Mansion screwing me over

[KSOT]

The story is, I deposited $1000 to their casino a few weeks ago and have been grinding away at Keno since then trying to clear their $1000 bonus. Then yesterday it said I couldn't play the casino games, so I contacted CS and they told me all USA customers were banned from the casino and sportsbook. I said that's fine but but that they needed to prorate the bonus which I've cleared half of so far since my losses are currently ~$300. They simply refused to do anything about it and basically told me I was out of luck.

Do I have a good case here or are they within their rights to screw me like this?

 

[noluckever67]

mansion

i have to say mansion is a really big company and im really surprised that they came away with that...maybe you have a copy of emails sent back and forth??

 

[KSOT]

I know, I was really surprised as well. Here is a transcript of my initial live chat session.



Welcome to Chat.Mansion.Com, MANSION Sarah G will be right with you.MANSION

CzarChasm: Hi, I tried to log into Keno just now and it said I couldn't and had to contact customer support

MANSION Sarah G: Hello, may i have your nickname please

CzarChasm: its CzarChasm

MANSION Sarah G: Ok, one moment please

MANSION Sarah G: We regret that we have currently suspended access to MANSION Sportsbook and Casino for US-based Members for business reasons. Due to the new Us legislation change

CzarChasm: nooooooo, i was hpoing you guys would hold out on that

CzarChasm: weve got a problem though, ive squandered about $300 on your $1000 signup bonus so far

MANSION Sarah G: MANSION continues to closely monitor developments which may affect our services to Members globally. We are committed to minimising the affect of these changes on our US-based members both in the immediate and longer terms and ensuring our Members remain well informed. We sincerely hope to reinstate and enhance our product range available to US-based Members in the near future.

CzarChasm: it would be unfair to leave me high and dry on it

MANSION Sarah G: One moment

CzarChasm: maybe we can prorate it for how much ive cleared so far? im alomst halfway done

MANSION Sarah G: i will ask

MANSION Sarah G: As this is out of our hands our Casino Manager has stated that there is nothing we can do about it

CzarChasmno no no, you cant just rob me of $300 when technically ive already earned almost $500

MANSION Sarah G: The new legislation change is out of our hands

CzarChasm: Its out of my hands too

CzarChasm: im not asking to be able to play anymore, im just saying do the right thing about your signup bonus that ive spent days clearing half of

MANSION Sarah G: We are sorry for this but our Casino manager has said that no refunds will be given

CzarChasm: im not asking for a refund, im asking for the half bonus i cleared

CzarChasm: if you wont allow me to finish it, you need to make good on what ive completed, its only right

MANSION Sarah G: Well, no bonuses can be given

CzarChasm: that is bull

MANSION Sarah G: Please email your complaint and i can pass this on for you

CzarChasm: i thought you guys were reputable



Since then I've sent in a number of emails, but they always send back standard autoreply bullshit.

 

[noluckever67]

reply

thats absolutely scandalous on there part...but then again ONLINE gaming is totally nothing short of robbery..when will people realise that without any sort of regulation companies will go ahead and do what they want..in your case they prob realise your in the states what can u do??? nowt....i wish to god the uk government would do something similar to the US without going as far just really strong regulations cos online gaming at the moment IMHO is as crooked as an underground casino....i really hope you keep on at them dude and PM brian see if he can do anything...gluck dude.

 

[KSOT]

Good, so I'm not just overreacting here...

Pardon my ignorance, but who is this "Brian" you speak of?

 

[REOdeathwagon]

Pardon my ignorance, but who is this "Brian" you speak of?

The one ...The only.... Casinomeister - himself......The webmaster of the forum, you are on.

REOdeathwagon

 

[GrandMaster]

No, he is Bryan.

 

[happygobrokey]

fwiw, mansion requires 1x rollover once the bonus is earned/credited, so even if they did allow him to get the bonus, he couldn't play it through to convert to cash.

of course it's greasy that he only got part way through the wr and got banned, but i don't feel they're under any obligation in this case. the player knew well what might happen wrt the bill, and ought to have completed the bonus sooner or not attempted it.

i didn't follow closely, but when omni began refusing bonus for US, had anyone done a good portion of the wr on the first of the month, and then been allowed to finish out the wr and receive the bonus after they changed the t&c on the second? if not given up front, the bonus has to be earned, and if it's not earned, they don't have to give it or any part of it to you.

the player feels like this is an mg clearplay where bonus amounts are released into the cash balance in increments as wr is completed, but imo this is not the case with mansion it is more like omni or littlewoods play xxx to earn the full bonus. the 1x rollover after the bonus is credited lends to the idea that even once credited the bonus is still not cashable chips, so to think that playing 30% of the wr entitles you to a cheque for 30% of the bonus you cleared imo is not warranted in this case.

 

[KSOT]

Luckily for me you're the only one who feels that way so far. CM himself told me he contacted this site's Mansion representative, so we're all just waiting for him to log in and reply now.

