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New Policy Change Procedure

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by VIP_Lounge_Mgr, Apr 23, 2007.

    Apr 23, 2007
  1. VIP_Lounge_Mgr

    VIP_Lounge_Mgr Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Casino Manager
    Location:
    Costa Rica
    Hello Everyone,

    This is Christopher DiAngelo, the current casino manager with VIP Lounge Casino, Prism Casino and Slots of Vegas Casino. Due to recent misunderstandings on the forum, I have decided to do things a little bit differently. So that there can be no misunderstandings in the future, I am going to be posting here any time that I make a policy change, free chip offer, or addition to our Terms and Conditions in any of the three casinos I am responsible for. I believe this will help to disolve many disputes with us in the future.

    My first policy change post is related to VIP Lounge Casino (You must register/login in order to see the link.). As most of you know, we recently excluded Netherlands from being allowed to receive bonuses at Prism and Slots of Vegas. Because we were not able to stop players from being able to immediately redeem coupons after they had signed up, it has created some problems for us. So, I am here now to let you know that we are going to be implementing this rule in the VIP Lounge Casino as well. This rules will be placed on the web site tomorrow and will not begin being enforced until 12:01AM EST on the 24th. That means that any player from the Netherlands to deposit and redeem a bonus before that time will not be affected. After that time however, this rule will be in full effect and will be enforced. Any player to deposit and redeem a bonus from the Netherlands after that time will be refunded. All winnings while using a bonus with us will be void.

    Also, we have recently placed a free chip promotion out to active players that we knew from two of our other casinos, Prism and Slots of Vegas, so that they can come in and try out the VIP Lounge for free. Some of the players who received this promotion have posted the coupon code for the free chip on various forums without posting the rules to the chip. I have posted this promo for you below so that there can be no confusion as to the requirements. This offer will require a deposit if you wish to withdraw winnings from this free chip...

    View attachment 5949

    I hope that this new policy of posting all changes here will help to curtail any problems with us in the future, as well as to keep you all up to date on all activities at our casinos. Please let me know if there is anything else that I can help you with.

    Sincerely,

    Christopher DiAngelo
    VIP Lounge Manager
    Toll Free: 866-767-6929
    Email: This email is not visible to you.
    You must register/login in order to see the link.
    You must register/login in order to see the link.
    You must register/login in order to see the link.
     
    1 person likes this.
  2. Apr 23, 2007
  3. mrracetrack

    mrracetrack Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    North of Pluto
    Previously posted by Chris DiAngelo:

    Now posted today (April 22nd) by Chris DiAngelo:

    Seems like you are not real sure what it is you want to do, Chris... :confused:

    It appears you changed horses in midstream... after possibly realizing that your original post did nothing but further add to the poor reputation that all the casinos you work for have... :rolleyes:

    In most knowledgeable peoples opinions... anyone playing at ANY of the casinos in the group you are employed with... are just asking for problems... and that has been proven time and time again over the past 6 years.

    The Virtual group... along with the original Windows Casino group... were the originating cause of all the "problems" that RTG casinos have had with their "poor reputations" over the years... and PRISM Casino has been a large part of that... and I've seen "very little" that would imply or show that anything has changed with the operations of the Virtual Casino group.... and the fact that the Virtual group has again been "ROGUED" here on Casinomeister adds more credibility to my statement.
     
    4 people like this.
  4. Apr 23, 2007
  5. liquidsoap

    liquidsoap Dormant account

    Occupation:
    my self
    Location:
    home
    Isn't this sorta like spam???
     
  6. Apr 23, 2007
  7. GemG7

    GemG7 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    .
    Location:
    US
    Well if Chris is trying to make amends for a prior post and is willing to work with players then more power to him. BUT not all players come and read this forum.

