1. By continuing to use the site, you agree to the use of cookies .This website or its third-party tools use cookies, which are necessary to its functioning and required to achieve the purposes illustrated in the cookie policy.Find out more.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Dismiss Notice
  3. Follow Casinomeister on Twitter | Facebook | YouTube | Casinomeister.us US Residents Click here! |  Svenska Svenska | 
Dismiss Notice

Poll:Best Screenshot of the Month?



Candidates Revealed...Cast your vote!.
Dismiss Notice
REGISTER NOW!! Why? Because you can't do diddly squat without having been registered!

At the moment you have limited access to view most discussions: you can't make contact with thousands of fellow players, affiliates, casino reps, and all sorts of other riff-raff.

Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join Casinomeister here!

Last straw GrandPrive!

Discussion in 'Casino Complaints - Non-Bonus Issues' started by footdr, Aug 18, 2008.

    Aug 18, 2008
  1. footdr

    footdr Banned User: PITA violations of the Forum Rules

    Occupation:
    management
    Location:
    cyberspace
    Played at Grand Prive casinos 4 years. I am KING VIP level. So What! I have never received the special promotions they say you will get. I don't even receive promotional emails and have always had to call support to redeem weekend bonuses.

    I called today after depositing $100.00 and was told
    "YOU are no longer on the promotional list as your bonuses equal 40% of your deposits."

    I don't know what equation they are using but my payout percentage for this year, across all their casinos is approx 20%. So in other words I have lost atleast 80% of all deposits and bonuses. There analysis must be for a very short perior of time.

    It is true I have not been playing their casinos much this year because I didn't like that after reaching KING level I recieved no VIP treatment at all.
    I couldn't seem to win to save my life. And, they just don't seem to care about their loyal players, giving you a hassle over bonuses under $10.00, delaying withdrawals, etc.

    This was the last straw. Deleted all their casinos! What a crock of SH....T!

    Lost thousands over 4 years and I am not even allowed the weekend promotions that NEW Players receive. Screw that. I will take my play elsewhere.
     
  2. Aug 18, 2008
  3. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    They reveal their secret formula at last:D

    The terms say no such thing, all that is required is a small deposit between each bonused deposit.

    Now I wonder what other "secret formulae" they use.

    If this is automated, then surely you can just deposit a sum, wager it 1x or so, and withdraw, and get the ratio back below 40%, and then hit only the best bonuses.

    If I had known of this formula, I would have made a spreadsheet to work out where my ratio was. Casino Action had a similar formula, but at least allowed some leeway for their top VIP players.

    Maybe I should ask them what MY ratio is, and see if this holds up to greater than 40%.
     
  4. Aug 18, 2008
  5. Mousey

    Mousey Ueber Meister Mouse CAG

    Occupation:
    Pencil Pusher
    Location:
    Up$hitCreek
    GP took me off their promo list a couple of years ago. And even though a couple of affiliates have contacted GP on my behalf, no can do, they say I've got make a 'few' more deposits. Horsehockey. That's means I can't play the (former EZBoard) affiliates games (deposit and enter a contest) because I can never receive the bonus should I win. There is a bonus to deposit to withdrawal ratio that GP hold sacred -- even though their website states a $20 (or similar) deposit requirement between accepting their promos. They just won't let you have anymore promos till the 'golden mean' is achieved....
     
  6. Aug 19, 2008
  7. sublime9

    sublime9 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    California
    Yep me too, Im a "KING" VIP level, but once I reached that level last year they stopped sending me promo emails. I dont play there anymore, they used to be my favourite MG group.
     
  8. Aug 19, 2008
  9. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Do you know more about this "sacred formula" than the 40% bonus on deposit ratio?

