Looking for someones help and expertise

kombucha

Dormant account
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Location
nethherlands
Hi,

I'm looking for someone to help me concerning a big amount i have won ( 37k - jackpot ) but only got paid a 5k cap. I don't feel like to PAB yet because we're still on speaking terms and don't feel like mentioning the casino's name . i think i'm in my rights here. ( as how far your rights go at the casino world obv, lol.. ) Ofcourse they feel the same. Well i don't want to go in further details ( pm me ) but if you think you can really help and it pays of i'm obv willing to give you a percentage..

let me know :)



p.s. this site is or was on roque list but made some good steps forward the last few years, never had probs with them before i'm even a vip :/ also i never had friends complaining about a withdraw.. ( although that prob wasn't 37 k hehe )

sorry for the poor english :/
- bucha
 

refre

Senior lurker
PABnonaccred
PABnoaccred
Joined
Jun 13, 2003
Location
.
Hi there :)

Why is it they only paid you $5K of your winnings?
Did you take some kind of max cashout bonus?
If so, I guess they are only following their rules.

Or was this a system wide progressive JP?
Then all of your winnings should be paid in one lump sum.

Anyways, you may want to file a complaint or PAB here at Casinomeister.
Start here: http://www.casinomeister.com/problems.php
Remember to read (all) the rules! At least twice ;)

If you decide to go the PAB route, you should stop posting on this matter alltogether.

Edit: Before filing a PAB, you should discuss your case with the casino rep here at CM, if there is one.
List of reps: http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/showroster.php

Good luck!!


Freddy
 

kombucha

Dormant account
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Location
nethherlands
hey freddie,

thx for the reply :)

at this particular casino you always get some bonus ... i once asked if they could not give me one and they said no.

in the terms stated it says max 5k withdraw when using a dp bonus but exceptions are made for special cases like vip - that example was made by support btw...

it was the multi level marvel bonus, super hero..

i know the same jp runs on diff casinos so i also asked where the rest goes when taken of my acount.the manager told me she did not know it s a playtech thing she said?:s
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
hey freddie,

thx for the reply :)

at this particular casino you always get some bonus ... i once asked if they could not give me one and they said no.
in the terms stated it says max 5k withdraw when using a dp bonus but exceptions are made for special cases like vip - that example was made by support btw...

it was the multi level marvel bonus, super hero..

i know the same jp runs on diff casinos so i also asked where the rest goes when taken of my acount.the manager told me she did not know it s a playtech thing she said?:s

It seems to be a term that there is a 5K max cashout, so there is no way to receive the rest within the terms.

It also seems rogue that you are FORCED to take these bonuses, even though it means NEVER being able to keep much of a big jackpot.

THIS is where things start to look shady. The Joyland casino case was where Playtech forwarded the full $4million to the casino, but the casino told the player she could ONLY have it paid at the max weekly amount for "normal" withdrawals. This would have taken over 30 YEARS to be paid, so the player was more or less bullied into accepting half straight away as a settlement. The remaining $2million was NEVER returned to Playtech and the network pool, it was pocketed by the CASINO. When William Hill took over, there was no sign of this extra $2million - it had simply vanished!

It seems THIS casino has constructed a set of rules intended to cream off most of EVERY large jackpot won by it's players by limiting cash-ins to $5K. No doubt, where these are Network pools paid over in full by Playtech to the operator, the surplus above 5K is pure profit, kept by the casino.

the manager told me she did not know it s a playtech thing she said

Sure you don't:rolleyes:

As per Joyland case, once Playtech hand over the pool, it is down to the operator. Playtech do not concern themselves with how the operator hands it on to the player. Joyland skimmed off $2million, and Playtech did nothing - even when they were told. Playtech certainly do NOT enforce the principle that the money should go to the player IN FULL.

The easiest way to verify this is to load the slot occasionally, and check for the surplus above $5K being placed back into the pool. It'll be a long wait:p

PAB probably won't help, since this is all in the terms and conditions. Confirm the situation with Max, and if he agrees that a PAB cannot go ahead, name & shame the casino group involved with this sharp practice so that the rest of us can be warned, and check the facts independently (such as can you refuse a bonus or not).
 

refre

Senior lurker
PABnonaccred
PABnoaccred
Joined
Jun 13, 2003
Location
.
I think I have found the casino in question.
Basically they issue a small bonus on every deposit, ask you to wager it a ridiculous amount of times, then limit any winnings to 5000.
As far as I can see they offer all the Playtech progressives.
They say it's a "Playtech thing".. IT'S NOT!!

