Jackpot Factory Double Dipping!

pacers31

Banned Used - Repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Location
Californication
FINALLY A REPLY FROM JF

Hello again everyone. Well hell froze over and I received a reply to my PM from David. More on that in a minute. This morning I received a call from a woman in their CS dept telling me that she had great news about the situation and that I would really be happy about it. She told me that the casino had credited my account with a $75 bonus. (By the way, with WR and all). It's as if they are saying here's your money, kinda, but we're going to make you earn it!!! This wasn't bonus money, it was money their processor took from my checking account and an overdraft fee from my bank due to their error!! Needless to say, I was not excited or happy with this arrangement.

I mentioned that David PMd me, finally. He told me that it was my banks error, not them. This is ludicrous. I have the proof that their processor was paid by my bank. Whether their processor passed it to them or not, I have no control over. All I know is that one of the two processors that took these deposits is to blame. I really pisses me off that they blame the victim in this, and all I get is BONUS DOLLARS for my trouble.

No apology, just pass the buck and blame someone else. I told the CSR that it is still unacceptable and she said that she could make it cashable (after initially telling me it couldn't). She put me on hold and spoke to a supposed supervisor. When she came back she said they would make it cashable even though it was still in their warped mind my banks fault. When I asked to speak to this supervisor person, he/she was unavailable, IMAGINE THAT!!

I told them not to do anything and have someone call me that can make a damn decision. I don't appreciate being jerked around and then blamed for their mistake. They said prove it wasn't your bank. Can do, it was debited out of my account to one of two processors (don't want to name them due to roaming eyes of the govt. at this point, but I have lost patience). I then asked her to prove that her processor didn't take the funds from my bank. SPEECHLESS. It is now principle and I will not leave this alone without a really good deal for ME, and an apology that is genuine. I don't think I want to play there now because I'm sure they have labeled me a trouble maker for wanting my legitimate money back. Sorry this was so long, but at this point I don't see much future for these guys. Based on some of your posts, I think Brickman and CO. know it too. I'll let you know the next "best they can do" offer they make, if any.
 

pacers31

Banned Used - Repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Location
Californication
UNBELIEVABLE

Sorry to double post guys, just checked my Wild Jacks account. SUre enough, $75 in the bonus area. BULLSHIT!!! If it truly was my bank error, I don't know why they would give me anything? Certainly not because they care about me or my account anyway!!
 

babs7262

Banned User
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Location
PA
Sounds like a no contest plea to me! Hopefully all of this bad press on the forum will hurt their pockets a bit!
 

pacers31

Banned Used - Repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Location
Californication
yeah, they don't seem to give a crap. I guess I'll probably have to take their shitty deal and play it, hope to get lucky, and try to cash out. One thing for sure, no more real money for them. Once their "bonus" money is gone, so am I. Too bad really.
 

peteyweestro

Dormant Account
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Location
So Cal...Antelope Valley
thats crappy whats been going on with you pacers and i foe one will never deposit with this group again...well it's been like 5 or so years since the last time i deposited at wild jack but i won't ever do it now thanks for the heads up....i think untill there is some kind of regulating agency that these online casinos really have to answer to we as customer will be subject to getting bent over at any time and by any of them no matter if they are rougue or accredited if they don't wanna pay they won't cuz even bad press doesn't seem to slow em down, i mean if the virtual group is still in buisness that speaks volumes
 

darsval

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 27, 2006
Location
??
Why don't you just deny the charges through your bank??? Your bank will reverse the charges.
 

pacers31

Banned Used - Repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Location
Californication
Thanks guys. I trusted them I guess that they would do the right thing after all the cash I had spent with them. I'm just resigned that I'm not going to get this to work out, so I PMd Brickman and told him that I would just play off the stupid bonus and then be done with them. Bottom line is their processor took my money, they decided to be so kind as to give it back in the form of bonus money, and I figure even if I did win something, they won't pay anyway after all this. I hope that Bryan gets wind of this and sends them to the rogue pit where they belong.