    I played a few times at VIP Lounge and at the time did not realize it was part of the Virtual Group(my bad). Anyway I used the first deposit bonus, I think it was a 200% bonus at the time. I reached playthrough and didn't play any restricted games. I ended up cashing out $970 and it was paid to my Neteller account in 3 days. This was last September when we US players still could use Neteller. Then I realized the casino was part of Virtual, panicked and uninstalled the casino.
     
  8. Apr 23, 2007
  9. VIP_Lounge_Mgr

    VIP_Lounge_Mgr Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Casino Manager
    Location:
    Costa Rica
    I am making an effort

    mrracetrack,

    If you read the thread that you are posting that previous comment of mine from, you will see that one of my loyal players asked me to come back later in that same thread. I am making an effort here. I will attempt to stay on and make sure that every policy, change and issue is taken care of promptly for the three casinos I deal with directly. I would also like be given the benefit of the doubt from time to time. Like I said in the previous post you have quoted, "I was wrong before I even said anything." The same seems to be applying to this post. I am making an effort, but I will not take abuse for no reason.

    If you read that entire posting you are quoting, you would have seen that everything said by the player posting didn't add up. He claimed he wasn't part of a group, yet he was cropping his screenshots and posting other players shots from the cashier. He didn't see the rule in Slots of Vegas, but he was a player in Prism. His dates were stated differently in several posts and never matched up with the screenshots even he provided. Nothing that was said in that post added up and I did refund him in full, as well as every other player in his group. No money was taken from those players... they lost nothing. If I lost any face in that posting it is only because I tried to participate in it. That was the most ridiculous experience I have ever had with absolutely no regard for reason.

    Anyway, I will sit back and watch for a few days. If you guys want me in here, let me know. I will always be fair. If you want to rake me over the coals for players that were caught breaking casino rules, I will stay away. I am willing to do this if I am going to be given a fair shake. I will watch to see how it is going to go.

    Thank you for uderstanding and I am looking forward to being able to do this politely.

    Sincerely,

    Chris
    VIP Lounge, Prism and Slots of Vegas Manager
     
  10. Apr 23, 2007
  11. lanidar

    lanidar Dormant account

    Occupation:
    retired
    Location:
    Avenel, New Jersey
    Those posts by VIP_Lounge_Mgr, reminded me of the Virtual Ted and Virtual Danny posts back in the day when they asked to be trusted....they asked to be believed....they're leaving and refused to post....next thing you know they were back posting.
    Gimme a break!
    These guys will say anything to steal your money.
    "You will see that one of my loyal players".... I noticed that you didn't say "One of my MANY loyal players". Need I say more?
    Look Chris, I don't really give a fat rats ass if you post or you don't.
    I really don't care if you are trying to be a nice guy or not.
    You are doing what you are told to do or you too will be out of a job, just like the many others that preceeded you.
    We are not here to win a personality contest by being "nice guys".
    This is business, serious business and the bottom line is the almighty dollar.
    So, do what ever you wish...stay, go, go, stay.
    But, I will ALWAYS be here to berate Virtual and all it stands for.
     
    8 people like this.
  12. Apr 23, 2007
  13. Da_Gambla

    Da_Gambla Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Code Monkey
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    There are so many ways to approach this post, and an equal amount of ways not to approach as well... it's difficult at best.

    I guess I'll start by saying, Chris, that I doubt I'll ever be a customer. Your company's history is really questionable. They have made short-term changes to alleviate problems, but the long-term always ends up negative. For me, Costa Rica and RTG in general are two combinations that suggest an impending explosion, which is an event I tend to avoid.

    The two previous posters really took off the gloves and let you have it; pretty much on a personal level. I'll not go there... my opinion of the situation -is- negative, but I'll approach that negativity in a dignified and professional manner. I welcome your posts. It is quite obvious that things discussed here CAN and DO in fact affect casino business, otherwise you wouldn't have bothered (either last time, or this time).

