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Land Based Emptiers? - The good old days

Discussion in 'Slots Discussion' started by Jono777, Apr 30, 2015.

    Apr 30, 2015
  1. Jono777

    Jono777 Meister Member CAG mm4 mm1

    Occupation:
    Self- Employeed
    Location:
    Wolverhampton
    Always wondered just how many arcade and pub AWP players (fruit machines to novices :p) used to gain 'off the street' knowledge of a particular machine to make a few quid.

    Nothing Illegal, no gadgets just knowledge and maybe a bit of skill?

    Back in the days when fruit machines were fruit machines, IE, proper 'reel's' and none of this video screen nonsense!

    Here's some of my memories, used to go out daily with best mate and be limping my the end of the day with the weight of the £1 coins..

    Jackpot 7's / 777 Heaven / 7's n Melon's (Project Coin) - Could make the wins continually hold!

    Open the Box / High Flyer / Camelot etc (Ace Coin) - Refusing wins and taking 'lines feature' empty over and over again

    Monte Carlo or Bust / Reno Reels (BWB) - 'Bad Holds' forced nudges / super nudges - empty

    Barcode (BFM Manufacturing) use 3-2-1 barcode to 'reel match' £2.40 or £4.80 continually until empty

    Up N Over (Barcrest and my fave!) - Simply gambling the 'opposite way' on Hi-Lo reel (Eg: Lower than a '4') 9/10 would gamble to £15 JP repeater

    Lotta Luck / Jackpoteers (Barcrest) - Build up RTP by refusing every win and then refuse the 'invincible' until machine basically does not stop paying.

    We travelled the country more or less and I always wondered how many other 'groups' were 'in the know'

    Has to be legal and gadget free - no 'light pens' or 'shockers' or 'wires' etc, doesn't matter how old / long ago just interested - cheers
     
  2. Apr 30, 2015
  3. fun4all

    fun4all Senior Member

    Occupation:
    .
    Location:
    .
    in b4 vinylweatherman
     
  4. Apr 30, 2015
  5. Jd666

    Jd666 RiffRaff CAG mm4

    Occupation:
    Maggot Farmer
    Location:
    Republic Of West Yorkshire
    1984 when I found my first emptier lol.
    On Barcrests Line up
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. May 1, 2015
  7. Mark_32Red

    Mark_32Red Affiliate Manager for Accredited Casinos

    Occupation:
    Head of Marketing
    Location:
    32Red Marketing Dpt
    Those machines mentioned don't ring a bell but Italian Job and a few other barcrests I recall enjoying this tactic.

    I was watching a bloke play a machine many years ago and I thought I was helping him by telling him he could get the jackpot by taking the feature. He laughed and explained what he was doing. Shortly after he told me that there was a strict rule who could play that tactic in which area and he had to be careful where he could play. Very bizarre but apparently very profitable.

    I had a short success but I was too interested in drinking than playing the machines and many of my university friends got fed up minding the machine I had 'primed' while I was changing more cash into coins.

    I still play the machines when in the UK (Gib doesn't have the same series) and I think I have lost a lot more by still thinking that tactic works, but it's a trip down memory lane anyway. My last trip I was more fed up that I had basically converted £50 into coins, the pub didn't want to change them and I wasn't wearing a belt! The kebab shop took a fortune!

    Mark
     
    3 people like this.
  8. May 1, 2015
  9. PaaskeDenmark

    PaaskeDenmark Always think positive CAG PABnoaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    Clerk with shipping discounts worldwide
    Location:
    UnKnown
    We know vinylman has not been here as he normally covers a new thread to at least 2 pages :p :D
     
    2 people like this.
  10. May 1, 2015
  11. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I've been out down memory lane. I have loads of emulators on my PC for these old machines.

    The major problem for me was getting banned from places. I settled on Motorway services as the staff there tended to mind their own departments, and not bother what was happening to "other franchised outlets" unless it was blatantly illegal, like coming in with a sack truck and wheeling out the change machine.

    I specialised in the "true skill" features, usually the "cash climber" so that I could take it all the way to the cash repeater, which was half the value of the token jackpot. I did discover a few emptiers, and tried to find others based on similar principles. Many were simple, but involved thinking "out of the box".

    I actually tried "lines" on those ACE machines some time BEFORE it became the emptier it was. I was unlucky in that I chose a particularly "dead" machine, and didn't stick at it long enough for it to become clear that the wins were not being recorded against RTP. Having tried this, I wrongly concluded that this was not the emptier once it became clear there was one doing the rounds.

