issuing a challenge to 32red/mg

[spearmaster]

I am on my first mug of coffee. And my eyes are half-open.

As you can see, I have deleted a number of posts and left only the markers.

Ladies, please ensure this does not happen again. Thank you.

 

[path]

32Red

...cmon pat theres just no getting away from it and im saying pat cos your the only guy who as vwm says has the guts to even respond from mg on here things are desperate at mg at the moment huh? heres a few stats for you to try and explain pat ok? total deposited inc bonuses is over 700 since august and withdrawls hmmm they equal 0..and this incidentally is the excellent cs at 32 btw,,,,
..im sorry pat and i reiterate i only say pat cos well you know why...lol..mg are as tight as fort knox atm ....

I would just like to state that I do not represent, nor do I speak on behalf of Microgaming. As an operator of their excellent Casino Software I think it only right and proper that I do comment on the performance of the games from the 32Red perspective. To say that 'things are desperate at MG and that MG are as tight as fort knox atm' is completely without foundation; by all means use this volatile language to describe your own individual experience of their software, if that is indeed the case.

In respect of withdrawals that you have made, yes, they do equal 0. The decision to withdraw, or not, is entirely your decision and it really does depend upon your style of play and what you are trying to achieve from your deposit. Some players will withdraw their initial deposit once their winnings have increased that initial deposit by say 50%. Other players will withdraw if they are on a losing streak and their 'bankroll' is at 50% of their initial deposit. It is difficult to advise players on what is the best way to play, other than stating 'that only gamble with what you can afford to lose'. It all depends on your approach really and what is your objective; are you looking for that big win or looking to get the maximum play time and entertainment from your deposit? Whichever, be prepared to lose the initial deposit! A sensible approach is the one that 'Pinsnpies' has proffered in his post here whereby the initial deposit is withdrawn when the balance has reached four times the value of the deposit.

I would agree that the 78.3% payout percentage in your latest gameplay session of 1100 spins is below the averages that we would expect to see. I fully agree with what Kasino King has already stated 'not being funny, but 100's of spins is not enough to judge the overall return with any sort of accuracy'. Looking at the payout percentage over the lifetime that your account has been open we see a return of 89.56% on just under 33,000 spins. Incidentally, of these 33,000 spins 35% of them have generated a payout; a pretty good 'hit-rate' for the games that you have been playing.
We at 32Red do strongly believe in supporting our players when they experience bad runs and with free chips accounting for 279 of the 700(ish) total deposits, I hope you see this as being the case here.

I would like to take this opportunity of apologising for the standard of the Live Chat; we do, on rare occassions, get some gremlins at work with this software and it can give the appearance that we are ignoring the player. I assure you that this is far from being the case; we simply see the chat as being inactive and we aren't then in a position to post a reply. We are in the process of sourcing new Live Chat software and hope to have a new, much improved, version on offer early in the New Year.

I hope that is enough to satisfy 'alexishot' that nothing has changed at 32Red, nor at MG for that matter.

Cheers
Pat

 

[Jufo]

So Pat how about contacting Microgaming and asking if they can implement Randomness verification which is already in use at Bet Voyager. If the software is fair, then adding transparency how the software draws outcomes would be only beneficial to all.

 

[vinylweatherman]

So Pat how about contacting Microgaming and asking if they can implement Randomness verification which is already in use at Bet Voyager. If the software is fair, then adding transparency how the software draws outcomes would be only beneficial to all.

It would also help allay fears if you could break the silence on WTF went on with Mega Moolah earlier this year. It was clearly many standard deviations off the norm for the two minor posts to behave the way they did, and then suddenly go back to "normal behaviour". The fact that MGS simply REFUSE to even acknowledge the issue, let alone explain it, has driven this recent frenzy of "conspiracy theory" to a raging inferno.

 

[patrina]

Hey all, Thank you Pat, for your explanation. I can only imagine you sitting there thinking, how can I explain this issue with relevancy, when there is really not alot that you can really elaborate on, yes we NEED someone from MG to come here. To put Pat through this is wrong, MG is the issue here and it just happens that Pat is taking the fall for MG and trying to constantly assure us that 32 Red is alive and well, nothing has changed and the payouts are the same as before, and it really gets down to the luck of the draw, that a game may pay and a game may not pay. There is some skill involved with slots and you 'use it' or 'lose it.' I have learned alot from the past several days of play. I have already stated these lessons, but again I think we need to play with more thought involved if we want to win anything above our initial deposits. 32 Red is generous and the cs has always been bar none, of course there are going to be situations when a chat may be lost etc. In the past several days, I have not won anything huge, but did ok, played for a little while on my deposits and could of cashed out several times, but didn't. If I were to of stayed at my fav game, I wouldn't of gotten very far. Because I switched around to several different games, until I found one that was paying, I did ok. Now, you may all say, "Why the change of attitude?" Well, it hasn't changed much except that I have realized I have not been playing 'too smart' i still have concerns that I would like to see 'MG' address. As for 32 Red? I think that Pat has answered dutifully and has said all he can say. We need to get someone from MG here to address our concerns. Thanks all
Patrina