    I do respect your right to protect your business from abuse, and that must be a daunting, as wells as a never ending pursuit. I must ask, is the amount of new business brought in by bonus offers sufficient to counter all of the lost business due to bonus complaints and misunderstandings?

    Bonuses have become a puzzle, and humankind are challenged by puzzles. The more complicated you make it, the more they will try and figure it out (usually along the lines of a weakness that can be abused). Everytime a casino tries to be creative with a 'solution', it always opens up other holes. This whole scenario seems very similar to the relationship of Microsoft and the entire hacking underground... You have to understand, if you can step into our shoes for a minute, that the solution seems right there in front of you... make the bonus very simple and impossible to abuse. Since that isn't happening, we can only then surmise that you make a great deal of money from confiscating people's money and denying payouts. With all due respect sir, you can post all of the "we're going to change" posts that you want, but if the implementation remains, the perception will persist.

    It is an honor and a pleasure to have a company representative be made available for consumer dialogue and feedback. I do NOT appreciate the previous two poster's approach, and my post is here to let you know that there ARE potential customers out here who can discuss things without participating in a riot or public flogging. I have no idea if I am within a majority or a minority... we will see. I will watch with great interest if the Virtual Group can in fact run soundly, as well as fairly, for an extended period of time. Only then would I trust my own money or recommend your group to anyone. After only one post, which is tantamount to lip service, I am hesitant. Based on the amount of very real damage done over the last year or so, it is going to take an equal amount of time for that trust to be restored.

    I wish you well in that endeavor, and your posts are appreciated.

    Sincerely,
    Keith
     
    15 people like this.
  14. Apr 23, 2007
  15. jetset

    jetset Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Senior Partner, InfoPowa News Service
    Location:
    Earth
    Great post, Da_Gambla! I second your introduction:

    "There are so many ways to approach this post, and an equal amount of ways not to approach as well... it's difficult at best.

    "I guess I'll start by saying, Chris, that I doubt I'll ever be a customer. Your company's history is really questionable. They have made short-term changes to alleviate problems, but the long-term always ends up negative. For me, Costa Rica and RTG in general are two combinations that suggest an impending explosion, which is an event I tend to avoid."

    What you write in the remainder of your post makes absolute sense to me, too so I'll not try to expand on it further.

    I would classify Chris's post as essentially spam for the following reasons:

    1) Chris has presumably not cleared with Bryan his intention to post promos in this "Online Casinos" section - I would regard that as a necessary courtesy.

    2) If Bryan agrees, then the actual promos should be in the appropriate commercial section, and Chris can be just as proactively present through being on the Casino Rep section and participating when appropriate in discussions on the forum.
     
    1 person likes this.
  16. Apr 23, 2007
  17. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    I echo that sentiment, and indeed the rest of Da_Gambla's post.

    KK
     
  18. Apr 25, 2007
  19. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    There is a good positive side to this, if any player is hit by a "policy change" that has NOT been posted here, then should we assume they have been screwed over?

    A better way to gain trust would be to switch to Microgaming, who are a little more choosy who they allow to operate their software (probably due to the player protection scheme they operate for failed casinos).

    In the original dispute, it was likely the players were after the bonus, however they did not break any terms that were POSTED at the time, even though this might have been an oversight. As casinos are often at great pains to point out, they don't want players trying to "interpret" the T & C, if it's there, it's a term, if it is NOT there, it does NOT apply.

    I looked at the Slots of Vegas site when this dispute surfaced, and no indication is given that it is part of the same group, no obvious backlink to a group portal listing all the casinos, such as one might find with the Palace Group, Jackpot Factory and Casino Action. If there is to be any rules that apply to the group as a whole (such as only one SUB per player throughout) it should be made clear which casinos constitute the group.
     
    3 people like this.
  20. Apr 25, 2007
  21. catrina m

    catrina m Senior Member PABaccred

    Occupation:
    service
    Location:
    US of A
    " but I will not take abuse for no reason."

    I would have stated it for "any reason."

