King Billy casino 3x wagering requirement for withdrawal without bonus

I deposited on winny casino wich is a sistersite... There was malfunctions on the site and i could not open any game from any provider. then i went to chat and spone to them and tomd them to roll back my 500euro to my bankacount, they did not doit they said i have to wagger it 3 times... Imagen i have to waggwr my own money 1500euro to have my own money back. And this beacuse that they can not provide a game ho is playable.. But in not suprised when i chekd N1 interactive site... Biggest scam casinos. a support wich is arrogant and not helpfull at all... I personally avoid all of N1 interactive sammers.
We are not a sister site to Winny Casino, we share a single platform - SoftSwiss - that is all we have in common.
 
King Billy is reviewed at Casinomeister
It is mainly meant for adequate affiliates you are not related to.

Well, your smart-ass replies won't help against the hard facts that your casino is trapping players money with the 3x deposit wagering requirements. For the affiliate's part, I guess you know well what are peoples opinion on KingBilly from the posts on AGD, GPWA forums.

Making the players wager their deposits three times is a crafty practice to keep their money in-house; it's plain and simple.

Don't believe me? Stick 100 bucks in your casino and try to play it through 3 times, and then come back and share your experience on how you did get on. Don't forget to share your screenshots in the dedicated thread!

For those who don't understand how this crap works, here is an example:

  1. You deposit 100$ in KingBilly.
  2. You start playing, for example, slots at 1$ per spin.
  3. You hit the bonus within the first 50 spins.
  4. The bonus pays you 100x
  5. And here you think; fuck it I'll cash it out!
  6. But you can't, because you haven't played your deposit three times.
  7. Then, you get well pissed off hearing different bollocks from their live chat; still, you have no other choice than to go back and put at risk your deposit and winnings, which you were just about to withdraw...
 
Every time when you raw deposit you should wager your money one time over. Even if not read separately in the t&c, it's an unwritten rule in the casino world because money laundering. And casinos have pretty sensitive systems. I'm sure their systems will alert red flags if player time after time example deposit 100 euros, wager 10 euros and then cash out. Pretty soon player may be in little problem if casino starts investigate player's gaming style. And never use any red + black-tactic or other grey zone-styles when wagering your deposit. That style can also lead to problems

But yes 3x wager to raw deposits. What a joke!
I agree.

If you walk into a casino - to lose £100, but hit a royal flush on 1st hand, or a £4000 SLOT JACKPOT 1st spin and cash out.... no one bats an eyelid.

The 1x wagering is also bollocks. I mean, any player who was just laundering money would simply low roll roulete for hours and pay the 2.8% house edge. I mean in the Ozark losing 15% laundering is acceptable.

Its just a casino scam.
 
Well, your smart-ass replies won't help against the hard facts that your casino is trapping players money with the 3x deposit wagering requirements. For the affiliate's part, I guess you know well what are peoples opinion on KingBilly from the posts on AGD, GPWA forums.

Making the players wager their deposits three times is a crafty practice to keep their money in-house; it's plain and simple.

Don't believe me? Stick 100 bucks in your casino and try to play it through 3 times, and then come back and share your experience on how you did get on. Don't forget to share your screenshots in the dedicated thread!

For those who don't understand how this crap works, here is an example:

  1. You deposit 100$ in KingBilly.
  2. You start playing, for example, slots at 1$ per spin.
  3. You hit the bonus within the first 50 spins.
  4. The bonus pays you 100x
  5. And here you think; fuck it I'll cash it out!
  6. But you can't, because you haven't played your deposit three times.
  7. Then, you get well pissed off hearing different bollocks from their live chat; still, you have no other choice than to go back and put at risk your deposit and winnings, which you were just about to withdraw...

Should atleast be able to cash your winnings out, it shouldn't be tied in with the 3x deposit wager rule.
 