For what it's worth, I don't think comparing this bonus to Littlewoods' is totally fair. For starters, you don't see the Littlewoods bonus being earned, it just gets released when you meet the WR without you necessarily having any idea it's coming. The bonus on mansion appears quite visibly both when you deposit and any time you look the active page dedicated to it. While you play you can watch the WR clear dollar by dollar. They make it very apparent that you're working towards a bonus from the start. Given that fact, I don't see how it's relevant whether they give the money before or after the WR, I'm still working towards the same goal. Aside from that, we're not talking about wagering $500 to get $25 on low HA games like Pontoon or whatever the Cryptos did. We're talking about risking a $1000 deposit to wager $20,000 or more on crappy games. It doesn't even seem to be in the same league in that regard.

 

[Tagdog]

fwiw, mansion requires 1x rollover once the bonus is earned/credited,

100% match bonus with wager 10x deposit plus bonus, then one time roll over on top means he would need to wager his deposit 21 times to get full bonus and cash out.

So sensibly speaking mansion could divide his wagering by 21 and give him that as a bonus.

 

[MANSION Casino]

MANSIONs world leading peer-to-peer Sports Exchange and Poker platforms that allow you to bet against other MANSION Members on Poker and all of your favourite sports and major events remain unaffected by recent events.

For business reasons, we regret that we have currently suspended access to MANSION Casino and Sportsbook for US-based Members.

The recent changes will affect US Members who have been playing MANSION Casino Games and working towards their Casino bonus being paid out.

We request that all US players who have a Casino bonus contact Member Services and have their bonus entitlement exchanged into cash to use in MANSION Poker, where they can continue to earn MANSION Club Points, participate in daily qualification tournaments for major televised events, and take advantage of frequent guaranteed and add-on tournaments worth thousands of dollars each week.

Alternatively, our US Members can simply choose to withdraw the cash.

We are committed to minimising the affect of these changes on our US-based members both in the immediate and longer terms and ensuring our Members worldwide remain well informed of future developments as they unfold.

Contact Members Services via email or online at chat:
Email: customerservice@mansion.com
Representatives are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.

Member Service Specialists are available to answer your enquiries in English.
Phone calls to MANSION may be recorded for customer protection and quality assurance.

 

[KSOT]

Well I don't play much poker, so that's pretty much out of the question.

I hope I understood your post right, meaning I can convert what I've cleared so far to cash and withdraw it. I spoke to live chat just now and linked them to your post. They said they would refer it to their poker department (lord knows why) and get back to me in 24 hours. I will let you all know...

 

[KSOT]

All this effort and absolutely nothing has been accomplished. Here's the very personal and not at all repetitive reply they finally sent me today.



Hello CzarChasm

Thank you for your email regarding your MANSION account.

We regret that we have currently suspended access to MANSION Sportsbook and Casino for US-based Members for business reasons.

MANSION’s world leading player-to-player Exchange and Poker platforms that allow you to bet against other MANSION Members on Poker and all of your favourite sports and major events remain unaffected by recent events

Should you have an outstanding bonus balance in the Casino this can be exchanged for cash for use in MANSION Poker or the MANSION player-to-player Exchange.

Please note, however, that if the wagering requirements have not been met and no bonus released to your account it is not possible to claim part of the bonus in Casino.

You may, however, continue to play the requirements of your bonus through MANSION Poker.



I don't even understand what they mean. First they say I CAN exchange my bonus balance to cash, then they say I CAN'T get the bonus if the WR hasn't been met. Needless to say, nothing in my actual account has been changed and as stated, I can't play poker. I am out of ideas and sick and tired of form replys. Please help me casinomeister!

 

[KSOT]

I just spoke to live chat to try and figure out what they were saying.



MANSION Andy:
how can I help?

CzarChasm:
hi, im consufed about an email i got from you regarding my casino bonus

CzarChasm:
one paragraph states: Should you have an outstanding bonus balance in
the Casino this can be exchanged for cash for use in MANSION Poker or
the MANSION player-to-player Exchange.

CzarChasm:
and the next states: Please note, however, that if the wagering
requirements have not been met and no bonus released to your
account it is not possible to claim part of the bonus in Casino.

CzarChasm:
so which one is it?

CzarChasm:
wouldnt all outstanding bonus balances have unmet wagering
requirements? isnt that the only reason a bonus balance would be outstanding?

MANSION Andy:
The first paragraph refers to bonuses which have been earned by meeting
the wagering requirements. Once the bonus has been released to your
account it must be turned over once more before it can be withdrawn; if
this is the situation you are in then the bonus balance can be exchanged
for the full cash amount. However, if you have not met the wagering
requirements and your bonus has not been released to your account it is
not possible to claim any cash for a 'part' bonus

CzarChasm:
ohhh

CzarChasm:
so were back to square 1, alright, thank you



So it's the same old story... they refuse to make good on the half bonus I've earned. The casino rep here didn't even address my specific problem.

 

[The Dude]

I'm checking into this right now to see if I can get you a personal response. Thanks for your patience.

 

[soflat]

Luckily for me you're the only one who feels that way so far.

Maybe he was just the only one who posted it.

You didn't earn the bonus and Mansion seems to be giving you the chance to earn it playing poker. That sounds fair. Good for them.