The JP doesn't care where the money came from. A small percentage of each bet goes into the pool no matter what. This is probably why many casinos limit progressive play on bonuses, as they will have to pay even if the player busts out. Theres no reason for money to be paid back into the pool, as the "lottery ticket" was paid for. If the player doesn't get, I wonder who does...


Freddy
 

kombucha

Dormant account
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Location
nethherlands
just changed my email and such.. i just realized that we're talking bout alot of cheese.. hehe

btw I think you do have the right one in mind freddy ;)

..yeah i first asked chat support and i asked the girl: what happends with the money that got voided, does it go back in to the JP? and she ofcourse told me "yes i think thats the case" hehe :/

the casino rep said that playtech handles the linked jackpots. i find this all very dodgy ass well obv..

so should i PAB? do i stand a change?

p.s.. i got a pm message that suddenly dissapeared?
 

refre

Senior lurker
PABnonaccred
PABnoaccred
Joined
Jun 13, 2003
Location
.
If the casino returns the money to the JP pool, they are doing it out of the kindness of their hearts... as you, the player, already paid for the bet!

Of course Playtech handles linked jackpots. I'd just hope they handle it better. They should make sure, in every case, that the player receives every last penny of their winnings. The casinos (cept for the few here at CM), clearly can't be trusted with this.

I suggest you submit a PAB. It may be recjected, but I'd say it's your best chance at this point!

Edit: PMs should be listed here: http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/private.php


Freddy


just changed my email and such.. i just realized that we're talking bout alot of cheese.. hehe

btw I think you do have the right one in mind freddy ;)

..yeah i first asked chat support and i asked the girl: what happends with the money that got voided, does it go back in to the JP? and she ofcourse told me "yes i think thats the case" hehe :/

the casino rep said that playtech handles the linked jackpots. i find this all very dodgy ass well obv..

so should i PAB? do i stand a change?

p.s.. i got a pm message that suddenly dissapeared?
 

kombucha

Dormant account
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Location
nethherlands
Fr.

You're right about PT, although i do think they must be watching their acounts... i mean money getting voided and dissapears into thin air..? that sounds like a big millionaires fraud scheme. I would not like to be the company who provides that option if you know what i mean...

well PAB it is then.. :)
i'll let you know

thx :)
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
just changed my email and such.. i just realized that we're talking bout alot of cheese.. hehe

btw I think you do have the right one in mind freddy ;)

..yeah i first asked chat support and i asked the girl: what happends with the money that got voided, does it go back in to the JP? and she ofcourse told me "yes i think thats the case" hehe :/

the casino rep said that playtech handles the linked jackpots. i find this all very dodgy ass well obv..

so should i PAB? do i stand a change?
p.s.. i got a pm message that suddenly dissapeared?

I doubt it. This is a rogue TERM, rather than a rogue "act". They have DESIGNED this into the system, and this has become even CLEARER now.

Basically they issue a small bonus on every deposit, ask you to wager it a ridiculous amount of times, then limit any winnings to 5000.

EVERY time a player who wins a network progressive is restricted by this rule the casino profits by keeping the surplus above $5000 handed to them by Playtech. This means the casino is STEALING from other players elsewhere in the Playtech network who have contributed to the pool in the belief that it all goes to a player. This is considered quite SERIOUS roguery among players, and other casinos that appeared to have pocketed money from pooled progressives have had a VERY rough ride indeed!

This merits further investigation leading to concrete evidence of progressive pool monies being forefeit to the $5000 rule, and kept by this casino, rather than being returned to the pool.

This question arose with RTG and the random jackpots, and we have been assured by the reputable operators that when an RJ is won by a player using a max cashout bonus, any surplus that is not paid out to the player due to this rule goes back into the RJ pot.