    I am VERY VERY ANNOYED with myself over this:mad:

    Anyone who "did" motorways in the 1990's probably saw me at some point, and may have come along after me and not done so well. I also met others doing the rounds, and often found that I had been beaten to it.

    I also decided to "stay legal" and also "keep below the radar", so no "devices", or even blatant "off and on again" - which was effectively what the "clicker" did, but meant you didn't have "evidence" on your person if you were ever confronted.

    There was a point where I wondered whether going "full time" would earn me more than a "proper job", however the problem was the competition, too many people in the game meant it became unsustainable, much like the Pie Factory manipulator did in it's later days.

    Another annoyance was the limited capacity of the machines for holding cash and tokens. This could make some emptiers relatively unprofitable as it could cost quite a sum to buzz the machine up sufficiently, and this money often went into the cash box, so could not be retrieved during the empty. Those ACE machines were also prone to token jams, which meant much of the profit couldn't be taken once the empty was going strong. They had two token tubes, and they held around £100 when full, which was about the same as the £1 and 20p tubes combined.

    I also found that some emptiers and manipulators were "sexed up", and that many of the instructions and rituals were plain BS, with the actual actions needed being much simpler, like the Vamp it up jackpot steal.
     
    2 people like this.
  12. May 1, 2015
  13. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor Staff Member CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    How can we not mention Thunderbirds, and they even f*cked the rechip up too....
    The other was Donkey Kong via nudges.
    Many 'extra nudges/flash nudge' bar-x type slots could be raped by refusing the £2 wins for X's.
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. May 1, 2015
  15. Jono777

    Jono777 Meister Member CAG mm4 mm1

    Occupation:
    Self- Employeed
    Location:
    Wolverhampton
    Omg - totally forgot about Thunderbirds, 3rd Hold Button n Shuffle when on 1 nudge wasn't it :eek: jackpot every time!

    Regarding the Ace, I made a fortune but also came across numerous mech jams which required an engineer call out but a lot of the time got back to the machine while it was still 'flying'

    Prob's did see you VWM as we spent our 'lives' in Motorway Services during the 90's but their machines seemed the worst out the lot for malfunctions too!

    Not 100% but I'm thinking the Ace emptier virtually bankrupt them, they tried to bounce back with this Samurai based game (can't recall name) but an emptier was found on that too lol!

    Cheers for the replies guys :thumbsup::thumbsup:
     
  16. May 1, 2015
  17. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Hilton Park, Frankley, Corley?

    These were core places for regulars coming in from the big cities of Birmingham and Coventry, but it also meant the machines took quite a hammering. I once did the SAME PayRise TWICE at Corley, once early in the morning, and again after elevenses when the technician called for the daily cashbox empty, and filled both PayRise machines back up again whilst I was over the other side doing the PayRise over there:D I didn't get all three due to another "player" also being around that early.

    The PayRise at Frankley somehow missed out on the rechip, and was doable long after the others had been fixed or removed. It was left alone too, so always worth a punt for a quick streak. I expect people just assumed it had been "chipped" along with the rest - but it hadn't:D

    Aside from the machines, I got to see vast parts of the country, albeit from the motorway. I did take the occasional cross country short-cut to add a bit of sightseeing.

    Services well away from the big cities tended to be better as there were fewer "players" to compete with. It seems few had their own transport, and relied on living close by, or trying to get lifts between sites. Unlike most, I could crop up ANYWHERE at ANY TIME. I only did this during the weekends as I also had a "proper job". I know many regulars who did it full time, and with varying degrees of success.

    What I found amusing were those who claimed to know all the best emptiers and manipulators, yet couldn't scrape together the price of a cuppa, let alone run a car! It's the inconspicuous regulars with nice clothes and their own transport that I think REALLY had the knowledge, and they were not going to share it for "a pound for a cuppa", they expected something of similar value in exchange. I was often asked where I had been and how the machines were there. If I had been and left, I tended to be truthful, but if they were asking about a place I was about to move on to, I tended to offer a downbeat review of the prospects in the hope that they wouldn't beat me to it;)
     
    1 person likes this.
  18. May 1, 2015
  19. Jono777

    Jono777 Meister Member CAG mm4 mm1

    Occupation:
    Self- Employeed
    Location:
    Wolverhampton
    Hilton Park very regularly at least 2-3 times a week and the others once or twice a month(ish).