@Casinomeister is this acceptable, you have to wager cash deposits 3 times before you can cashout?
I don't believe it has anything to do with AML rules, otherwise all the casinos who operate on 1x deposits are in deep shit. Like almost all casinos.
Maybe @Rs.Kingbilly could link to which AML rules they are following that state they have to do this?
 
The 1x wagering is also bollocks. I mean, any player who was just laundering money would simply low roll roulete for hours and pay the 2.8% house edge. I mean in the Ozark losing 15% laundering is acceptable.

Its just a casino scam.
+1 total truth you said, but lets disect it more why is bollocks.

First, no one will money launder 100, 500, 1000, 5000, or 10000 EUR/USD/whatever. Money laundering begins with cash, rather than money deposited on/from bank accounts. (laundered money are already washed when they come into bank account and go out to casino!)

Even, if anyone does it this sci-fi money laundering, it's easy to notice if the same thing happens over and over (deposit - cashout without playing) .

So yes this rule is big bollocks (even x1 wager rule)!
 
+1 total truth you said, but lets disect it more why is bollocks.

First, no one will money launder 100, 500, 1000, 5000, or 10000 EUR/USD/whatever. Money laundering begins with cash, rather than money deposited on/from bank accounts. (laundered money are already washed when they come into bank account and go out to casino!)

Even, if anyone does it this sci-fi money laundering, it's easy to notice if the same thing happens over and over (deposit - cashout without playing) .

So yes this rule is big bollocks (even x1 wager rule)!
Dear Bunbu,

If you are so smart or try to be the one, you are welcome to open your casino project and operate without any wagering requirements for deposits.
And, then we will see you comments afterwards...
Sitting upright in the armchair and bullshitting on the forum - it is another part of the story.
 
@Casinomeister is this acceptable, you have to wager cash deposits 3 times before you can cashout?
I don't believe it has anything to do with AML rules, otherwise all the casinos who operate on 1x deposits are in deep shit. Like almost all casinos.
Maybe @Rs.Kingbilly could link to which AML rules they are following that state they have to do this?

Dear @Rs.Kingbilly

Like @colinsunderland asked (you seem to have missed that question)
Could @Rs.Kingbilly link to which AML rules they are following that state they have to do this?

To clarify: its the 3x wagering/deposit link.
 
Dear Bunbu,

If you are so smart or try to be the one, you are welcome to open your casino project and operate without any wagering requirements for deposits.
And, then we will see you comments afterwards...
Sitting upright in the armchair and bullshitting on the forum - it is another part of the story.
That was not a helpful comment.

@everyone - please mellow out in this thread. So far there have been some agressive posts which will turn this into a flame war. Let us discuss the reasoning behind 3x turnover of non-bonus deposits. Most casinos all have at least 1x. I have seen 5x. I'm not sure about 3x.
 
Imo the fact that most casinos have a 1x wagering req on deposits means that there cant be a single good reason for having 3x.
If its about aml, i guess that means all sites just doing 1x is doing it wrong, which does not seem very likely.
Its all about increasing the likelihood that deposits made wont turn into withdrawals.
Even in cases where it does lead to a withdrawal, that 3x wagering have probably munched back a sizeable chunk of it.

3x wagering on raw money deposits: 1/10 Honey jars

44.gif
 
Putting things into perspective: The MGA (if not most/all licensing jurisdictions) has AML requirements for wagering without a bonus. Operators are allowed 1x - 3x. Here are some terms taken at random:

King Billy
12.15 Money deposited in the Casino must be used for gaming activity. Due to this, any deposit has to be wagered 3 times (player must place bets three times of their deposit amount) before the withdrawal of funds connected to this deposit is available. In case several deposits were made with no gaming activity, player has to wager the total amount of these deposits prior to withdrawal. Otherwise the Casino has a right to charge a fee for the procession of deposit and withdrawal, which is at the sole decision of the Casino.

