

 

[mack341]

Mack. But you see my side as some deep state operation. So basically I say lies and misinformantion and you say deep state. Tomato. Tomato.

you can post all the articles and polyou want.

a poll is not proof there was fraud.

An article is not proof there was fraud.

trump and lawyers screaming fraud is not proof of fraud.

your feeling that there too many votes in this election so it must be fraud also not proof of fraud.

Where is the PROOF?

a shred. A hint. Anything.

I think in a large, extremely powerful country as the US is, with the biggest military industrial complex on the planet, big pharma, big media, multiple intelligence agencies etc.. power and influence throughout the world, that yes there is a deepstate to co-ordinate things/policy in the direction they want to go. And they never liked donald trump, he's an outsider who hasn't climbed the party ranks, passed through their vetting processes, hasn't shown his loyalty to govt but in fact challenges some of their past decisions etc..

You're asking me to provide proof against that context, the proof is not going to be provided by the various depts and agencies of govt, or the msm media, as even if they could detect and find it, they want donald gone as much as democrat voters. That is my theory, my thoughts, I cannot objectively prove them.

Atm it doesn't look like there is much donald can do about it, the results will most likely stand, but until and unless all the main allegations are addressed and explained away properly, in a way that people will understand and believe/trust, then millions of republicans at least, will still feel the election result was taken from them.

With brexit, no one on the remain side claimed the vote was rigged, or was the result of miscounting, because imo it aligned with their perception/experience that there were a lot of people, enough, who didn't like the EU for the result to be accurate; but in the opposite way people struggle to see how Joe could win so many votes cleanly, they could see obama's public popularity in 2008, but joe's must be the most hidden in all political history.

Trump looked far more popular, perhaps that was only on the surface, but add in the other anomalies like the congress votes, increase in ethnic vote for trump, and counties won etc...the sum of the equation looks askew, but the public are largely being asked to take it on trust. [there will be no audits or investigations, recounts yes, but would they be capable of uncovering any co-ordinated voter fraud]

-----------

On the earlier stuff, specifically regarding posting lies and misinformation, I had something written before the above, but it disappeared and I can't recall enough to do a rewrite, so I'll leave it.

 

[vorcirion]

I think in a large, extremely powerful country as the US is, with the biggest military industrial complex on the planet, big pharma, big media, multiple intelligence agencies etc.. power and influence throughout the world, that yes there is a deepstate to co-ordinate things/policy in the direction they want to go. And they never liked donald trump, he's an outsider who hasn't climbed the party ranks, passed through their vetting processes, hasn't shown his loyalty to govt but in fact challenges some of their past decisions etc..

You're asking me to provide proof against that context, the proof is not going to be provided by the various depts and agencies of govt, or the msm media, as even if they could detect and find it, they want donald gone as much as democrat voters. That is my theory, my thoughts, I cannot objectively prove them.

Atm it doesn't look like there is much donald can do about it, the results will most likely stand, but until and unless all the main allegations are addressed and explained away properly, in a way that people will understand and believe/trust, then millions of republicans at least, will still feel the election result was taken from them.

With brexit, no one on the remain side claimed the vote was rigged, or was the result of miscounting, because imo it aligned with their perception/experience that there were a lot of people, enough, who didn't like the EU for the result to be accurate; but in the opposite way people struggle to see how Joe could win so many votes cleanly, they could see obama's public popularity in 2008, but joe's must be the most hidden in all political history.

Trump looked far more popular, perhaps that was only on the surface, but add in the other anomalies like the congress votes, increase in ethnic vote for trump, and counties won etc...the sum of the equation looks askew, but the public are largely being asked to take it on trust. [there will be no audits or investigations, recounts yes, but would they be capable of uncovering any co-ordinated voter fraud]

-----------

On the earlier stuff, specifically regarding posting lies and misinformation, I had something written before the above, but it disappeared and I can't recall enough to do a rewrite, so I'll leave it.

Well great. I hope your side stops trusting elections and stops voting. Keep up with that messaging! It's good for the liberals.
It's still weird how you base your thoughts on your feelings instead of evidence. Maybe that's why you're wrong so often.