I lost the bogus "bonus" money and get this, I get a casino mail message congratulating me and inviting me into the VIP club. Is that about the funniest thing you've ever heard???LOL!! I hope you all avoid these guys like the plague, and I will post about their poor rep. every chance I get. Amazing that they make a mistake, won't live up to it, and then expect me to be grateful for the shitty deal they gave me. I just played the money off because I'm so tired of their BS. Everyone play as you please, but you've now seen how they treat there VIP material, imagine what they are doing to the poor unsuspecting new player that just wants some fun and chance for a thrill of winning something once in awhile. I'm sure that Brickman will come on kissing ass and blaming my bank. I have bank statement that proves their processors, voipvibes.com and resolvepay.com were paid out of my gaming checking account. They can blame my bank all they want, they know the truth, they know they are lying, and they know that the members of this and other forums listen and take heed of what happens to each other in the gaming world. My advice is that if you see one of these processors involved in any of your deposit transactions, stay away, very far away!! JACKPOT FACTORY IS TO BE AVOIDED AT ALL COSTS. At least until they can demonstrate better ethics and treatment for their customers and VIPs HAHA. I guess all VIP means to them is something like Very high Income Potential for this group. I guess I'm just out of luck on this one, but like I said, it isn't about the amount of money, it's about another shady ass outfit not knowing how to tie their shoes so to speak. Thanks for following my experience and I will be glad to fight them at every turn. Thanks again for all the interest in my plight all, just be careful because unlike JACKPOT FACTORY, I do care about you guys.

For some of you that may not be familiar with JACKPOT FACTORY, their sites consist of these casinos: ALL SLOTS ALL JACKPOTS WILD JACK FIRST WEB AND VIP LOUNGE.

BUYER BEWARE, good luck with your gaming folks and if you find a really good site that you know is reputable, please let me know by PM. Apparently the accredited list isn't as safe as we'd like to think. (No offense to you Bryan, you have no control over what some of these operators do)

Good night for now.
 

pacers31

Banned Used - Repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Location
Californication
darsval, I know I could have done that, but because it was such a small amount, I wanted to give them a chance. I have spent several thousand dollars with them. My mistake I guess.
 

SlotsWizard

Dormant account
Joined
May 11, 2006
Location
North of Antarctica
Wow, you must have lost a lot with them. I was never invited to the VIP club even after playing back $20,000 worth of winnings in a single session.

Roxy Palace and Fortune Lounge, however, did something sheisty like this to me last year. In fact it made me feel like they were sitting there watching my account and/or fiddling with the controls, because as soon as I lost - and I mean within SECONDS - they fired off the "congratulatory" emails. I think it was a $5,000 reversed-and-lost withdrawal with Roxy Palace that earned me gold status or whatever. With Fortune Lounge it was $8,000. Stupid reverse-withdrawals. They are the true lifeblood of the industry. It's no wonder they don't want to get rid of this "feature".

But it's good to know that eCOGRA ensures their clients encourage responsible gaming. :thumbsup:

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chuchu59

gambling addict
PABaccred
PABnonaccred
PABnononaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
Wow, you must have lost a lot with them. I was never invited to the VIP club even after playing back $20,000 worth of winnings in a single session.

Roxy Palace and Fortune Lounge, however, did something sheisty like this to me last year. In fact it made me feel like they were sitting there watching my account and/or fiddling with the controls, because as soon as I lost - and I mean within SECONDS - they fired off the "congratulatory" emails. I think it was a $5,000 reversed-and-lost withdrawal with Roxy Palace that earned me gold status or whatever. With Fortune Lounge it was $8,000. Stupid reverse-withdrawals. They are the true lifeblood of the industry. It's no wonder they don't want to get rid of this "feature".

But it's good to know that eCOGRA ensures their clients encourage responsible gaming. :thumbsup:

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Wrong for once SW. The amount wagered/lost back to them is only one of the considerations for invitation to their Venomous & Inglorious Plague club. You didnt post about their antics and this is the main reason you werent invited. Next time, lose a little and then spread the word about what they have done wrong here. I rate it a 50-50 chance you will get the invitation.
 