 

[vinylweatherman]

Hey all, Thank you Pat, for your explanation. I can only imagine you sitting there thinking, how can I explain this issue with relevancy, when there is really not alot that you can really elaborate on, yes we NEED someone from MG to come here. To put Pat through this is wrong, MG is the issue here and it just happens that Pat is taking the fall for MG and trying to constantly assure us that 32 Red is alive and well, nothing has changed and the payouts are the same as before, and it really gets down to the luck of the draw, that a game may pay and a game may not pay. There is some skill involved with slots and you 'use it' or 'lose it.' I have learned alot from the past several days of play. I have already stated these lessons, but again I think we need to play with more thought involved if we want to win anything above our initial deposits. 32 Red is generous and the cs has always been bar none, of course there are going to be situations when a chat may be lost etc. In the past several days, I have not won anything huge, but did ok, played for a little while on my deposits and could of cashed out several times, but didn't. If I were to of stayed at my fav game, I wouldn't of gotten very far. Because I switched around to several different games, until I found one that was paying, I did ok. Now, you may all say, "Why the change of attitude?" Well, it hasn't changed much except that I have realized I have not been playing 'too smart' i still have concerns that I would like to see 'MG' address. As for 32 Red? I think that Pat has answered dutifully and has said all he can say. We need to get someone from MG here to address our concerns. Thanks all
Patrina

May not happen, but they WILL be at the ATEI show (up in ICEi), and there will be ample opportunity for an in depth "interogation"

 

[steinhaug]

I would agree that the 78.3% payout percentage in your latest gameplay session of 1100 spins is below the averages that we would expect to see. I fully agree with what Kasino King has already stated 'not being funny, but 100's of spins is not enough to judge the overall return with any sort of accuracy'.

The system may not have changed in payout, however what seems to be an obvious change is that the losing streaks before wins occure seems to be much larger and much more common now than pervious years. As an example I did a fresh test account the other day and got over 2300 spins before feature, which is quite impressive! After this features started occuring, however with bad results, so it was constant loosing for around 3000 spins.

Such a session, if you get to experience it, will most likely be so costly that when you do get your wins which will balance out your payout to the 95%ish, you are mostly on low wagers terrified of upping bets and end up getting advertised payout in mean percentage - however not in cash percentage. A way of visualizing the slot payout I totally forgot to dig into, it blew my mind!

 

[pinsnpies]

I feel you severly limit your chances of winning playing at just one mg casino. I losy 200 this weekend at riverbelle and 100 at redflush but won 400 at grandhotel and 270 at spin palace.

If somewhere isn't working for me, i'll go somewhere else.

 

[KasinoKing]

As an example I did a fresh test account the other day and got over 2300 spins before feature, which is quite impressive! After this features started occuring, however with bad results, so it was constant losing for around 3000 spins.

Which slot was that on???

For the record (again) from my last deposit at 32Red, this is how many spins it took to get a feature on the slots I have played so far:-

Dragons Loot 156
Double O'Cash 18
Elementals 157
Franken Cash 83
Jonny Specter 2
Gladiator 300
Glory of Rome 272
Harveys 62
Hitman 2
Hohoho 12
Isis 62
Jolly Jester 53
Jonny Specter 29
Jungle Jim 1
Kathmandu 25
Ladies Nite 78
Little Chef 56
Loaded 29
Lucky Stars 110
Mad Hatters 10
Magic Spell 50
Mermaids Mill 15
MoonShite 303
Munchkins 111
No Worries 42
Polar Bash 92
Prime Property 37

KK

 

[steinhaug]

Which slot was that on???

Well, it was not one particular slot but the sum of spins between the slots before one single feature hit. Looking at the logs I did around 30-150 spins on each slot before reaching some 2300 spins and first feature.

Still, normally slots must hit earlier than others which hit slow - so the average 136 spins pr feature should still apply even if switching games methinks logially.

 

[Trollet]

Ok..im here with my 2 cents again
I did play at 32Red...and i had so much fun. Made a 30 depo..played for hours...and even got to cashout 350. It was a blast.
I got so many sets of free spins that it was sick....lol. We are never happy are we

I have been there a few times in last week and i had more play time there than in any other place in the last month.

I do belive its all just about luck...nothing else. Its just that when you lose and lose you get pissed...and then you start to look for something/ someone to blame. And..i do belive that 50% of the times everyone would have been able to cashout...but its just so damn hard to find the cashier...lol.
Offcourse...it all depends on what you are trying to get.

I guess that was all for now I wish you all, the best of luck at the casinos...and dont forget..that if everyone would win all the time..there would be no casinos left. And we would all sit here and do ....something


(((HUGS)))) Trollet

 

[Rusty]

Last 2000 or so over 3 MG's

Osbornes -----900+
WhatOnEarth 100
TwinSamuri 180
Thunderstruck 170
Thunderstruck 80
Thunderstruck 30
HighLife 20
SupeItUp 300

+255 since last feature.

