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Just emailed the ACLU about the SAFE PORT ACT - Gambling Addition

Discussion in 'Casino Industry Discussion' started by WagerWitch, Oct 18, 2006.

    Oct 18, 2006
  1. WagerWitch

    WagerWitch Dormant account webmeister

    Occupation:
    Yeah - like - really? Hmmm do I have to work?
    Location:
    Alaska
    Please consider getting them involved.

    Send a Feedback request - if they get enough - maybe they will look into it.

    Wager Witch

    Here is what I wrote:

    Subject: H.R. 4954

    Has anyone checked into the rights of the US to pass H.R. 4954 (see pdf
    search Google hr49543.pdf)

    Read pages 212-end.

    In my humble opinion this section violates multiple rights. It creates
    watchdogs out of banks/financial institutions and Internet Service
    Providers - to provide information on Internet activity to the Government -
    WITHOUT a Search Warrant.

    Not only that - it really isn't about Gambling. It is about the United
    States Government spying on it's own nation - and taking control of the
    WORLD WIDE WEB - in a pre-emptive strike... Claiming it under
    terrorism.

    Bush signed the Bill into law on October 13, 2006.

    The media has not even covered it... It was barely mentioned and the
    only people who noticed it were gamblers online.

    Bush didn't even talk about it - money passed hands from Gambling
    agencies to Frist.

    Like I said the media hasn't even discussed it. America as a whole is
    completely unaware of the rights they have lost.

    Could you please have someone read the Bill - and see if it violates
    American Civil Liberties?

    Could you please take a moment and decide if this will affect all of
    us?

    Thank you so very much.

    Any and all consideration of this would be appreciated.

    If you need to contact me - please contact me by email - I can provide
    links to people who know more about this than I ever will.

    Wager Witch


    You must register/login in order to see the link.

    Click on CONTACT at the bottom right

    Click on FEEDBACK FORM

    Unless you are a member - and join the forum - etc.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2006
    7 people like this.
  2. Oct 18, 2006
  3. cipher

    cipher Banned member - being a jerk

    Damn good job!!!

    Let me know if there's anything that I can do to help this along.

    Have a good one.
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. Oct 18, 2006
  5. littlebit

    littlebit Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Jack of all trades
    Location:
    Pasadena, Texas
    I wish I could remember the source but I did read the ACLU may end up being strange bedfellows with gamblers. The concern is with the attempt by government to insert itself into the operation of the internet and mandating personal finances, etc. Their stance wouldn't be pro gambling but the method being used to try to dilute freedoms. They may be the ticket to cause enough of an uproar if they chose to enter the battle.
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. Oct 19, 2006
  7. WagerWitch

    WagerWitch Dormant account webmeister

    Occupation:
    Yeah - like - really? Hmmm do I have to work?
    Location:
    Alaska
    Thank my sweets.

    Yes.


    I believe they will be out for the Truth.

    I do NOT believe this bill is about Gambling at all.

    And the sooner we make the world understand that we just noticed it because it directly affected us (at least on the surface) - that we the gamblers took the time to realize that it was and is a much more significant and pre-emptive strike the liberties and freedoms of Americans.

    I the the ACLU will be our ONLY Fighting chance!

    WagerWitch
     
  8. Oct 19, 2006
  9. Mister

    Mister Full Member

    Occupation:
    Tech. Support Analyst
    Location:
    U.S.
    YEAH, MAKE SOME NOISE...

    Luckymeki, I wish there were more of you out there...I commend you for putting out so much effort to nullify this ill conceived law...

    I like the direction you have taken to protect our pastime. Its a hard sell to persuade the numbers of people who normally don't gamble online to see how wrong this law really is. The uniformed public must be made aware of the hypocritial politics that invade our privacy.

    Even though saying "we want to preserve our right to gamble online" is'nt as lofty as saying "we want to preserve our right to pursue happiness". It is still a right of individual choice...Sure its not like collecting porcelain unicorns or chasing butterflies or dancing around the maypole. BUT IT IS A RIGHT !!

    To the citizen who is unconcerned of his/her right to gamble online is being
    taken away, sooner or later there is going to be a right out there that the government is going to stomp on...So why not start with online gambling ?...Although this new law is'nt directly aimed at taking away our individual freedom, it is still strangling our means to be able to support it.

    It is a sensible approach to argue for our freedom by exposing the government for what they are. It makes me sick to hear of the politicians promoting family values, protection of the underage, protection against our own excesses (as if we can't control our own impulses- How dare they !!) and then turn around to accept donations from the other gambling pastimes
    (namely horseracing and landbased casinos) that paid these politicians
    to "LOOK" the other way.

    Although I am repeating here what has already been mentioned in other posts in this forum, I'll risk redundancy if it means one more individual reads this post and feels inspired to get the word out. This election year has given me opportunties to convince one more person to see how "REALLY WRONG" this law is....
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Oct 20, 2006
  11. WagerWitch

    WagerWitch Dormant account webmeister

    Occupation:
    Yeah - like - really? Hmmm do I have to work?
    Location:
    Alaska
    My whole problem is that at first...

