Baptism by Fire - failed Lucky Niki had entered the flames

[EGO]

Sorry I missed the direct questions, many for me appeared to be statements and opinions
and one of the questions on the points was answered in a post by another member ( Chiya)
anyway here is an answer that hopefully covers it all..

1 All slots activity (even if the bonus balance is not showing) contributes to wagering

Please see clause 36 under Wagering Requirements in the T&C’s/ Bonus Policy which states …
36.1 Standard wagering: bets placed in any game except Slots and Scratch games do not count towards the wagering requirements.”

2) Regarding the wagering, clause 35 describes the wagering amount along with an example to avoid any kind of misunderstanding.

So to confirm, the wagering is 30X bonus+ Deposit
for example, if you deposit 10 and get a 10 bonus you will need to wager it 30X (10+10) so it means 600 in total.

3) Re the points, as you know we convert the wagering to points

This has no actual effect on wagering itself and is merely the way our system works .
In the above example where you need to do 600 wagering, in our internal system we calculate the wagering as 300 points (each EURO bet in slots is 0.5 )

So the total wagering you need to do is still 600.

 

[brianmon]

Sorry I missed the direct questions, many for me appeared to be statements and opinions
and one of the questions on the points was answered in a post by another member ( Chiya)
anyway here is an answer that hopefully covers it all..

1 All slots activity (even if the bonus balance is not showing) contributes to wagering

Please see clause 36 under Wagering Requirements in the T&C’s/ Bonus Policy which states …
36.1 Standard wagering: bets placed in any game except Slots and Scratch games do not count towards the wagering requirements.”

2) Regarding the wagering, clause 35 describes the wagering amount along with an example to avoid any kind of misunderstanding.

So to confirm, the wagering is 30X bonus+ Deposit
for example, if you deposit 10 and get a 10 bonus you will need to wager it 30X (10+10) so it means 600 in total.

3) Re the points, as you know we convert the wagering to points

This has no actual effect on wagering itself and is merely the way our system works .
In the above example where you need to do 600 wagering, in our internal system we calculate the wagering as 300 points (each EURO bet in slots is 0.5 )

So the total wagering you need to do is still 600.

So if someone deposited 10 and got a bonus of 10, and then opened up 'Bonanza' (which apparently is one of the games which doesn't show the bonus balance)
The balance would show as 10. So they'd only be able to play 10 on that game.
Meaning that although the cash balance of 10 is contributing to the wagering. The 10 bonus is unplayable on that game.


And thank you for clearing up the other items

 

[EGO]

yes correct

So if someone deposited 10 and got a bonus of 10, and then opened up 'Bonanza' (which apparently is one of the games which doesn't show the bonus balance)
The balance would show as 10. So they'd only be able to play 10 on that game.
Meaning that although the cash balance of 10 is contributing to the wagering. The 10 bonus is unplayable on that game.


And thank you for clearing up the other items

 

[Tirilej]

Thanks for responding Krystal

Then the only thing that's missing is the answer why there seem to be no one working in support most times?
I saw another thread yesterday also with complains about no support. Are you just having problems hiring then please tell us that, because the truth is always more acceptable than no answer at all.

 

[brianmon]

yes correct

So , like most other casinos, there are games which can't be played with bonus funds. But unlike other casinos you don't actually list those games

Therefore...
36.1 Standard wagering: bets placed in any game except Slots and Scratch games do not count towards the wagering requirements.
is incorrect since it's only bets from the cash balance which contribute

 

[EGO]

So , like most other casinos, there are games which can't be played with bonus funds. But unlike other casinos you don't actually list those games

Therefore...
36.1 Standard wagering: bets placed in any game except Slots and Scratch games do not count towards the wagering requirements.
is incorrect since it's only bets from the cash balance which contribute

in answer to your first question...
In order to tell which game is restricted or not, you open the game and you will see immediately if the bonus balance is available or not
we don't have a list but I will pass on your feedback

the second answer is...
no , what it says is that no Slots and Scratch games are restricted . So again, if you have a bonus you can play ANY game and the wagering will count towards the bonus.
in some games however , where the bonus balance is not shown , it means that you cannot use your bonus balance to play with, but any bets on those games will still count for the bonus wagering