    The small things make a difference.
     
  22. Apr 25, 2007
  23. lojo

    lojo Banned User - repetitive violations of <a href="ht

    Occupation:
    Tradesman
    Location:
    USA
    He may have been say that he is willing to take abuse if there is a reason? ;)

    It looks like there are some people who may never trust the Virtual Group again, and they may contribute to every thing ever brought up, just a risk Chris will have to take if he wants to participate here I guess.

    Thanks for the policy changes, it can only help player and casino alike... the graphic? hmm

    Other's mileage may vary, but I think that if the rest of the Virtual Group were run like Chris runs Prism and Slots, their problems would go away.

    All in all, I think the community's response was amenable given the group's history and status. Nothing to lose and everything to gain by dealing with player issues in real time. Good luck:thumbsup:
     
    2 people like this.
  24. Apr 25, 2007
  25. thenmh

    thenmh Dormant account

    Occupation:
    employee
    Location:
    home
    Here is my policy change suggestions:

    -Ask your rude customers service representatives to treat customers better.
    -Reduce withdrawal processing times: It took 4 days to deduct the sticky bonus from the withdrawal AND ANOTHER 4 days to process the withdrawal. And I am certain that you can reduce the withdrawal processing time to 48 hours because I am sure you that you don't get many customers, even poplular online casinos which get many more withdrawal requests per day can do it so why can't you ? or do you just want the withdrawal to stay pending for a max time in the hope that customers will reverse it and lose ?
     
  26. Apr 26, 2007
  27. VIP_Lounge_Mgr

    VIP_Lounge_Mgr Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Casino Manager
    Location:
    Costa Rica
    Responses to all questions and comments

    Hello again everyone,

    I am going to try to answer all of the most recent replies to this post. I apologize for the length... it is something I know I have to work on.

    The short answer is... yes.

    The long answer is... the complaints and misunderstandings are a very small portion of our business, but they do affect us. Bad publicity can affect any company negatively, and I am here to try to avoid any more of it.

    I am not happy about the recent re-rouging of our casinos and I feel that it was totally unfair. On the other hand, maybe it was our fault. We have had a very hands off approach to the forums, and have felt that our involvement on the forums have never gone very well. The attacks on us as a group made it almost impossible for the real issues to be addressed.

    56 complaints against our group was the reason supplied for our recent rouging. Do the math. 56 complaints, spread over 8 casinos, each as large as almost any casino you compare them with, is 7 complaints each too many, but definitely not enough for any casino to be rouged. Then, when you take into consideration how many of these complaints come from players with issues that were resolved, or have the same issue and have made complaints as a group against us, the problems with our casinos are minimal. Oh, and I don't want to leave out the players like the one above who have issues with us, coming from as far back as 3 years ago or longer, that are still attacking our credibility.

    I do not like the bad press, and I hate to think anyone thinks of us negatively. However, as I know the inner workings of our casinos, and that we do have a very fair and ethical organization; I am more than willing to spend the time to try to make it a fair fight. There has been too much said about us with no one to defend us. Any player who has ever tried has been butchered. Each casino manager cares a great deal about their players and their best interests. It does us no good to create problems that would create these kinds of issues with our image as a fair gaming organization. So, I sat down and decided that the only way to avoid these problems is to keep everyone informed of everything I do here. If any change or policy is made, there can be no dispute if I post it here first. This "I'm going to casinomeister" mentality when players are unhappy with casino rules can only be avoided by my being here.

    I am happy to be here and hope that all of you will come to feel like they you can come directly to me if you ever have a problem. I also wouldn't mind that if there is ever a thread started in regards to any of the three casinos that I am responsible for, that some of you can send me a message and let me know. It is very difficult for me to catch all of the threads, and as I am so longwinded, it takes me awhile to answer when I am in :)

    I am sorry about that image being posted. It seemed like a good idea when I did it, and now, after reading the posts and seeing the "spam" message, I have tried to remove. I am having a hard time trying to figure out how to edit the post though. If you guys could clue me in, I would appreciate it. I don't want to get into any trouble here.