Since this is all in the terms, the casino has kept within the published rules, so the best you could hope for is getting them rogued for stealing pooled money intended for players through misuse of the terms. Although the term stands, the unused pool money should be returned so that it can be won by other players. This is especially important for a NETWORK progressive, where the contributions are coming from unrelated Playtech casinos, who's players would not know that some casinos are pocketing the difference between the jackpot and a operator level max cashout rule.

It is rather telling that this is a DEPOSIT bonus, and a SMALL one too, yet saddles players with a $5000 max cashout that prohibits them from keeping the lion's share of ANY progressive jackpot. A further sign of roguery is that the casino INSISTS that players take these small bonuses so that they CAN apply this rule.

Such a casino doesn't deserve players, and should be avoided by any player who wants to keep a big win.

Ask Max whether there is any chance of a PAB to get this rogue term removed, but I doubt it - the whole thing seems designed by intent, rather than being an unintended consequence of bonus rules.

Without knowing the name of the casino, I cannot be more precisely scathing in my opinion of yet another Playtech casino "pulling a stunt" on the player community, other than to say that incidents like this, going unchallenged by Playtech themselves, have left me with a VERY low opinion of Playtech as a brand.
 

Jasminebed

Game old gal
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Location
Ontario
There are several reputable and accredited Playtech casinos here, and they all pay network progressives in full.

It took me a long time to join any Playtech because of reports of such scams, and it would be good if the reputable companies brought pressure on Playtech to pay large progressives directly to players.

The Marvel Jackpot slots are some of the most fun on Playtech, and it really burns me to think this scam casino is keeping money from a pool I've contributed to.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
There are several reputable and accredited Playtech casinos here, and they all pay network progressives in full.

It took me a long time to join any Playtech because of reports of such scams, and it would be good if the reputable companies brought pressure on Playtech to pay large progressives directly to players.

The Marvel Jackpot slots are some of the most fun on Playtech, and it really burns me to think this scam casino is keeping money from a pool I've contributed to.

EXACTLY!

The REPUTABLE ones WILL pay a progressive in full, just as Playtech have forwarded it to them. Unfortunately, it seems many Playtech operators have devised ways and means to skim money from these progressives in transit. the more usual method is to receive the money up front from Playtech, but pass it on to the player subject to the max weekly limits. This gives the casino the INTEREST on that money, when this belongs to the PLAYER that won it.
Joyland devised a deal where it kept half, and gave the other half to the player as a final settlement. This was a pretty good deal for them, and the player really didn't have much of a choice because it would have needed the casino to stay in business a further 15 years just to get the half she ended up with, and 30 years to get it all. In the event, Joyland lasted a further six MONTHS before being bought by William Hill, and in that 6 months, the other half of $2million simply disappeared from the books. Clearly, it was kept by the former owners, rather than forming part of the assets handed over in the sale.
Playtech sat by and did NOTHING about this, but it certainly KNEW this kind of thing was going on with SOME operators, even though not ALL of them.

Playtech took the view that it "only supplies the software", and that it's responsibility for network jackpots ends when the funds are passed to the operator. How that operator pays (or doesn't pay) the player is a matter for the operator, not Playtech.
 

kombucha

Dormant account
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Location
nethherlands
Alas... This is still going btw, i had some legal help and i have given them till friday ( this week ) to pay me otherwise i am making it public and i will take further steps.

obv i won't let it rest.. :)
 

3mptyseat

Quit Gambling
PABnonaccred
Joined
May 22, 2010
Location
California de Norte
Alas... This is still going btw, i had some legal help and i have given them till friday ( this week ) to pay me otherwise i am making it public and i will take further steps.

obv i won't let it rest.. :)

You said they are rogued or were rogued? Either way, good luck with the ultimatum. My guess is that they are gonna keep the 'skimmed' amount and deal with whatever fallout it causes; but I hope thats not the case...

I just can't imagine how playtech and any other software provider in similar circumstances could remain 'eyes wide shut' and plain ignore the bad 'branding' this and other blunders cause... I also don't understand how they can be so smug and deny less-than-legal geographical areas from access to their service while permitting their licensees to steal from clients in areas that fall inside of regulated jurisdictions... One seems to be much worse than the other in my mind. So it goes...
 
Last edited:

Temperance Fox

New Member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Aug 22, 2010
Location
Nowhere
I think it could be usefull for us to know the end of the story.Don't you?
 
Top