Zodiac

Senior Member
webmeister
PABaccred
PABnorogue
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Location
Europe
I Pm'd him a few hours ago and got a response pretty fast from him

you lucky girl barbara, i get no response since 31st August, maybe i write something wrong :rolleyes:

actual i like to play at them, also if i have have no problems with depositing or withdrawals only it was a little bit technicals with their games.

i don't know what i do after reading pacers post, because i'm annoying that no word from D.B

maybe should i try a second PM ? :)
 

pacers31

Banned Used - Repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Location
Californication
FINAL POST

Well folks, I haven't resolved the problem with JF to my satisfaction. David decided that it was fair to give me back my money not in real dollars, but in JF bonus dollars. I'm done fighting them and contributing to them as well. Shabby service, unresponsiveness, if that is what you want in an online casino, this is your place! The rest of us that know better will not go near JF again. You really blew this one David. You lose thousands, (I spent about $500 at a competitor this weekend) But on the bright side, you did save your company $50, Nice business decision MORON!!!!!

If you continue to play JF sites, hope you never have an issue with them. If y0u do, you'll find out what these guys are all about.

By the way David, keep your invite to the "players club" or whatever you call it. Being a VIP at Jackpot Factory is an oxymoron!!!
 

Jackpot Factory

Dormant account
Joined
Feb 2, 2005
Location
Malta
Reply from David Brickman at the Jackpot Factory

Hi everyone,

This is David Brickman from the Jackpot Factory.

Seems there was a serious miscommunication with closing this case on our end with this case which we are now fixing. In the interest of player confidentiality I will not go into details but Pacer31 can explain the outcome if he chooses to do so.

Sometimes mistakes happen and we try to rectify them as soon as possible.
All I can ask for is everyones understanding.

All the best,

David Brickman
 

darsval

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 27, 2006
Location
??
Pacer- I still say, have the charges reveresed by your bank. Its bad for a merchant to get charge backs- If they get enough of them, they stand to lose their processors.....
 

lojo

Banned User - repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Location
USA
Sometimes I feel leary of stepping on toes and pissing people off; hey we could all use more friends, and I'm rude enough in other circumstances. But wtf, chargeback? Get blacklisted and ruin the whole gig? Pacers probably won't do that.

DB is respecting the privacy and Pacers can inform or not. That is acceptable to me.

But Pacers, if you look back at almost every thing you wrote in this thread it seemed more than assertive to me, it seemed aggressive and challenging. DB is a better man than me, as are most reps who post here. I couldn't do it, I'd fly off. That's why I'm not in customer service.

You were pissed and may very well have had good reason to be, but from a customer standpoint, I have never gotten satisfaction at a restaurant, in a ballpark, or in a casino when my complaint is couched in anger and aggression and demands. I'm just saying. I'm not telling you how to act by any means, only suggesting to others that to follow that lead may not get them satisfaction.

Hope everyhting worked out well for you in the end:thumbsup:
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Unfortunately, this case involved a consequent bank overdraft, this means there really was NO ROOM for "ASAP", as can be clearly seen by the fact the original $50 became $100 due to bank FINES for breach of contract (going overdrawn without permission).
This is made worse by first no reply for a couple of days, then one blaming the customers bank and by implication refusing to do any more about it. If the BANK is really at fault, then the customer MUST approach the bank and ask them to recover the money, thus JF are ASKING this player to initiate a "chargeback" on the grounds of an unauthorised debit. While the bank can be told about the merchant believing the bank to be at fault, all that has happened is that the processors have become the target of an error investigation, something that might reveal what the money was REALLY for, and which could then lead to those processors being identified by the Federal reserve as "criminal (gaming)" - and then they are lost as a deposit & payment method.

The best way to sort this out (it was only $50), is as soon as the player showed the bank statement with the extra $50, get it back to them ASAP as a withdrawal or refunded duplicate charge. Hopefully, the player could convince the bank to forget the extra charges because of the error, and as far as the bank was concerned, this would still be something about VOIP, and not gaming.