Twin
7. If a withdrawal is requested without wagering an amount that is equal or more than the amount deposited, we reserve the right to charge a 5% (five percent) fee of the transactional value, but no less than 10 EUR (ten) and may result in the permanent closure of your account.

N1 casino
Money deposited in casino must be used for gaming activity. Due to this, all deposits need to be wagered at least 1 time. If a player is suspected of money laundering or other fraudulent actions, the casino has the right to request that the deposits need to be wagered at least 3 times.

Betsson
Money deposited in casino must be used for gaming activity. Due to this, all deposits need to be wagered at least 1 time. If a player is suspected of money laundering or other fraudulent actions, the casino has the right to request that the deposits need to be wagered at least 3 times.

Nobonus Casino
A player, who wouldn’t have placed any bets, cannot withdraw any money from the casino Account. A player always needs to have placed at least his deposit amount in bets before he or she is able to withdraw the money.

So is 3x excessive? That should be the topic to be debated. And just to add, this is not a hidden term. It is right there clear as day. Also, most of you are aware that I rarely if ever take a bonus - my play is pretty much non-bonus play and I have NEVER had an issue withdrawing any winnings - ever, I am pretty sure - due to not meeting some sort of wagering requirement for non-bonus play.
 
Putting things into perspective: The MGA (if not most/all licensing jurisdictions) has AML requirements for wagering without a bonus. Operators are allowed 1x - 3x. Here are some terms taken at random:

King Billy
12.15 Money deposited in the Casino must be used for gaming activity. Due to this, any deposit has to be wagered 3 times (player must place bets three times of their deposit amount) before the withdrawal of funds connected to this deposit is available. In case several deposits were made with no gaming activity, player has to wager the total amount of these deposits prior to withdrawal. Otherwise the Casino has a right to charge a fee for the procession of deposit and withdrawal, which is at the sole decision of the Casino.

Twin
7. If a withdrawal is requested without wagering an amount that is equal or more than the amount deposited, we reserve the right to charge a 5% (five percent) fee of the transactional value, but no less than 10 EUR (ten) and may result in the permanent closure of your account.

N1 casino
Money deposited in casino must be used for gaming activity. Due to this, all deposits need to be wagered at least 1 time. If a player is suspected of money laundering or other fraudulent actions, the casino has the right to request that the deposits need to be wagered at least 3 times.

Betsson
Money deposited in casino must be used for gaming activity. Due to this, all deposits need to be wagered at least 1 time. If a player is suspected of money laundering or other fraudulent actions, the casino has the right to request that the deposits need to be wagered at least 3 times.

Nobonus Casino
A player, who wouldn’t have placed any bets, cannot withdraw any money from the casino Account. A player always needs to have placed at least his deposit amount in bets before he or she is able to withdraw the money.

So is 3x excessive? That should be the topic to be debated. And just to add, this is not a hidden term. It is right there clear as day. Also, most of you are aware that I rarely if ever take a bonus - my play is pretty much non-bonus play and I have NEVER had an issue withdrawing any winnings - ever, I am pretty sure - due to not meeting some sort of wagering requirement for non-bonus play.
Ok, but the fact all the other casinos have a 1x wagering policy suggests 3x is not a requirement for AML regulations. The fact @Rs.Kingbilly didn't link to the regulations he is relying on also suggests it isn't correct.

Also, and what I actually think is worse. IF the money laundering legislation requires deposits to be turned over once, then why do some casinos (Twin for example above) allow you to withdraw as long as you pay them a 5% fee? I know for a fact 5% is pretty good value for money laundering, so it's making a mockery of the legislation surely?
 
Putting things into perspective: The MGA (if not most/all licensing jurisdictions) has AML requirements for wagering without a bonus. Operators are allowed 1x - 3x. Here are some terms taken at random:

Nobonus Casino
A player, who wouldn’t have placed any bets, cannot withdraw any money from the casino Account. A player always needs to have placed at least his deposit amount in bets before he or she is able to withdraw the money.