 

[brianmon]

in answer to your first question...
In order to tell which game is restricted or not, you open the game and you will see immediately if the bonus balance is available or not
we don't have a list but I will pass on your feedback

the second answer is...
no , what it says is that no Slots and Scratch games are restricted . So again, if you have a bonus you can play ANY game and the wagering will count towards the bonus.
in some games however , where the bonus balance is not shown , it means that you cannot use your bonus balance to play with, but any bets on those games will still count for the bonus wagering

You've just contradicted yourself
if you have a bonus you can play ANY game
where the bonus balance is not shown, you cannot use your bonus balance to play with

So you can't play ANY game with bonus funds.
and not listing those exempt games, means that customers can't make an informed decision before depositing and accepting a bonus.

According to the UKGC via the CMA, any restrictions have to be listed.

 

[EGO]

Thanks for responding Krystal

Then the only thing that's missing is the answer why there seem to be no one working in support most times?
I saw another thread yesterday also with complains about no support. Are you just having problems hiring then please tell us that, because the truth is always more acceptable than no answer at all.

Hi Tirilej

A lot of people are working in Support around the clock in many languages and we try to respond as quickly as possible to all queries whether they come through chat, email or phone.
Over the past few months we have had an exceptionally high number of new members joining and this has had a toll on the waiting and response times during peak hours.
With a lot of new Staff now recruited and trained hopefully we will see these wait times come down to normal again soon

And of course , like many of the members already do , anyone here can contact me by PM if they have an urgent issue which i will escalate internally for them

 

[shadieb]

Wow! just signed up with these as Playojo WAS one of my favourite places to play, only to get an instant email saying "Due to management decision, the account you created with username XXXXX has been restricted from taking advantage of our bonuses and rewards."
I have sent them an email requesting what information they have on me to flag me like that? I have deposited a fair amount at their sister sites and have never complained despite the RTP for me over the last few months being terrible (almost questionable).

Plenty of other places to give my money to.
As far as I am concerned it is their loss not mine!

Wow! Nearly 3 days later and no response from the email I sent them. Won't be touching these with the proverbial bargepole!

 

[Casinomeister]

So... the rep has returned, answered ONE query and disappeared again. No doubt just waiting for the BBF to be completed.

@Casinomeister
The problem with a BBF for a site like this, is there are going to be very few members who will sign up to try it out.

The T&C are convoluted and because of the £1=0.5 points against the advertised wagering, basically dishonest. I'm sure the CMA and UKGC will be interested in that little gem.
Games excluded from bonus play, which aren't listed.
Vague clauses such as "Increasing the balance then changing the gaming pattern significantly (bet, game type, bet structure, etc) in order to complete the wagering requirements for that bonus." What's their idea of significantly? probably different to an average player's interpretation

The welcome (?) bonus is 25x £0.20 free spins with 60x wagering (120x with the £1=0.5 wagering points). For UK players

What incentive is there for members to give them a try?

So there'll be minimum feedback and they'll just sail through the process. Probably causing problems and PABs in the future.

Maybe there should be some kind of voting system. Not to decide whether they pass the BBF, but something to be taken into consideration, when deciding

Actually, it's posts like yours that gives us the reasoning to have these BBFs - we need honest detailed observations like yours. The last thing we want is a casino group resting on their laurels thinking that it's going to be easy peasy. Casinos should never take our player community for granted (not saying these guys are), and sometimes casinos under the same umbrella have separate management - and a proper BBF can reveal these flaws.

There are five to six times the visitors to these threads than people logged in on a daily basis. So there are loads of people reading and deciding what they want to do - perhaps they have signed up already from elsewhere - perhaps not, but these threads can be valuable for both the casino and the player community even if you don't see much activity.

As for the voting system, this is a possibility - but it would have to be done after the BBF time has elapsed so that the casino is fairly judged - not just during thier BBF period. Needless to say (then don't say it! ) I review these threads at the end of the BBF period and come to a decision. Most of the time asking for naysayers to chime in unless it has been a stellar BBF. This one....eh, not so much.