While David Brickman seemed to leave something to be desired, it should NEVER have needed to get this far in the first place, CS should have handled this, and whenever promised to reply were given, ensured a reply was forthcoming, even if it was only a progress report.

This is a general problem with JF, when these odd mistakes happen, you really have to FIGHT ALL THE WAY, because no-one at their end seems to oversee the big picture - as soon as promised replies fail to appear, nothing will happen unless you contact them again and press the issue.
I did an experiment once. I was promised a resolution over a stuck withdrawal (normally takes 2 days max). I was promised it would be taken care of "ASAP". Instead of contacting CS again, I just waited to see what happened. Well, after a FORTNIGHT, I decided to end the trial and contact CS - NOTHING had been done:confused: No-one had been tasked with it, my withdrawal was still in limbo. I pressed and bullied away and got a quick reply & my money. It was a "server error" with their processor, which meant they though I had been paid already. There is NO ERROR TRAPPING WHATSOEVER for this eventuality, once it has gone wrong, it stays gone wrong till someone works out where to look for the errors (David in this case, not the CS).

I believe, therefore, the error in the above case really IS at the processor end, and not with the bank - just no-one bothered to look at ALL the traceable evidence from the transaction before deciding to pass the buck to the player's bank.

Particularly for the USA, casinos should NEVER pass the buck and get the player to take it up with the bank, the LAST thing they want is banks looking into these transactions forensically to sort out a reported error.
 

darsval

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 27, 2006
Location
??
lojo---- This is a little different than not being "satisfied" at the ballpark or a resturant! $50 was taken out of pacers account WITHOUT his authorization.

This is more like going to a resturant- ordering a meal, paying for it, tipping the waiting- and the waiter giving himself an exta $50. Would you not be pissed and try to get your money back???


good luck pacers!!! Keep us posted. I surely wont' be playing at JF!!!!! All my hard earn cash is being played at Villento. Excellent customer service, they do exactly what they say- when they say it! And, I'm paid on time without any excuses.....
 

jetset

RIP Brian
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
Good post, VWM - I agree with your view entirely!

Reading through the latest Jackpot Factory responses from "David Brickman" I get the feeling that they have recognised that there have been severe shortcomings in the manner in which they have treated this player.

Just palming it off as was apparently done initially has ended up causing them unnecessary grief and will undoubtedly be another dent in their reputation.

There's only one way to make things right for Pacer after all of this stress and expense, and we all know what that is.....
 

lojo

Banned User - repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Location
USA
Some very good points VWM.

Firstly, I want to be clear that I am not assuming anything as we only have a certain amount of information, and it is Pacers' prerogative to leave the matter at rest if they are satisfied. - or to continue to complain if there was no real satisfaction, or whatever. I'm satisfied with DB's response of yesterday, but it isn't my issue - it was the OP's and Pacers needn't feel any obligation to answer my post - it wasn't meant as a challenge or admonishment or anything of the sort, but a 'heads-up' to others.

We all know that JF had problems in the near past with processors, communications, and what many of us believe to be poor choices in resolving the 'stuck money' issues from February. I've made my opinion clear about that, but again without all of the information (how many megabux were stuck? would it have broken them to cover everything until they got the funds back? How did the beancounters decide, why was there miscommunication or stalling in the interim, etc.) I can't condemn them for it and would still trust the group with my funds.

We have to remember the power of this forum. There is a protocal for resolving issues. https://www.casinomeister.com/player-arbitration-pab/ If JF was at fault and they don't do everything in their power (within reason) to satisfy the complainant, then their reputation should suffer. Otherwise, as a headsup to others who have complaints against casinos, the best chance of resolution here is to follow the advice in the PaB link.

Again, I am assuming nothing and Pacers shouldn't feel obligated to respond unless there is still a problem with this issue - and should feel comfortable regardless.
 

pacers31

Banned Used - Repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Location
Californication
POST SCRIPT

Hi guys,

I was out for a couple of days, but I wanted to update you on my situation. Tues. afternoon I finally received a call from CS at Jackpot Factory informing me that the management had deposited $75 into my cash balance in my Wild Jack casino account. The also gave me a HUGE $25 bonus for my trouble LOL!! So, at least I got my money back, sort of. The thing that really keeps eating at me is the way David and his group at as if they are doing me a favor by making me this offer. I guess I'm suppose to be grateful to them for doing the right thing and returning my money. You got me guys, I don't get it either.