 

[geordiecolin]

I think in a large, extremely powerful country as the US is, with the biggest military industrial complex on the planet, big pharma, big media, multiple intelligence agencies etc.. power and influence throughout the world, that yes there is a deepstate to co-ordinate things/policy in the direction they want to go. And they never liked donald trump, he's an outsider who hasn't climbed the party ranks, passed through their vetting processes, hasn't shown his loyalty to govt but in fact challenges some of their past decisions etc..

You're asking me to provide proof against that context, the proof is not going to be provided by the various depts and agencies of govt, or the msm media, as even if they could detect and find it, they want donald gone as much as democrat voters. That is my theory, my thoughts, I cannot objectively prove them.

Atm it doesn't look like there is much donald can do about it, the results will most likely stand, but until and unless all the main allegations are addressed and explained away properly, in a way that people will understand and believe/trust, then millions of republicans at least, will still feel the election result was taken from them.

With brexit, no one on the remain side claimed the vote was rigged, or was the result of miscounting, because imo it aligned with their perception/experience that there were a lot of people, enough, who didn't like the EU for the result to be accurate; but in the opposite way people struggle to see how Joe could win so many votes cleanly, they could see obama's public popularity in 2008, but joe's must be the most hidden in all political history.

Trump looked far more popular, perhaps that was only on the surface, but add in the other anomalies like the congress votes, increase in ethnic vote for trump, and counties won etc...the sum of the equation looks askew, but the public are largely being asked to take it on trust. [there will be no audits or investigations, recounts yes, but would they be capable of uncovering any co-ordinated voter fraud]

-----------

On the earlier stuff, specifically regarding posting lies and misinformation, I had something written before the above, but it disappeared and I can't recall enough to do a rewrite, so I'll leave it.

After taking in what is being said away from the MSM over the past 24 hours from those closest to Trump I think that the feeling is that no matter what evidence there may be America will not allow the result be overturned. Trump has been recorded on Monday at a Whitehouse party vowing to fight again in 4 years time!

 

[mack341]

Well great. I hope your side stops trusting elections and stops voting. Keep up with that messaging! It's good for the liberals.
It's still weird how you base your thoughts on your feelings instead of evidence. Maybe that's why you're wrong so often.

yeah you'd like a one party state no doubt!

Feelings is a word for beliefs in this context, drawn from what I read and see, you perhaps put a lot of weight on what cnn and the bbc tell you, on anything politcal I don't. weather and football reports fine, but the rest is littered with liberal's bias and selection. [the new, social liberalism not classic liberal ideas.]

 

[cncas2123]

Still we don’t get a shred of proof, even though there must be loads out there as it’s not just one or two votes we are talking but it’s millions that have been fraudulently cast for Biden.
Surely that’s easy to prove ? Surely someone noticed these ballots being cast fraudulently? But no , big silence on that , apart from the 284 pages of sworn statements that tell us of big men looking at people in strange ways....
Proof, proof , proof. That’s all that’s needed, not too much to ask unless the deep state has got their alien helpers to hoover up all the proof...

 

[sufferinsilence]

After taking in what is being said away from the MSM over the past 24 hours from those closest to Trump I think that the feeling is that no matter what evidence there may be America will not allow the result be overturned. Trump has been recorded on Monday at a Whitehouse party vowing to fight again in 4 years time!

Putting my feelings about Trump aside: 4 years is a long time to stay relevant in politics. On top of that it seems that more and more Republicans are speaking out against Trump so it's the question if he can still run as an R. If he has to run as an independent he'll pull voters away from the R's but barely any from the D's which would almost make them win on default in the American system.

 

[geordiecolin]

Putting my feelings about Trump aside: 4 years is a long time to stay relevant in politics. On top of that it seems that more and more Republicans are speaking out against Trump so it's the question if he can still run as an R. If he has to run as an independent he'll pull voters away from the R's but barely any from the D's which would almost make them win on default in the American system.

My personal opinion is that the result of this election and the feeling of being duped plus how the new administration conduct domestic and foreign policy will fuel the demand for Trump to run again.But that is for us all to see.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Stop the press folks, it's all over, with witnesses like this, I reckon Trump will be rightfully restored to his status as the next POTUS.