    I am not here to post promos, just prevent problems. I will get that image down as soon as I can.

    Each player is responsible for reading the rules of our casino and following them. I have made a promise to come and post any policy change in the future, but that will not prevent players from claiming changes have been made when they have not. There was a recent post made by a player in Finland claiming that the rule not allowing Finish players to use bonuses was not on the web site when he deposited and claimed a bonus... basically jumping on the bandwagon with the Netherlands group. The funny thing about that is that Finland was not allowed to redeem bonuses since early 2004, just before I started working here as a clerk. Those kind of problems will never be avoided, but I will make sure that any new additions to our rules are posted on this forum. I understand that not everybody reads this forum, but this will be in addition to the changes made on the site and no one will be able to dispute dates again.

    "Slots of Vegas.com is a Slots Portal of the Prism Casino Group. If you already have the Prism Account please do not download again!"

    That has been on the download page of the Slots of Vegas web site since the casino was created. It is directly below the spot you need to enter your info to be allowed to download... You must register/login in order to see the link.

    You are right; I should have said "any". Thank you.

    That was very nice. Thank you.

    Please let me know any time that you have a bad experience with one of our reps. I would like to think that none of them will be rude with you, ever.

    Our withdrawal process at Prism and Slots of Vegas is clearly stated as 7-10 business days. We do our absolute best to stay within that timeframe. US players are becoming increasingly difficult to pay quickly as the options for various methods is very slim and we have to keep the transaction amounts and amount of transactions low to avoid being blocked. This has caused slight delays, but I am very happy to say that we are some of the few casinos able to continue paying players with no problems other than slight delays. I apologize if this has ever caused you any inconvenience and we are currently working on some new methods that will help us to avoid these problems altogether.


    Well, I think that about covers it. Please let me know if there is anything else that I can answer for all of you. I am very happy that I am being given the opportunity.

    Chris
    VIP Lounge, Prism and Slots of Vegas Manager
     
    3 people like this.
  28. Apr 26, 2007
  29. lojo

    lojo Banned User - repetitive violations of <a href="ht

    Occupation:
    Tradesman
    Location:
    USA
    I'm impressed, Chris. Very insightful post. Thank you.

    Of the issues you numbered, are any unresolved within your realm of influence? If not, how will they be handled?

    The question on everybody else's mind might be: so, Chris is doing a great job with three casinos, what about the straight-up rogue behavior of others in the Virtual Group?

    How will you overcome that with this educated audience?

    I understand you might only be able to speak about the casinos you manage, and I totally respect that. But as has been said before, it is a long uphill climb.

    Again; As a Member i welcome transparent, open communication with casino reps.
    This is not a marketing dude, you have a Manager here. A guy with skinthick and modicom enough to have a discussion.

    Best to all:thumbsup:
     
  30. Apr 26, 2007
  31. mrracetrack

    mrracetrack Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    North of Pluto
    Posted by Prism manager Chris DiAngelo:

    56 complaints? :rolleyes:

    I put this into Google... Prism Casino+Complaints... here is the result:


    Results 1 - 20 of about 41,400 for Prism Casino+Complaints. :eek:

    Looks like a tad more than 56... :rolleyes:

    Oh... it's "Rogue" or "Rogued" Chris...not "rouged"... unless you are referring to coloring your casino with make up... :p
     
    1 person likes this.
  32. Apr 26, 2007
  33. lojo

    lojo Banned User - repetitive violations of <a href="ht

    Occupation:
    Tradesman
    Location:
    USA
    I was just curious, mrracetrack, do you have an unresolved dispute with them? I'm a newbie and I honestly don't know. I've read some horrid tales, but only one-sided. Is it anything the rep here can help to solve? Am I just naive? I know there are reasons for the group not being accredited, for not making it off probation, for being rogued.