In any event, this is the best I am going to do with these folks, so I will lay it to rest for now. Hope noone runs into problems with JF, but be forewarned, I TOLD YOU SO! Actually, this is the first problem I've had with them, although I haven't had occassion to cash out with them yet (scary proposition based on this experience!!)

David Brickman did PM me with a message about how it really wasn't their fault and my bank is to blame, etc. I just can't understand why this is so difficult to understand. I deposit money to their processor, their processor removes the money from my bank account, their processor forwards the money to the casino. My bank paid their processor. I have no control over whether their processor pays them or not. Thanks David for the overly generous bonus LOL! It's gonna take a hell of an offer to get me back David.

Thanks to all of you here, and thanks to Bryan for this forum. I am convinced that it was your help and interest in my "situation" that finally got JF to act. Not a perfect solution by any means, but could have turned out worse. Anyone know of any RTGs that are accepting debit cards?? If so, PM me with the info, don't post it here though!! Thanks again all!
 

GrandMaster

Dormant account
Joined
Jan 21, 2004
Location
UK
David Brickman did PM me with a message about how it really wasn't their fault and my bank is to blame, etc. I just can't understand why this is so difficult to understand. I deposit money to their processor, their processor removes the money from my bank account, their processor forwards the money to the casino. My bank paid their processor. I have no control over whether their processor pays them or not. Thanks David for the overly generous bonus LOL! It's gonna take a hell of an offer to get me back David.
The processor is JF's agent, and JF are responsible for whatever their agents do. Furthermore, the JF websites state "All transactions at Jackpot Factory casinos are facilitated through Inexia Ltd., a subsidiary of the Jackpot Factory casinos", so if they debit your account twice, the excess money is there somewhere in the Jackpot Factory group.
 

pacers31

Banned Used - Repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 19, 2006
Location
Californication
It really is sad GMaster that they have turned a simple error into a PR nightmare. The attitude reminds me of GW Bush. "I'm right, cause no matter what, I can't be wrong!" Too bad really, I thought D. Brickman was really going to be a breath of fresh air with his involvement in the forum. Talk really is cheap!!
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
It really is sad GMaster that they have turned a simple error into a PR nightmare. The attitude reminds me of GW Bush. "I'm right, cause no matter what, I can't be wrong!" Too bad really, I thought D. Brickman was really going to be a breath of fresh air with his involvement in the forum. Talk really is cheap!!

If you feel aggrieved, discuss this with your bank. Ask whether it was the processor that requested the funds twice, or whether it was the bank paying twice on a single request. If it REALLY was a bank error, recovering the funds from the bank should be dead simple (their fault, they pay), AND you get the charges refunded. The fact the money could not be returned to your bank, but had to go into a casino account, suggests the error was with the processor.
JF group simply cannot get away with this distancing themselves from Inexia, they are both in the same company. This is not like other casinos that employ processors that have nothing to do with their group.
It seems odd that you didn't even get the full $100 back, but $75 cash + $25 bonus (the bonus will just stop you withdrawing the $75 cash too). Normally, players are given a little extra for the inconvenience - or don't Americans matter any more:rolleyes:

When I started in 2004, casinos would treat Americans like royalty, with other countries picking up the scraps. ALL events were timed to suit the USA, and other players had to timeshift, the bonuses for US players were often better than for the rest of us (although forgetting about the fact they were Dollars - the terms were better). It's all changed now, Americans seem to be treated as though they are damn lucky to be allowed to deposit & lose, and should just be thankful. If I don't deposit for as little as a fortnight, I am sent worried E-mails from the CS asking if there is something wrong. If I win, they congratulate me & generally pay quickly, and offer me something the folowing week so they can get it all back (something they have been rather good at this month:mad:).
 

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