Wow! Nearly 3 days later and no response from the email I sent them. Won't be touching these with the proverbial bargepole!

@Krystal_EGO - could you please look into shadieb's email situation? Thanks!

 

[EGO]

Actually, it's posts like yours that gives us the reasoning to have these BBFs - we need honest detailed observations like yours. The last thing we want is a casino group resting on their laurels thinking that it's going to be easy peasy. Casinos should never take our player community for granted (not saying these guys are), and sometimes casinos under the same umbrella have separate management - and a proper BBF can reveal these flaws.

There are five to six times the visitors to these threads than people logged in on a daily basis. So there are loads of people reading and deciding what they want to do - perhaps they have signed up already from elsewhere - perhaps not, but these threads can be valuable for both the casino and the player community even if you don't see much activity.

As for the voting system, this is a possibility - but it would have to be done after the BBF time has elapsed so that the casino is fairly judged - not just during thier BBF period. Needless to say (then don't say it! ) I review these threads at the end of the BBF period and come to a decision. Most of the time asking for naysayers to chime in unless it has been a stellar BBF. This one....eh, not so much.


@Krystal_EGO - could you please look into shadieb's email situation? Thanks!

i checked shadiebs account and see he was sent a reply on 14th May

 

[brianmon]

Actually, it's posts like yours that gives us the reasoning to have these BBFs - we need honest detailed observations like yours. The last thing we want is a casino group resting on their laurels thinking that it's going to be easy peasy. Casinos should never take our player community for granted (not saying these guys are), and sometimes casinos under the same umbrella have separate management - and a proper BBF can reveal these flaws.

There are five to six times the visitors to these threads than people logged in on a daily basis. So there are loads of people reading and deciding what they want to do - perhaps they have signed up already from elsewhere - perhaps not, but these threads can be valuable for both the casino and the player community even if you don't see much activity.

As for the voting system, this is a possibility - but it would have to be done after the BBF time has elapsed so that the casino is fairly judged - not just during thier BBF period. Needless to say (then don't say it! ) I review these threads at the end of the BBF period and come to a decision. Most of the time asking for naysayers to chime in unless it has been a stellar BBF. This one....eh, not so much.


@Krystal_EGO - could you please look into shadieb's email situation? Thanks!

The main problem I have with this site is their convoluted and incomplete bonus terms.
While they have every right to include whatever (fair) terms & conditions and restrictions they feel necessary to include.
Those restriction clauses should at least be clear, and the restrictions themselves, published.

As it is, anyone taking a bonus is depositing blind.
There's no way of knowing which games you can or can't play with bonus funds, until you've actually deposited with a bonus, and opened a game to play.
It's also not particularly clear that there are any restrictions at all. The only clue being this clause..

29. Players are allowed to play in any game while having an active bonus. In certain games bonus balance funds are not available to play with and when you open those games you will only see your real balance.

The list of games may be few and consist of mainly 'the usual suspects' or it may be half their slots list.
I suspect the latter, hence their reluctance to publish it.

I'm pretty sure this would not pass the scrutiny of the CMA or UKGC, should it be brought to their attention.

P.S I'm not writing this for any personal gain or grudge, since I have no intention of signing up to this site.

P.P.S. Slots Magic (CM accredited) also have an identical bonus policy. Although this probably changed, some time after accreditation.

 

[EGO]

Let me explain about the listing of games


We have over 1500 slots of which only a small proportion cannot be played with a bonus balance. There are 109 games currently which you cannot play with bonus funds so around 7%.

I have answered this in a previous post but it’s important to stress again that while you have active bonus you are still allowed to play ANY of the games with no restrictions other then you need to use your real money balance, so only with around 7% of the games you will not be able to play with bonus balance.

However, and this is the key point , the wagering in these games still counts and when playing these games you can still redeem the bonus. And once the bonus is redeemed you can then play it on any game.

The problem with this small list of games is that it’s not static. We actually did list all the games in our T&C’s in the past which put the responsibility on each user to have to check our terms before they played any game and this caused a lot of issues and complaints. So we moved to a system that is much clearer to players and carries no risk for them to be in breach of the bonus terms.