    I briefly got back on their list after claiming a no-deposit code from their quarterly magazine, followed by a 100% match to 200. Even though I deposited further without bonuses (and 50, more than the 20 asked between bonuses), I probably exceeded the 40% ratio due to NOT taking the 25% bonuses.
    I suspect the key to their formula is whether players take just the 100% (and maybe the 50%) bounses, or whether they also take the far larger (in deposit terms) 25% bonuses. Taking the 25% offer would keep the overall ratio below 40%, but taking only the 50% and 100% offers keeps the ratio above 40%. It seems they allow this for three months, and then start cutting players from the promo lists.
    What is annoying is that they do this in secret, and make far more generous "promises" on their website and terms, only to "bait & switch" to the "secret formula" later on, even when the player has LOST A FORTUNE to them:mad:
     
  10. Aug 19, 2008
  11. Mousey

    Mousey Ueber Meister Mouse CAG

    Occupation:
    Pencil Pusher
    Location:
    Up$hitCreek
    The only way I even learned of the 'formula' was from an affiliate who posted on an EZBoard forum a couple of years ago when so many of us were cut off without notice. (Remember the Xmas brou-ha-ha ... maybe 2 or 3 years ago? This was soon after the NETeller 'glich' --:rolleyes:-- which blocked certain players from depositing) Players were in an uproar, bonuses promised were eventually honored, but we were then cut off.

    Anyway, that affiliate finally got the formula from her contacts. Unfortunately, I no longer have it, and cannot remember it. The forum is now defunct. At any rate, it has probably changed a great deal since that time. I DO remember that, at the time, the formula included the 3 things -- bonus to deposit to withdrawal.
     
  12. Aug 20, 2008
  13. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    That Neteller episode was interesting. Since they are eCogra certified, I would have thought that if there was anything sinister behind this "glitch", then eCogra would take sanctions, after all, they have to act in a fair and honest manner. This would mean being up front with players who were bonus banned, and not create some software glitch and then blame unknown technical failures for the problems. I suspect even Neteller got blamed for it, as well as Microgaming themselves.

    Affiliates should be annoyed too, as if they send players to Grand Privvy, and these players get cut off, it means the affiliate loses the income stream, as well as being considered by those same players as "shady" for promoting such a poor casino group.

    Since I got cut off after a cashout, I suspect the current formula is only calculated on a cashout, and that so long as a player is only depositing, they can still run above this 40% ratio. I was well above it after the 100 free and 100% to 200. I was offered further boni UNTIL I deposited WITHOUT A BLEEDIN' BONUS, and cashed out 600. Only then did the calculation seem to resolve me as being above the 40% ratio. I later deposited another 100 and lost it to see if that would be a factor (as in no bonuses after a cash-out), but this didn't work, so I gave up.

    I will see if I get another code with the quarterly magazine, and if it works I will calculate what my ratio is from then on, and see if I get cut off, and what triggers it.
     
  14. Aug 20, 2008
  15. footdr

    footdr Banned User: PITA violations of the Forum Rules

    Occupation:
    management
    Location:
    cyberspace
    KING LEVEL LESS PROMOTIONS

    I wouldn't play there again if they paid me to. Reaching king level was suppose to afford you perks including more promotions etc.

    I had to use bonuses when I could recently because my deposit options are very limited. Quicktender allows only 500.00/month. Grandbay stopped accepting debit .

    There are too many other casino groups that are more accomodating.
     
  16. Aug 20, 2008
  17. Zoozie

    Zoozie Ueber Meister CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    Software Developer
    Location:
    Denmark
    The 40% non-bonus deposit ratio was not entierly true for me. I played at both Big Dollar and Jupiter Club casino for almost 1 year and was banned from both at the same time (about 1.5 year ago)

    Almost every week I made a deposit with a 50% or 100% bonus. They did have some great bonuses. I only think I did two non-bonus deposits (when new games arrived). So my bonus deposit rate was 95%+ for 1 year. But it gets more interesting.

    At Big Dollar casino I suffered a severe case of bad luck during the period I was only a little above break even. At time of banning I had made 6K$ deposit and 6.5K$ withdrawls.

    At Jupiter Club I had a glitch in the MG software cash-check. I could not see any deposits or withdrawals the list was simply just empty. When I made a deposit I could see it and I could also see it when it was in pending state. However as soon as I received a withdrawal the list was cleared again...