    When I read this Bill - I read GAMBLING - as the headline issue.

    I thought - nahhh... Big deal - the gambling companies will do something - Bush is trying to make online gambling regulated for the US.

    Then I watched... And read more - and listened - and started watching the News CLOSELY.

    Then I read it again and again and again.

    This Bill - that is now LAW - goes into affect in less that 270 days is NOT about GAMBLING...


    It is about US Privacy Laws and Owning the Internet - which by International Free Trade - Cannot be owned.

    There are so many things wrong with it.

    But because it says gambling on it - people who don't gamble regularly are NOT looking.

    We're the only ones who noticed it.

    The media didn't cover it.

    Sigh...

    ABC, NBC, CNN, HEADLINE News, PBS, NPR, None of the large news agencies carried the information.

    No one has cared.

    But when they realize what freedoms and liberties it REALLY takes away - then it will be too late.

    So thank you for replying - I only hope Americans can stop this insidious evil before it is too late and we become like those movies about the future where we are all wearing the same clothing and looking like clones and acting like clones - saying Be Happy.

    Wager Witch
    Luckymeki
     
  12. Oct 20, 2006
  13. dhayman

    dhayman Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Computer guy
    Location:
    USA
    Some other things that may help the cause in the short-term:

    - The elections: The Democrats look to be taking over the House, and
    the Senate is basically a pick-em' right now. A democratic Congress
    will surely help the cause, in that it could accelerate any amendments
    to this bill (should that recourse exist) and may help in creating
    interference to slow down the enforcement of banking industry
    mandates, to support the new bill. By the way, to check out daily
    election predictions, check out this great site:

    You must register/login in order to see the link.

    - The WTO issue with Antigua and Barbudo (sp ?) vs. US has yet to be
    resolved. US has clearly violated the WTO mandates, and the
    European community (UK) is now pro-gambling, and is close to
    changing administrations (Blair leaving), so the allegiance to US may
    be less stellar than it has been. Also, since US is pressing China for
    WTO trade violations, this WTO gambling issue could have some impact
    come the new year (by January or February).

    - The banking industry is vehemently opposed to any sort of
    implementation that will be imposed on them by this new law. It is
    a lose-lose for the banking industry - lots of work for no pay, and it
    will ultimately result in worse services for their customers in terms
    of services and interest (since ultimately the cost will be passed onto
    the customer). The banking industry could very easily "stall" (since
    there are definitely clauses in the law that protect the banks from any
    sort of liability), and as such, this law could wind up withering away
    into obscurity (a la Bush's CAN-SPAM act of 2003), for not being able
    to be realistically implemented. This certainly wouldn't surprise me,
    since I am of the belief that this bill was ALL about press for the
    Republicans before Election Day.

    - Gambling will not wither away and die. People will find alternate
    sites and alternate monetary mechanisms to fund their accounts.
    Although the short-term looks devastating, as other sites and
    "banks" become available, the gambling craze will persist and actually
    increase overall. Rogue sites and less-than-credible banks, will beg
    the cry for legalization. Legalization will pave the way for land-based
    casinos to go-online (we all know that this is coming), but will also
    help non-US-based casinos to gain credibility as well, IMO.

    So, ALCU involvement is definitely a great tactic indeed, but if one looks at the truly BIG picture, there are other factors that could easily contribute to the demise of this law. It will be a combination of these things, that will help contribute to the law's upheaval.

    All IMO, but if you think about it, it all makes sense.
     
    3 people like this.
  14. Oct 20, 2006
  15. WagerWitch

    WagerWitch Dormant account webmeister

    Occupation:
    Yeah - like - really? Hmmm do I have to work?
    Location:
    Alaska
    Cipher - everyone


    You all could ALSO write the ACLU.

    If they get enough questions regarding this - they actually may take some action.
     
    2 people like this.
  16. Oct 20, 2006
  17. cipher

    cipher Banned member - being a jerk

    Consider it done.

    Have a good one.
     
    1 person likes this.
  18. Oct 20, 2006
  19. jetset

    jetset Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Senior Partner, InfoPowa News Service
    Location:
    Earth
    Well thought through and interesting post, dhayman! Definitely elements to bear in mind amidst all the doom and gloom.:thumbsup:
     
    1 person likes this.
  20. Oct 20, 2006
  21. kwblue

    kwblue Webmaster webmeister

    Occupation:
    Engineer
    Location:
    USA
    Excellent work! Very informative and way to take action!
     
    1 person likes this.
  22. Oct 23, 2006
  23. Mister

    Mister Full Member

    Occupation:
    Tech. Support Analyst
    Location:
    U.S.
    Threw my 2 cents in.