Now any player can see which game they cannot play with their bonus balance when they open the game and are not forced to go to the T&C’s to check.

We feel this is a much better, safer and user friendly system

 

[brianmon]

Let me explain about the listing of games

We have over 1500 slots of which only a small proportion cannot be played with a bonus balance. There are 109 games currently which you cannot play with bonus funds so around 7%.

Well a list of 109 games is probably one of the biggest list of restricted games of any casino.
So no wonder you prefer to keep it hidden.

But the point is that, (AFAIK) the latest UKGC guidelines state that "Gambling firms must ensure that any restrictions on gameplay are made clear to players"

The problem with this small list of games is that it’s not static. We actually did list all the games in our T&C’s in the past which put the responsibility on each user to have to check our terms before they played any game and this caused a lot of issues and complaints. So we moved to a system that is much clearer to players and carries no risk for them to be in breach of the bonus terms.

Now any player can see which game they cannot play with their bonus balance when they open the game and are not forced to go to the T&C’s to check.

We feel this is a much better, safer and user friendly system

Very commendable, as are all the other casinos who operate this way.
Except the other casinos list the restricted games as well as blocking the bonus balance.

Therefore a player can make an INFORMED decision BEFORE depositing with a bonus.

 

[EGO]

Thanks for your comments we will take them all under advisement

 

[EGO]

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The Tournament will be Live in the casino tomorrow so please check the Tournament T&C's

 

[theapple]

Let me explain about the listing of games


We have over 1500 slots of which only a small proportion cannot be played with a bonus balance. There are 109 games currently which you cannot play with bonus funds so around 7%.

I have answered this in a previous post but it’s important to stress again that while you have active bonus you are still allowed to play ANY of the games with no restrictions other then you need to use your real money balance, so only with around 7% of the games you will not be able to play with bonus balance.

However, and this is the key point , the wagering in these games still counts and when playing these games you can still redeem the bonus. And once the bonus is redeemed you can then play it on any game.

The problem with this small list of games is that it’s not static. We actually did list all the games in our T&C’s in the past which put the responsibility on each user to have to check our terms before they played any game and this caused a lot of issues and complaints. So we moved to a system that is much clearer to players and carries no risk for them to be in breach of the bonus terms.

Now any player can see which game they cannot play with their bonus balance when they open the game and are not forced to go to the T&C’s to check.

We feel this is a much better, safer and user friendly system

There are other sites that block you from playing restricted games with a bonus. On the other hand, there are no other sites that have a hidden, non fixed list of 109 slots. Since its not static, for all we know it might be 129 now. or 9. But we dont know that.

You said you had a list before. Is there something stopping you from having both list and restriction on bonus balance. Im sure this wont come as a surprise to you but there are people who wouldnt mind knowing which slots are restricted from bonus play, before they sign up and deposit at your place.

And saying you have "only" 109 blocked slots is quite frankly ridiculous. Ill copy what i think is the longest list of restricted slots ive seen anywhere

The following games are restricted until wager requirements have been met :
Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde
Lucky Angler
Aliens
Eye of Kraken
Holly Jolly Penguins
Big Bang
The Wish Master
Devil’s Delight
Robin Hood
Tomb Raider 2
Tornado: Farm Escape
1429 Uncharted Seas
Jackpot Jester 6000
Jackpot Jester
Wild Nudge
Super Monopoly Money
Thunderstruck I
Kings of Chicago
Tower Quest
Vikings Go Berzerk
Joker Millions
Holmes and the Stolen Stones
Seasons
Alchymedes
Double Dragons
Seasons
Legend of the White Snake Lady
Nirvana Castle Builder II
Immortal Romance
300 Shields (NYX Gaming)
Jurassic Park
Football star
Big Bad Wolf (Microgaming)
Dragon Born
Vikings go Wild
Gold
White Rabbit
Jungle Spirit: Call of the Wild
Ozwin’s Jackpots
Break da Bank
Break Da Bank Again.