    I do not know what happened first, but I was banned and cash-check worked again showing 6K$ deposits and 11K$ withdrawals. So maybe the small glitch was also present when casino management was reviewing my account... So my point is I think I was banned because of winning too much. Only playing with bonuses was not problem at Big Dollar casino since I was only about breaking even there.

    I always got my withdrawals fast and I never had a problem with the casino group. And since I got two bonus offers (50% and 100%) from each casino every week, I hardly had a time to make a non-bonus deposit. But I do not blame them for banning me of course. I had a great time there.

    If I remember correct they later implemented a bonus system where you could not get a bonus unless last deposit was a non-bonus deposit. So now it would be impossible for customers to have higher than 50% bonus only deposit rate.
     
  18. Aug 20, 2008
  19. Simmo!

    Simmo! Moderator Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Web Dev.
    Location:
    England
    This has nothing to do with Garnd Prive - it wasn't them, but I had an interesting conversation with someone at an MG about 12-18 months ago that is of some sort of relevance.

    Essentially, they had just done a business critique and worked out the cost-per-customer of running the casino. The highest overheads at the time were 3-fold: staff, payment processing fees and licence fees (+ progressive contributions). They worked out a value that was cost-per-player, and then set about "dissuading" players who fell below that cost from playing. They didn't ban them from what I gather, neither did they tell me what they did, and being what I term a "reputable" operator, I would guess they cut down on bonus offers, promotions and stuff like that.

    No idea if it was successful in achieving it's goals, or what the impact was. All I remember is being surprised how low the actual profit margin was when all the fees and staff costs were added up.

    Anyway, just thought I'd throw that into the mix :D
     
    3 people like this.
  20. Aug 22, 2008
  21. footdr

    footdr Banned User: PITA violations of the Forum Rules

    Occupation:
    management
    Location:
    cyberspace
    I HAVE LITERALLY LOST A FORTUNE

    Grandprive promotes their loyalty program as being something special. It takes alot of money and alot of play to reach KING level; at least in my case.

    I have played in several of their big promotions, I have only taken the bonus offered on the weekends, and have not received it every weekend.

    To take away the ONLY bonus I have been afforded for being a loyal player is an slap in the face. They might as well have said "we don't care if you play our casinos anymore"

    Plus, when I told them I was not going to play GrandPrive due to this the reply was "once you deposit more you will get promotions again" !

    F...k that !! Other casinos reward your play and even throw you a bonus when you way down.

    This is the second Microgaming group I have dropped, the first one was 8 months ago and they have never even emailed to ask why I stopped playing.
    Mind you I played there several 2-4 times a week at most all their casinos.
    They didn't seem to care I was gone. I will play where they want my business and reward me for play!!!
     
  22. Aug 22, 2008
  23. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    This would explain why they would want to disuade advantage players from playing, but why get rid of a player who is happy to lose a fortune WITH the bonuses, as clearly these are NOT "advantage players".

    They MADE 3600 from me over 3 months, yet decided I was "not profitable" and disuaded me by removing me from their list. When they relaunched their loyalty system, my 3 months of play had already thrown me straight in at King level, for which I received F*&^ All:mad:

    It seems common sense has no place in these decisions, and that they are often getting rid of their profitable players, as well as those whose play is unlikely to cover their costs. I also wonder if players who sign up through an affiliate are at a disadvantage if such formulae are being used, as the affiliates are also being paid some 20% to 30% of that player's net monthly loss, and with no carry over when they have a winning month. 30% of hold is a big sum, and must make quite a difference when it comes to comparing the cost of a player that has come through an affiliate against the cost of a player that has come directly, or through a direct campaign, such as one of those CDs. I came to them through a CD, and not an affiliate - so I must be cheaper to run.
     