    I submitted a long email to ACLU. Hope they can do something...There is also
    a place where you can submit your stand for Net-Neutrality....Only takes a few minutes (as it just takes filling in the blanks and just changing the subject line)....It might help our cause too......
     
  24. Oct 23, 2006
  25. The Watchdog

    The Watchdog Dormant account

    Occupation:
    sports, poker, casinos
    Location:
    Costa Rica
    That bill ..

    Is anything, but related to online gambling...

    It was dishonestly passed and without the awarness of millions of americans.

    The issue is not only about gambling in this huge soap opera. I like people interested in standing againts this type of moves by the US gov. Today is gambling, tomorrow who deserves to drink water...

    Remember who has the best marketing team in the world... UNFORTUNATELY THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA GOVERNMENT... its a fact.

    I wont get in to details, but this bill is perfectly written to defend interests of minority groups which have such an economic power, that regular janes and joes dont even think about.

    So yes, gambling is dangerous, fun, nice, terrible, adictive and a reality. If you stand in a news stand in a major city of the US you will see thousands of products with the same description.

    Remember a wise short phrase... ITS ALL ABOUT THE BENJAMINS
     
    1 person likes this.
  26. Oct 24, 2006
  27. WagerWitch

    WagerWitch Dormant account webmeister

    Occupation:
    Yeah - like - really? Hmmm do I have to work?
    Location:
    Alaska
    Thanks guys- you're A#1 in my book...

    And no doubt... But I do think the Benjamin's are the wrong denomination. GRIN.
     
  28. Nov 9, 2006
  29. sdaddy

    sdaddy Meister Member

    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Arizona
    Any updates on this?

    My most realistic short-term hope for stopping the UIGEA is a court challenge. I really hope that a well-funded organization like the ACLU will take this on. I'm going to be writing them soon myself.
     
  30. Nov 9, 2006
  31. WagerWitch

    WagerWitch Dormant account webmeister

    Occupation:
    Yeah - like - really? Hmmm do I have to work?
    Location:
    Alaska
    I haven't received a reply yet - to my knowledge - I did receive an acknowledgement to my original letter.

    But I have a spam monster that eats EVERYTHING - and deletes it quickly.

    So things can get past me.

    I would love to hear from them - and have pointed them in this direction.

    Meki
     
  32. Nov 9, 2006
  33. The Watchdog

    The Watchdog Dormant account

    Occupation:
    sports, poker, casinos
    Location:
    Costa Rica
    WTO

    I am waiting for the World Trade Organization to act on this...

    If they don't, it will be another example of how the US' tentacles reach every organization in the planet.

    For me its simple, the UN, WTO and IADB are just ways for the US to make whatever they want.

    If I am not mistaken, the UK wants more involvment from the WTO in this matter since Antigua's actions have not paid much.

    I am very frustraded that my country has not taken the same position of these countries towards US' actions. We seem to be whores for the US, just my point of view.
     
  34. Nov 10, 2006
  35. dhayman

    dhayman Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Computer guy
    Location:
    USA
    Although we're talking a major uphill battle, there are several developments that are surely going to help us, rather than hinder us:

    - The Democrats owning Congress is a BIG win. Unfortunately, if we had
    withstood a few hours the night this bill got attached to the Ports Bill,
    coupled with a DEMs win, we would never even be discussing this right
    now.....sigh.......

    - Blair is on the way out in U.K.. He's not liked there, he's being identified
    with Bush, and everyone is glad to get rid of him. With Blair's
    departure forthcoming, Parliament seems to be more at ease, and willing
    to defy his doctrines. The UK's recent pro-gambling stance is indicative
    of this. As a result, we may see the UK exert some influence in the WTO,
    and that coupled with a Democratic US Congress, may be a vehicle for
    challenging this idiotic law.

    - The new Senate majority leader (Reid) is very pro-gambling. This may
    be a mixed blessing. Although implementation of the UIGEA may die a
    slow death under his watch (i.e., the banks say they cannot comply, and
    Congress says "thanks anyway for trying guys"). However, his ties with
    land-based casinos may pave the way for legalized online gambling via
    the land-based sector. As such, he may very well want the international
    gaming sector to fall over and die first.....I dunno, the jury is out on this
    one. If the latter statement is true, the ultimate end result may be good
    for online gamblers, BUT bad for online affiliates.

    - With a Democratic Congress in place, ALCU action may player a bigger
    role than I previously thought. Democrats generally speaking identify
    with ALCU causes, so the power of this group (yes, well funded) may
    come into play now. It should be interesting to see what comes of this.

    Time will tell. Let's see what happens. I'm very happy that the Republicans have been held responsible for the actions of the last 5+ years. The Gambling Prohibition is a microcosm of what this party has done to deface the reputation of our once great nation. There are bigger things that this party has been responsible for - senseless killing, corruption, falsifying economic data, etc. I could go on for hours about this, but I'll spare everybody the ideology thesis.

    I gotta play some Poker now......
     

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