The following games only contribute 50% towards the wager requirements:
Piggy Riches
Zombies
Jack Hammer 2
Steam Tower
Muse: Wild inspiration
Victorious
Ghost Pirates
High Society
Flowers
Flowers Christmas Edition
Twin Spin
Twin Spin Deluxe
Bloodsuckers
Bloodsuckers II
Spiña Colada
Dead or Alive
Dead or Alive Touch
Reel Rush
Bonanza
Danger! High Voltage
Queen of Riches
Star Quest
Energoonz
Reactoonz

Thats quite a big list no? And thats only 42 completely restricted and 23 slots that contribute 50%. As doa is there twice. So that huge list has 65 slots only. Your list is almost twice as big. Just thought about adding some outside perspective to your "only 109" slots list :=)

 

[EGO]

Thanks for your feedback, as I said above every bet still counts towards the wagering and the amount of games is quite small compared to the total number of games we offer
And to repeat, many of our members expressed their view it was better to have it automated instead of having to keep checking the list in the t&cs
As mentioned before we are considering all the suggestions posted and will take steps to hopefully make it clearer in the future

 

[robby811]

I joined and deposited 2 times last week and then i should be get 5 days Freebies in a row , from which 1 days i get 5FS 1 day 1 Superspin was ok.... and the other days you offer me Deposit Bonuses and One day the Freebee was just not available for 24H

I expected something like 5 DAYS FREESPINS -.- deposit bonus is not a freebie for me

Was also not reg. via the aff casinomeister link but that should not madders from the Welcome Offer 5Days freebie


I also uploaded my Documents straight after Depsoit , and from that i get no Information or Feedback

 

[EGO]

I joined and deposited 2 times last week and then i should be get 5 days Freebies in a row , from which 1 days i get 5FS 1 day 1 Superspin was ok.... and the other days you offer me Deposit Bonuses and One day the Freebee was just not available for 24H

I expected something like 5 DAYS FREESPINS -.- deposit bonus is not a freebie for me

Was also not reg. via the aff casinomeister link but that should not madders from the Welcome Offer 5Days freebie


I also uploaded my Documents straight after Depsoit , and from that i get no Information or Feedback

Robby can you PM me your username and i will check for you

 

[robby811]

sure pm send in 1min

 

[brianmon]

Thanks for your feedback, as I said above every bet still counts towards the wagering and the amount of games is quite small compared to the total number of games we offer
And to repeat, many of our members expressed their view it was better to have it automated instead of having to keep checking the list in the t&cs
As mentioned before we are considering all the suggestions posted and will take steps to hopefully make it clearer in the future

Correction:
Every CASH bet still counts towards the wagering.

 

[theapple]

Thanks for your feedback, as I said above every bet still counts towards the wagering and the amount of games is quite small compared to the total number of games we offer
And to repeat, many of our members expressed their view it was better to have it automated instead of having to keep checking the list in the t&cs
As mentioned before we are considering all the suggestions posted and will take steps to hopefully make it clearer in the future

compared to what? nobody plays 1500 slots. Other sites have well over 2000 slots but theres a few dozens of most popular slots that everyone plays. I personally change slots often but i dont think i have more than 100 slots in my rotation. Probably not even close to that number.

So obviously much more important info is whats on the list and not how many slots are on that list. If you have 109 GvG games, i couldnt care less about it. But if your 109 slots list consists of slots like IR, Bonanza, DoA, BoD and generally speaking, good slots, it restricts way more than 7% playable slots. I suspect how in my case it would restrict at least 50% of slots i play, probably even more. But once again there is no way of knowing that unless i make a deposit and go in blind.

You keep on saying how you are considering suggestions, which pretty much means you are "considering doing something that every other casino out there is already doing". And yet, for some reason known only to your casino network, you think people are much better off now knowing which slots they cant play with bonus money, as if having a list would kill all the suspense or something

basically your current system works on "Deposit and find out" basis and you are telling us how thats better for players, because... many of your members wanted to get rid of the list because its harmful and it confuses them? Seriously?

 

[robby811]

My Documents are now finally approved after 2-3 weeks thx rep.

 

[zap987]

Did they stop doing weekend cashouts? Got a withdrawal pending on both Lucky Niki and Drueckgluck since 35 and 40 hours.