    Google
    Prism 18,700,000
    Prism -casino +complaints 321,000
    "Prism Casino" +complaint 773 and of course some of those are replies, duplicate listings, and irrelevant hits.

    With that 'boildown' I think it's fair to say that the PAB's here are the important ones to know about, for me anyway.

    The Prism Manager might not be able to speak for the group, and he might not want to. Maybe i was too aggressive and he should ignore me and anyone else that asks questions like that. Maybe the best thing is for him to cover his ass by posting changes in real time so nobody can say it wasn't so; answer questions about the two or three casinos he manages, deal with any current issues in real time and let the chips fall where they may. I dunno.

    I'm out of this one (yeah, I know, I say that all the time) :)

    But it don't mean sh*t to a sagebrush, I can switch from pepsi to coke in a heartbeat, and there are more accredited RTG's than a person needs a mouseclick away.

    I just want to see a civil discussion of issues. Maybe it will happen, maybe it won't.
     
  34. Apr 26, 2007
  35. mrracetrack

    mrracetrack Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    North of Pluto
    lojo asked:

    Unresolved?

    No... unhappily resolved would be more appropriate... along with being privy to a few others that also had "problems" with Prism and the Virtual group.

    I have been involved in online gaming for 7 years now... and this specific group (Virtual) has been the subject of MANY player complaints over that period.

    It is my opinion that the Virtual group... along with the original Windows Casino group... are 95% responsible for the unsavory and poor reputation that RTG casinos in general... still have to this day.

    So when I see yet another "Virtual manager/spokesperson" (and there have been a few previously) come to a forum and start to "defend" the ethics and reputation of a Virtual casino... I feel it's appropriate to continue to make people aware of the "less than stellar" reputation and history this group has deservedly earned over the years.

    And that's what I am doing.
     
    5 people like this.
  36. Apr 26, 2007
  37. jinnia

    jinnia Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Lady of Leisure
    Location:
    Bite, ME
    I was a victim of Virtual/Prism/Grafix back in 2003. And their actions caused me to lose a lot, not just them not paying winnings, but what they took from my checking account without authorization.

    Casinomeister could have resolved my issue sooner, I'm sure, but I couldn't find my files kept, at the time, but was able to later on. A couple of years later Amit Jain of Grafix/Virtual/Prism paid back what they stole.

    My question is, "how many times does it take for a casino, group of casinos say they have cleaned up their act, and webmasters gives them yet, another chance, to only have it thrown right back in their faces? How many times right here at Casinomeisters??

    They lie profusely to get more victims sent their way, and lie about the people/players/webmasters who posts negatively about them to other webmasters, just to get promoted. (I have snapshots as such)

    No, they have claimed to change TOO many times, to only within 6 months or so, it's the same old routine as it has always been!!
     
    6 people like this.
  38. Apr 26, 2007
  39. dancinggoon

    dancinggoon Dormant account PABnorogue PABrogue PABnononaccred2 PABnoaccred PABaccred

    Occupation:
    $$$
    Location:
    Around the world
    I glad that someone from your Group is going to join this Forum and trying to get the whole situation in the right direction!

    Regarding the cashout policy i have quoted, it would be nice if you can take some care about my account "casinosep" on Prism. On the 28.10.2006 i ordered a cashout ob around 7000$ from you Casino, until now i have recived exactly 3000$ thats not nearly the half, after around 5 months! I know you have me as an advancedplayer, and because of this you told me i will recive only 500$ per week. But as the whole thing goes, i recived 500$ every 3-4 weeks.

    If you could handle this situation porperly Chris, it would take some solid background to your posting here.

    On the other side i want to add that i had a cashout of around 5000$ at Viplounge casino. I recieved the whole amount in 2-3 weeks without any problems, so nothing to complain here. :thumbsup:
     
    2 people like this.

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