  24. Aug 22, 2008
  25. spearmaster

    spearmaster RIP Ted

    Occupation:
    Devil's Advocate
    Location:
    Heaven
    How are you able to draw this conclusion when all Simmo said was that he talked to *a* MG casino 12-18 months ago? On top of that, he said it wasn't Grand Prive... :what:
     
  26. Aug 23, 2008
  27. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Well, I would expect that most MG casinos would have done such a business review, and although the detailed conclusions and costs would not be the same, the general principle would. We already know that Grand Prive used a formula in the past, and these is no reason to think they have scrapped it now that the business environment is harsher. The sharp increase of snail mail CD offers is very telling, this bypasses affiliates, and getting a player through one of these CD promotions is cheaper than getting them through an affiliate (a strong motive for this strategy of aquisition). It is often the case that the CD grants more to the new player than they could get by going through many of the affiliate sites (this encourages them to use the CD, even if they are first brought into contact with the casino through an affiliate website).

    It is clear that Grand Prive do not consider me worth retaining as a loyal player, otherwise I would at least get the perks that come as standard with King level, and it seems many others are in the same boat. Grand Prive are the ONLY group that have banned me from promotions after LOSING a fortune. In all other cases, I have stopped receiving promotions because I have WON a four figure sum from the casino in question (5 figures in a couple of cases:D)
     
  28. Aug 23, 2008
  29. chuchu59

    chuchu59 gambling addict CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    EXECUTIVE
    Location:
    SOMEWHERE IN ASIA

    Hmmm. If they succeed in dissuading the 'unprofitable players' from playing at the casino surely the cost per player will rise as a due to a dwindling player base. Those players who were marginally profitable could now become marginally unprofitable and they wont want to keep them resulting in a vicious cycle. Maybe I am simplifying things but that is how it looks to me.
     
  30. Aug 23, 2008
  31. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Less players, to a certain extent, means less costs overall. The players they keep would generate more profit per head. However, there are two types of costs, fixed overheads, and per player costs. Eventually, as the player base falls, the fixed costs rise as a proportion of the overall costs per player, and this is when the "vicious cycle" could kick in. The per player costs would involve all the costs in administering their account, plus any bonus credits they were granted, and what they managed to retrieve of these by withdrawing. In my case, they made 3600 from me over 3 months, but I claimed many generous bonuses over that period. They seem to suffer from flawed logic, in that they seem to be counting the bonus credits as costs even when they are simply lost back to the casino through extended playing time. Surely, if I lost 3600 over three months, logic would suggest chances were that I would continue to play in a similar pattern, and that I was likely to present them the opportunity to win a similar amount over the next three months through playing with their bonuses, although there was also the possibility that I might win, such as by getting a Royal Flush (or two;) ).

    I wonder if it might be the fact that I use Neteller that caused the promotions ban, and nothing to do with my play. There was clearly something up between Grand Prive and their players who used Neteller to deposit some while back, and this resulted in this questionable "technical glitch" that prevented their Neteller players from depositing for the bonuses they were offered. There was a strong suggestion that some players had had their Neteller deposit option selectively disabled, as a true "technical glitch" should affect everyone using similar PC configurations, which did not seem to be the case. Further, players reported this happened around the time of a casino update, with Neteller options disappearing afterwards. When some players mentioned the "technical glitch" did not appear to affect the flash casino, and that a work around was to deposit in the Flash lobby, and play in the download, it seems that the response from Grand Prive was not one of thanks, but one of finding another way to deter these players from wanting to deposit (I believe some simply stopped getting the promos).

    I have noticed that there are other "Neteller hating" casinos around, so there must be something about Neteller deposits that worries casinos. 888 and Reef Club had a specific anti-Neteller clause in their rules, that required bonuses to be wagered 10x more when deposits were through Neteller than if they were by any other method. I believe this was later extended to Moneybookers deposits. No explanation has ever been forthcoming as to what is wrong with Neteller using players that warrants such action, even though "bonus abuse" seems to be implied. Any player can "abuse a bonus" just as easily with ANY deposit method, there is nothing magic about Neteller chips that makes the games play better, is there:confused:
     

Share This Page