    We had a designated driver as I had not long passed my test at the time, had a job but no car.

    Depending on the time spent 'bashing' that day we would pre-agree a cut for the driver at the end of the days 'work' Best I recall handing over was about £150, think that was our best day ever, roughly 12 hours none stop, arcades, pubs, MSS and me n buddy had (as best I recall) about £350 each after his 'cut'

    No missues, kids or commitments during the day (work was P/T) so we could spend virtually all day most days at it and did do very, very well.

    Regular 'trips' would include starting at Hilton M6 North bound and stopping at all services on way (and crossing foot bridge to do other side)

    Chester, Stafford and Shrewsbury towns were very fruitful and seemed to be the best for 'novice players'

    We even had (and this is the sad bit) a book with single tokens sellotaped in with a list of the pubs / locations etc which took the different types, towards the end we had that many didn't even need a 'cash' start.

    We ran into loads of 'scroungers' and to be fair dumped them with loads of tokens at the start until the penny dropped we could use em instead of cash next time (young n dumb eh)

    On the 'great' days we'd also stop in B&B's in a particular town to get an early start the following day, if maybe we hadn't gotten around all the pubs or was moving onto a town close save travelling from W-ton and avoiding the extra train fare if our driver hadn't taken us that day.

    I vaguely also recall my bedroom windowsill had about 7-8 pint glasses full to the top with £1 coins and the wedge of 'changed back' notes shoved to the back of my wardrobe which sat their months as I didn't need it until things dried up.

    God knows what we did with the cash, probably spent most of it on booze n fags but I did get my Ford Escort from it which lasted me 4 years :D
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2015
    1 person likes this.
  20. May 1, 2015
  21. lotusch

    lotusch Megaways Slots, as useless as salt in your coffee webby PABaccred mm2

    Occupation:
    Marketing Assistant
    Location:
    Dún Dealgan
    In The Netherlands I used to make quite some money too.
    Not even by a certain style of play or by nasty tricks (which were on the market to enjoy but ofc. very bannable). :D

    But the older machines with the multi layer hoppers exactly could tell you if it was bound to pay or not.
    Just by listening how the coins fell into the hopper,and into what hopper it would go.
    It sounds ridiculous but 90%+ of the times it did work and the slot actually DID pay.

    For old of day tricks I have loads.
    There was a certain slot called VOODOO which would repeat the mystery prize in clubgame (upper game) and it would always be Jackpot.
    All you had to do is power on and off the machine every time to get this repeating.
    Problem was staff and cameras all around the places so very tricky to do. :D:D
     
    1 person likes this.
  22. May 1, 2015
  23. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    We must have crossed paths.

    I do recall a group at Hilton Park I would often run into, and they were the "smart set", reasonably dressed etc, not the "can you spare a quid for a cuppa mate". I recall one particular scrounger who went by the name of "spider" or "fruit spider", he was the most prolific "quid for a cuppa", yet also claimed to "know the exploits". His particular talent was to slide in beside the novices and offer them tips to get a big payout. He would then hint, sometimes rather blatantly, that he should be "given a cut" for his help. He actually knew little, but was a chancer who would usually suggest basic "forcing" tactics, and then announce that he had helped them win much more than they would have were they to have played "normal novice mode".

    I would often dump him at Hilton Park with a couple of quid, sorry about that:D

    I did spot something that the rest of you lot seemed to miss, and that was the Pie Factory like behaviour of a couple of QPS games and a Mazooma. If they were forced for a jackpot, this would trigger the streak, much like the cash jackpot followed by exchange for feature Pie factory trick. What made it hard to spot was that the QPS jackpot tended to produce a "silent invincible" board for the next feature, and one had to travel around for a guaranteed repeater feature, not the jackpot, and one would not die. However, the "silent invincible" could die early if one tried to gamble against bad numbers, so it wasn't a complete invincible. The board after that would tend to reach £14 or so, and the one after a few quid, after which the machine was "dead".
    Like Pie factory, it was a force that eventually gave £25 + £25+ on a repeat win feature + £14 + up to a tenner. It very occasionally failed if the machine was forced twice or more on the trot, and occasionally TWO further jackpot boards would result. As far as I could see, no one else was doing these. My success rate was high, but the machines relatively rare.