This is the 'witness' they actually went with



Clickable link below:

 

[ChopleyIOM]

When even Rudy Guiliani keeps telling you to shut up, you know you're in a bad place.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

With brexit, no one on the remain side claimed the vote was rigged, or was the result of miscounting, because imo it aligned with their perception/experience that there were a lot of people, enough, who didn't like the EU for the result to be accurate; but in the opposite way people struggle to see how Joe could win so many votes cleanly, they could see obama's public popularity in 2008, but joe's must be the most hidden in all political history.

I didn't realise you'd added psychic powers to your list of abilities mack

Got this week's lottery numbers?

That's also some amazing mental gymnastics, Remainers didn't think there was any cheating because they sort of thought Leave should win anyway, but Trump voters are suspicious because they can't see how Biden gained as many votes as he did - against one of the most polarising political figures in all of history, on the back of a massive and co-ordinated campaign to get the Biden vote out?

The Dems lost in 2016 off the back of a lethargic campaign, an unpopular candidate (even amongst many Democrats), and a complacent 'Trump will never win anyway' sort of attitude that didn't exactly get their vote out. They made 100% sure they didn't make the same mistake in 2020, plus it's almost impossible to overstate how massively repulsive many people find Trump, and would have voted for a carton of orange juice if it would have got him out of office.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

This is the 'witness' they actually went with

It's like, 'Yeah, send the drunk woman who rants about illegals and dead people, that'll be the charm'.

 

[geordiecolin]

It's like, 'Yeah, send the drunk woman who rants about illegals and dead people, that'll be the charm'.

I often regard many posts in these threads as a soliloquy as a way of not responding.

Ha ha

 

[mack341]

I didn't realise you'd added psychic powers to your list of abilities mack

Got this week's lottery numbers?

That's also some amazing mental gymnastics, Remainers didn't think there was any cheating because they sort of thought Leave should win anyway, but Trump voters are suspicious because they can't see how Biden gained as many votes as he did - against one of the most polarising political figures in all of history, on the back of a massive and co-ordinated campaign to get the Biden vote out?

The Dems lost in 2016 off the back of a lethargic campaign, an unpopular candidate (even amongst many Democrats), and a complacent 'Trump will never win anyway' sort of attitude that didn't exactly get their vote out. They made 100% sure they didn't make the same mistake in 2020, plus it's almost impossible to overstate how massively repulsive many people find Trump, and would have voted for a carton of orange juice if it would have got him out of office.

Don't twist my words to give them a different meaning please Chop, could win not should win, you know that is true regarding brexit, the result was not a big surprise.

The scale of this is.

'many people find trump massively repulsive' yet he increased his total vote by 11 million, ethnic vote up too, despite 4 years of non-stop attacks by the liberal media, and an impeachment process and russia collusion investigation which never left the headlines.

[edit: btw I'm not saying he is perfect and everyone would like him, but compared to previous GOP candidates he is miles ahead, and beat all of the leading candidates in 2016 incl jeb bush and rubio, so can't have been that repulsive to main street.]

 

[ChopleyIOM]

'many people find trump massively repulsive' yet he increased his total vote by 11 million, ethnic vote up too, despite 4 years of non-stop attacks by the liberal media, and an impeachment process and russia collusion investigation which never left the headlines.

Yes and the Dems did even better, which is why they won. It's kind of how elections work. (Well sort of, 'cause of course last time the Dems won the popular vote but lost the electoral college, whereas this time they won both, comfortably, and fairly.)

Even Bill Barr has accepted the election result is legitimate.

 

[vorcirion]

yeah you'd like a one party state no doubt!

Feelings is a word for beliefs in this context, drawn from what I read and see, you perhaps put a lot of weight on what cnn and the bbc tell you, on anything politcal I don't. weather and football reports fine, but the rest is littered with liberal's bias and selection. [the new, social liberalism not classic liberal ideas.]

There are judges saying that you're wrong. There are Loser's laywers saying you're wrong. And sure there's also liberal media saying that you're wrong. But whenever CNN or MSNBC is saying something...you go back to defensive mode and think they must be wrong 100% of the time (unless they say something good about the Loser). You're too biased to think clearly. You don't trust CNN, you don't trust Fauci and you don't question Tucker, the Loser, Fox at all.

But sure the Loser won't have a chance anyway in 4 years 'cause the election will be rigged again. No point for the Loser's supporters to vote. Deep state will fix the result for Biden/Harris.