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Land Based Microgaming

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by kmartinusa, Jun 19, 2010.

    Jun 19, 2010
  1. kmartinusa

    kmartinusa Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Business Owner
    Location:
    Under the Radar
    Does anyone know if/where Microgaming has games placed at land based casinos?

    Kevin
     
  2. Jun 19, 2010
  3. jetset

    jetset Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Senior Partner, InfoPowa News Service
    Location:
    Earth
    Microgaming is associated with the Dublin-based Betstone server based gaming company, which has been around for four or five years, claims to have installed over a thousand machines and has a gaming inventory of some 100 MGS games.

    Unfortunately, they don't identify their presumably land-based clients.

    You must register/login in order to see the link.
     
  4. Jun 19, 2010
  5. Simmo!

    Simmo! Moderator Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Web Dev.
    Location:
    England
    I have spoken to them several times over the past 3 years and never managed to get an answer as to where their kiosks are placed. In fact on one occason, I called up Betstone and the phone was answered by the P.A to Microgaming's chief, Roger Raatgeber so I think they are pretty close ;)

    The kiosks are neat - multi-game selection with several MG games including Thunderstruck and others.
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. Jun 19, 2010
  7. RobWin

    RobWin closed account

    Occupation:
    Who knows?
    Location:
    A Vault!
    I also think you are correct...stay tuned for upcoming article at my site regarding this... ;)

    It is also very very interesting to note here as well that "BetStone" allows the casino operators to make "running changes to the RTP percentages"....

    Yep, you read that right, your eyes are not playing tricks on you!

    From BetStones site: You must register/login in order to see the link.

    "Back-office data management applications: These provides in-depth analysis of your machines and games across a comprehensive set of key performance indicators such as the amount wagered, profit and margin. This analysis provides valuable and indispensable insight into game play and player analysis on the floor and can be viewed through specific time periods configurable by the client. These reports can be run across portfolios of games within a single venue, or across multiple venues. Trendline analysis tools also tell you which games are the best performers on the floor, and you can make running changes to return-to-player percentages and other configurable data to totally optimize your revenue and profit."

    Now, since we already know that BetStone has intrinsically close ties to Microgaming, how can anyone still stand behind the absurd notion that the "Online Microgaming Casinos" can also not do the very same thing in regards to changing the RTP on the fly just as the statement from BetStone says above...

    Can anyone here state otherwise with backed-up facts?

    BetStones statement there above is also very counter-intuitive to what Bryan stated in this post here:

    "RTP - once a game is developed, the RTP is set in stone and that's it. It's never changed."

    http://www.casinomeister.com/forums...k/36887-meeting-microgaming-4.html#post355591 which he was (I'm assuming) told by Microgaming.
    ____
    ____
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2010
    6 people like this.
  8. Jun 19, 2010
  9. Simmo!

    Simmo! Moderator Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Web Dev.
    Location:
    England
    OMG! You just categorically proved the biggest online casino conspiracy theory in the 14 year history of online gambling :p

    Jut kidding ya Rob - my thought is that if they had that facility, surely one disgruntled employee, rogue operator or someone out to discredit a casino would have posted a screenshot, or some sort of convincing data in the past 14 years?

    And realistically, if you were starting online casino software, would you allow operators to change the RTP on the fly? How would you cover it up, so no-one would ever find out? Doesn't add up to me.

    Anyway, don't all land-based machines allow the casino to change the RTP?
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Jun 19, 2010
  11. RobWin

    RobWin closed account

    Occupation:
    Who knows?
    Location:
    A Vault!
    LOL my friend, I didn't prove it...I just re-printed their statement, wish I hada broken that news story...talk about site hits...:cool:

    I would gander a guess though that if there were any disgruntled employee with that knowledge they may feel intimidated or even be under a non-disclosure agreement. I seriously doubt though that anyone other than the highest level of senior management at these online casinos could make that kind of change anyway.

    Sure, all land-based machines here in the states allow this RTP change (with the exception of the network progressives) as long as a gaming board official is on site and if chips are used they are also standing beside the machine when the change happens. I've seen it here many times.

    But IMO, where the difference is here is that the "Online Casinos" have categorically denied that this is possible for the past 14-15 years now. Vegas, Atlantic City, Tribal Gaming has never in my knowledge denied the fact that they could change the RTP on their machines...
    ____
    ____
     
  12. Jun 19, 2010
  13. Simmo!

    Simmo! Moderator Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Web Dev.
    Location:
    England
    True. And additionally no land-based has ever said they can't change RTP and no MG has ever said they can. So everyone's singing from the same hymn sheet and not a single dissenting voice suggesting to me that's how it is.
     