Afterall, you were grinding it out playing safe small bets at keno. Poker offers pretty much the same sort of grind-it-out slowly type of game you seem to favor.

 

[KSOT]

Except that I barely ever win at poker. I'd certainly lose more at it than I would playing Keno. If I thought I might have to clear this bonus with a billion hours of poker, I'd never have signed up for it. We can't all be card sharks.

 

[Tagdog]

The OP signed up to specific terms and conditions, the casino can't honour this, not due to the OPs fault, but due to a law change. I assume Mansion knew about the ports bill going, previous to it passing so knew there might be an issue with players bonuses and hence I believe the responsibilty lies more with them than the player.

If the player is unwilling to play poker he shouldn't be forced to to get his $700 worth of equity back playing it. There really shouldn't be any trouble at all for mansion to convert his bonus equity into cash and allow him to withdraw. What are they trying to prove by not granting this request?

 

[KSOT]

Been a while. Still no word from them CM?

 

[The Dude]

This should have been taken care of ASAP. Do you mean to tell me the rep never got back to you on this?

 

[KSOT]

Indeed sir. No contact from the rep here since his first reply in this thread. I did get an email from Sarah McLean on the 3rd of November, essentially repeating what has already been said about this a million times. I can post it here if you'd like, but it's really nothing new. Still no progress on this front =/

 

[The Dude]

This was forwarded to me:

You are right that he has gone around in circles a bit and I will write to him personally to address that. Unfortunately at this time though I am not willing to change our position on his request. We regret that we have had to suspend Casino from US play at this time, but circumstances were clearly beyond our control.

This player in particular has currently met a little less than 50% of his wagering requirement to release USD1,000 bonus. Thus at this time, if should choose to play poker, he would be able to release half his bonus through Poker and at that time the balance would automatically release from Casino. This happens because the outstanding bonus would reduce to a level where his current Casino turnover would meet the wagering requirement for the balance of the bonus.

My response to him will include our commitment that should he release USD520 of bonus through Poker, I will immediately convert the remaining USD480 bonus to cash and he will be free to withdraw with no restrictions.

Yours Sincerely,

David Knipe

 

[vinylweatherman]

Crap, Rubbish, BS, Jobsworth, etc.

What rubbish,
It is NOT illegal as yet for US players to gamble online, it is only illiegal for financial institutions to assist in making deposits, and the rules for enforcing this have not yet been finalised.

To say that top level management cannot be flexible when unexpected circumstances lead them to breach their side of a contract is total BS. When players breach their side, even if it is circumstances beyond their control, casino operators will often throw the proverbial book at them.
If the player has released half the bonus, he should receive half, as the casino did not give fair notice of the change, but closed accounts overnight - itself not necessary as there would be no danger of action had they allowed the rest of the month for US players to pull out of gaming gracefully.

What about other players that casinos currently accept. I don't expect the US to be the only country to bring in a ban, especially as the US situation has shown that it might actually work! We can be assured that if our own countries were to make a similar move (granted, unlikely here in the EU), we also would find ourselves out on a limb, and out of pocket too.

Since it seems OK for the player to continue to play poker, surely the released portion of bonus could be placed as cash in the poker account, and the player can immediately withdraw this, and play poker for the remaining half or simply call it a day.

I also have an account at Mansion, but it is dormant because of recent problems posted here on the forum, and I was waiting for signs that players were at least able to get something meaningful done about it. My main concern was the hoops that Mansion keep putting in place to make life harder than it should be for the player, such as this idea that they have to contact support to tell them that they want their funds "promoted" so that they can withdraw everything after wagering the bonus once, but if they miss this obscure step and just wager once the bonus, they lose the ability to ever withdraw it (I would have walked straight into that one myself had I made my second deposit).

 

[KSOT]

So they're not going to change their position and I still have to play a game I suck at and didn't sign up for to finish off my WR and recoup my losses?

Is that acceptable to you CM? I had assumed it wasn't since you have been making an attempt to help me out. If it was I figured you'd have told me to suck it up a while ago.

Either way thanks for your ongoing assistance. I truly appreciate it.

 

[winbig]

So they're not going to change their position and I still have to play a game I suck at and didn't sign up for to finish off my WR and recoup my losses?

Is that acceptable to you CM? I had assumed it wasn't since you have been making an attempt to help me out. If it was I figured you'd have told me to suck it up a while ago.

Either way thanks for your ongoing assistance. I truly appreciate it.

The way I understood Bryan's last post is that they're going to give you $480 of the bonus to your casino account; which you can cashout immediately.

They're going to stick the other $520 into the poker account, so basically you're playing with free money...if you clear it, great. If not, no loss. I think this is a great move on their part, as they're allowing you to try and clear the rest of the bonus, even though it'd be by playing poker.

I'm sure other places would give you the prorated bonus, and leave it at that. This way you're basically on a freeroll with the rest of the bonus.

If you're only down $300, you're actually coming out ahead by $180 with this offer...I'd jump on it, seeing as how you were only asking for half of it ($500) to begin with.