    I started from the M4 corridor, sometimes going west to start at Chievely and Membury, and at other times it was to the north east and a Toddington start. It was then usually a case of covering the M1 and M6, also the M66 link over the Pennines, and occasionally as far as Carlisle if time allowed. Occasionally, I went all the way, covering everything right up to Glasgow. I also went up the northern part of the A1 on the odd occasion.

    I've not done a trip for ages, just a couple of visits. However, I have noticed some changes that might lead to another era for players with the right skills and info. One is the appearance of "reverse change machines" that will convert coins back to notes. Another is that some machine note acceptors have become two-way, spitting out notes as well as coins for the prizes. This, in particular, increases the carrying capacity of a machine, very useful if one also knows the emptier. Being able to change vast coin collections back to notes also makes it less obvious to others that you have been winning big, and will also make one's "gambling trousers" last longer;)

    I would often come in wearing my outdoor coat. This was nothing to do with the temperature, and all to do with extra pockets for coins and tokens. In high summer, it was a shirt with pockets (for tokens) and a decent pair of trousers. It was just TOO hot to bring in my regular extra pockets. I at least had the car in which to store additional coins and tokens, so didn't have to carry EVERYTHING around with me.

    I would often sleep in the car rather than pay £50 for the hotel, and in those days 2 hour parking was only enforced at peak times. It's 24/7 camera based now, so little chance of taking liberties, so it would be a case of regularly turning around at the next junction for another 2 hours over the other side, repeating till all the machines were done and it was time to move on.

    It's interesting to note that the hotels are STILL the same price as in the 1990's, around the £40 mark, and some are even cheaper, whilst parking has shot up in price and is more rigorously enforced. I am much older too, so if I go on such a trip now, I would probably use the cheapest hotels rather than pay the parking charge to sleep in the car. All I need now is to discover a new emptier or manipulator that makes it worthwhile. An exploit in the deal or no deal engine would be great, although not so great for the operators. (I am looking into it on my occasional visits;) ).
     
    2 people like this.
  24. May 1, 2015
  25. Jono777

    Jono777 Meister Member CAG mm4 mm1

    Occupation:
    Self- Employeed
    Location:
    Wolverhampton
    Fantastic post - thanks :D

    Can't believe the moment I read 'Spider' the memories came flooding back :eek: Hope being 40+ hasn't caused this but was he the guys with the tattoo's pretty much everywhere, defo remember the name, along with his make a few quid 'tactic'

    We got to have crossed paths, I'd have been about 22-23, my mate a bit younger, jeans n T-shirt not overly but not scruffy either :p - Had to dig deep in memory but definatley made some very brief 'gambling acquaintances' with whom we'd either have a quick laugh, attempt to trade info or once or twice not very often have some slight hassle (this was usually when emptying the 'locals' pub fruity after they'd blown their wages :p)

    We briefly made a few quid out of the Pie Factory / Connect 4 machines but sounds slightly different to yours. We'd basically refuse every win till It gave the proper 'invincible' and then go on to refuse that too.

    Then Hi-Lo a 3OAK reel win not collecting until It gambled all the way to the JP, next 'board' or 'feature' would be 'Red' so another JP with 50/50 repeat on one of the JP's so got £50 or £75 with minimal 'after play'

    Thinking back we spent a small fortune on hotels, travel lodge, B&B so sleeping in car or simply going home I might have a bit left today :p :p

    The Barcrest era (roughly 1998 - 2000 forgive me if this is slightly out) was the Best, working F/T at this point but they were everywhere in various models, Up N Over, Psycho cash Beast, Frenzy, Lotta Luck, Arabian Nights - forced a JP which triggered the 'run' most times, small profit per machine but plenty of machines :)

    With the exception of Lotta Luck which I regularly left the C/L light glowing or with an IOU - sometimes left that machine flying after It was empty and I'd played the 'usual way' to try and lower the RTP back down.

    The bit about the 'gambling trouser' made me chuckle, I was always the one who ended up carrying the 'pot' so every now and again, I'd joke 'Extra £10 for me for new Jeans'

    If we were so lucky to find something nowadays I think I'd be buzzing n gutted at the same time, self employed so could give myself some time off but missues n kids wouldn't be too keen even if I showed em the daily rewards :)

    DOND would be amazing, especially if it worked across all skins cos those blumin things are the only 'reel' machines I tend to see.

    An emptier I'd really love is the arcade based Bar - X7's (the ones that hardly ever hold or nudge but when they do its a win guarantee) they are right money guzzlers and revenge would be so sweet!!
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2015

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