  14. Jun 20, 2010
  15. 4 of a kind

    4 of a kind Repeated violations of forum rule 1.16 - troll

    Occupation:
    Trans. Tech
    Location:
    New York
    I'm certain that most know by now that all online casinos can change their RTP settings. Having the power to change RTP settings is no surprise. The big question is how low can they go?

    We know how low land casinos can legally go. What's the lowest online casinos can legally go?

    People here always speak of RTP's not being less then 92% online. I think your lucky if your getting 80% today.

    If we new online casinos legally couldn't go under 80%, then we have no argument when we get an 80% game. I can't prove 80% games and could only guess from years of playing and experience. But don't claim that we're getting games in the 90's or that online casinos are not allowed to go below 92% without evidence.
     
  16. Jun 20, 2010
  17. Simmo!

    Simmo! Moderator Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Web Dev.
    Location:
    England
    If I thought that, I wouldn't be playing online :p
     
  18. Jun 20, 2010
  19. 4 of a kind

    4 of a kind Repeated violations of forum rule 1.16 - troll

    Occupation:
    Trans. Tech
    Location:
    New York

    I don't play online casinos at all anymore, just some poker.
     
  20. Jun 20, 2010
  21. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    Oh, so you're well qualified to make your first statement then! :p

    I play online slots every day, and IMHO the RTPs are at the correct level on the softwares I use - even when I lose!
    I'm currently wading through a $15K WR at an MG casino;
    So far I've wagered $11,562 and made +$585 = RTP 105%. *
    Perhaps I should complain to the casino that it's 10% out from the expected level..! :rolleyes:
    (* Includes PaiGow; Wagered $3,525, lost $153. All the rest on slots).

    KK
     
  22. Jun 20, 2010
  23. 4 of a kind

    4 of a kind Repeated violations of forum rule 1.16 - troll

    Occupation:
    Trans. Tech
    Location:
    New York
    I would only be qualified to express my personal experiences.

    Based on your 10 year winning record, I think I would complain. Your normal RTP average has to be around 120%
     
    1 person likes this.
  24. Jun 20, 2010
  25. jetset

    jetset Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Senior Partner, InfoPowa News Service
    Location:
    Earth
    In an industry as fiercely competitive as online gambling I doubt it would be smart for an operator to go significantly below industry norms even assuming he/she was able to fiddle at will with the RTP (which I find hard to believe possible anyway, but that's just my opinion.)

    Regarding the wording from the Betstone site, I think there may be some misinterpretation in the server based gaming context, but it is nevertheless worth checking out....I'm presently doing just that.

    Edited to add that having looked again at the statement posted by RobWin, I personally do not interpret it as changing RTP 'on the fly' or without complying with normal land casino RTP-changing procedures. I therefore don't really see the correlation between that and the somewhat different online gambling operator environment, I'm afraid.

    Nevertheless I've asked for comment in order to clarify the issue.
     
  26. Jun 20, 2010
  27. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    Not at all - I only win because I always use bonuses.
    Never worked it out, but I suspect my overall RTP is around 95%.

    KK
    PS: It's only 9 years... so far! ;)
     
  28. Jun 20, 2010
  29. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    It may well be the same game, but a completely different software "engine" specific to land based kiosks that includes the ability to change RTP.

    They would also have to comply with rules about max stake and max jackpot payout, so the paytables would have to be tweaked.

    These kinds of slots are already available on land, and the limits are a fixed £1 stake, and max £500 payout per bet. The RTP must be displayed, and is between 92% and 88%, with the vast majority set at 90%.

    For clubs and casinos, the max payout limits are higher, and quite possibly the max stake, so the club/casino versions will have different paytables.

    The question would be HOW the RTP is altered, and for the games to be random, this would have to be either paytable changes or alterations to reel strips.

    The lack of information probably indicates this is a relatively new venture for MGS, but a pretty shrewd one given that many players have seen these games online, and would probably be drawn to land based kiosk versions, even if just to try them out.

    Playing online does not stop me from trying land based video slots set on 90% and £500 jackpot, although it has meant I play LESS at land based sites, and MORE online.
     
    2 people like this.
  30. Jun 21, 2010
  31. Simmo!

    Simmo! Moderator Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Web Dev.
    Location:
    England
    Not that new. I first played their multi-game Thunderstruck kiosk at ICE back in 2007 or 2006 (cant remember which).
     
  32. Jun 21, 2010
  33. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    All very good, but I have not seen it "out in the field" yet. It's no good having a kiosk offering unless land operators want it.
     

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