So is 3x excessive? That should be the topic to be debated. And just to add, this is not a hidden term. It is right there clear as day. Also, most of you are aware that I rarely if ever take a bonus - my play is pretty much non-bonus play and I have NEVER had an issue withdrawing any winnings - ever, I am pretty sure - due to not meeting some sort of wagering requirement for non-bonus play.
Leave us out of this please ;)

FTR: This term has always been in our terms from day 1. The reason has nothing to do with AML. The reason for us is we don't charge any fees on deposits or withdrawals and for that we require a customer to wager their deposit at least once.

To ask to wager a deposit 3x I don't see how that would fit in our AML policy. I also don't know how our MLRO would explain that to an auditor if they would ask how that (the rule) supports to combat money laundering.

With regular players we don't even check if they wagered the deposits.
 
I'm with @Casinomeister here.
I very rarely deposit on a bonus, and have definitely "hit and run" as it were on some of my very regular sites when i have hit something very quickly, and withdrawn almost instantly with not even 1x wagered. (Even if it only to play somewhere else) I have also quit a bad session (£200 deposited... lost £50 or £60 in about 8 minutes and withdrawn the rest)
So.. in line with the comment @L&L-Jan made, it appears that this is a back up tool casinos have incase they have to enforce, but not across the board. Which leads to two questions with regards to King Billy. 1) why do you think 3x is fair? 2) Do you actually implement this 3 x restriction?
 
Hahaha 3x wagering on a real money deposit, you have to be an idiot to play on such a casino imo

This seems to be becoming a common trend amongst the Dama NV / Softswiss crew. They don't want you to deposit 100 and cash out out 150, they'd prefer to hold your money hostage and increase the house edge this way. It isn't enough that they already run some providers on the lower RTP settings.

Most of them are going downhill rapidly. If you ever choose to play at one of them, it must be BitStarz.

Nate
 
Appreciate the honesty from Jan, cant say fairer than that.

As for King Billy stating its to do with AML that's complete rubbish. Im no expert but have never seen or heard of AML regs that require a players deposit to be wagered 3 times over before withdrawal.

Its simply a clause designed to make money.

Would have been better being open and honest, maybe not wording it as I have, but that would have stopped someone wording it as I have :)
 
Appreciate the honesty from Jan, cant say fairer than that.

As for King Billy stating its to do with AML that's complete rubbish. Im no expert but have never seen or heard of AML regs that require a players deposit to be wagered 3 times over before withdrawal.

Its simply a clause designed to make money.

Would have been better being open and honest, maybe not wording it as I have, but that would have stopped someone wording it as I have :)
It's like a 2 drink minimum rule but without nearly as much fun.
 
Dear Forumers,

I don't plan to justify somehow our T&C here and 3x wagering, I stated in my previous reply " it is mainly meant for AML Policy". Our current T&C are based on the recommendations from the platform provider. I am here just to confirm or deny some of the conditions we adhere to.
As soon as the topic is so hot here, I will raise the issue before the management and see what is possible to do about it. Once I have some updates, I will share it in the thread.
 
When you deposit €20 and win €40 on the 1st spin you shouldn't be required to risk 3x the amount of your deposit to cash out. If you're unlucky after that you might end up with a balance under your deposit.

MGA might find this "ok" and therefor casino's can implement it but it's just not. Like someone else pointed out before: if you're in a B&M casino and you are lucky you just print your ticket and go on your merry way.
 
To look a bit better, all they need to do is change their terms to the ones N1 has:

N1 casino
Money deposited in the casino must be used for gaming activity. Due to this, all deposits need to be wagered at least 1 time. If a player is suspected of money laundering or other fraudulent actions, the casino has the right to request that the deposits need to be wagered at least 3 times.


Otherwise, KingBilly Casino is not recommended and, simply a place to avoid, from the player's point of view.
 
King Billy is reviewed at Casinomeister

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