 

[Alexishot69]

done

What i should have done perhaps weeks ago closed my acct at 32red...and wont play at another mg casino cos of them all i think that was the best..now what i need to find is a casino where my deposits will at least a little more than they have been doing

 

[zebedy]

with my luck at microgaming i think its time to quit AGAIN

i emailed support to know my payout % after my last deposit and was told it was 50% im suprised it was that high, it didnt feel like it :sob:
the next time i want that much excitement i think ill just spend the time pulling the fluff out of my belly button

 

[Pinababy69]

I wanted to get my stats for yesterday to add to this thread, as it was a long session.

Time Played: About 7 hrs, with breaks in between
Games Played: My Slot, Gift Rap, Rainbow's End, Adventure Palace, Sunset Showdown, Deck The Halls, Dragon's Loot
Total Number of Spins: 9,357 (3,560 generated a payout)
Amount Wagered: $4,351
Payout Percentage: 106.89%

And the best part was that all of this was generated from cashing in $10 worth of rubies at 32Red. And I had a nice cashout of several hundred dollars.

 

[steinhaug]

Those sessions are sweet indeed! Don't you just love it when you hit something all the time!

 

[Rusty]

Last 2000 or so over 3 MG's

Osbornes -----900+
WhatOnEarth 100
TwinSamuri 180
Thunderstruck 170
Thunderstruck 80
Thunderstruck 30
HighLife 20
SupeItUp 300

+255 since last feature.

2More deposits and 413 spins without a feature on Summertime 55% (est)

So that is now 668 spins on Summertime without a feature.

Averaging around 300 spins a feature :yahoo:

KK when was the last time you went 650+spins without a feature?
As you can see I have managed it Twice quite comfortably playing min of 9 lines and 3 coins.

 

[KasinoKing]

KK when was the last time you went 650+spins without a feature?
As you can see I have managed it Twice quite comfortably playing min of 9 lines and 3 coins.

Under normal circumstances I would never get anywhere near 650 spins without a feature before giving up & moving on to a different slot.
My normal tolerance of pain threshold is somewhere round the 300 spins mark, often a lot lower.

However in November playing Santa Paws every day for the scratchcards I went for 676 spins with no feature!
But it's swings & roundabouts... Stats time again!

Spins between features:-
64
676
190
164
75
64
160
5
216
209
52
208
41
210
99
101
33
+ 180 spins at the end of the month without hitting the feature.

Total spins = 2963 (including the free-spins)
Features = 18 (16 + 2 re-triggers - counted as 2 features to get true odds)
Average spins/feature = 165

Best feature return: Bet x 159.4 (see winner screenshots! )
Worst feature return: Bet x 20.8
Average feature return: Bet x 65.78

Despite that (and being 206 down after the first 11 days), I still managed to wager 1,580 throughout the month and come out the other end 19 up!
On top of that I also got 160 from the scratchcards

Full spreadsheet available on request!
KK

 

[Cesar]

My statistics today on "Ladies Nite".

Take note of the number of spins played. I only got 1 feature

I don't remember the exact point, but around spin number 250-260, so more than 900 spins without feature in the session and a 55% RTP.

Is normal for this slot??

I know 1200 spins is not enough in statistical perspective, but after reading this thread, I'm worried that somethig odd is going on

 

[retlaw]

I know 1200 spins is not enough in statistical perspective, but after reading this thread, I'm worried that somethig odd is going on

It is always the standard answer you get : not enough spins to be statistical relevant.Fact is that we never can play enough spins to prove there is something wrong .Unless in practice play, but I don't trust the figures generated by this play mode.
My question is: Why do so many players complain now and not a year ago?

 

[vinylweatherman]

My statistics today on "Ladies Nite".

Take note of the number of spins played. I only got 1 feature

I don't remember the exact point, but around spin number 250-260, so more than 900 spins without feature in the session and a 55% RTP.

Is normal for this slot??
I know 1200 spins is not enough in statistical perspective, but after reading this thread, I'm worried that somethig odd is going on

Sorry to say this, but yes, this broadly falls within what would be considered "normal", in the same sense that a retrigger within the 15 free spins is also "normal".

Naturally, if this was EVERY DAMN SESSION, then it would NOT be "normal".
The average is 150 spins between features (Zoozie came up with an accurate figure a while back).

1000+ is pretty dire, yet this has happened to be at it's clone Thunderstruck. I upped the bet & got wild hammers (1500x line bet), and got back all the losses - I moved on, STILL without a single bonus round.
What is even worse, is that MOST bonus rounds pay back almost nothing anyway, with an average of only 33x bet, and a variance that is sky high

 

[Rusty]

My luck has improved the last couple of Days but if it had got any worse I would have got no features and no returns.

Anyway after the summertime debacle I finally hit about $50 on the feature which clawed some of the losses back and then tried the new Christmas slot and hit a decent win on that so that probably pulled my payout back to around 90+% for Dec.
I am still going long sessions without triggering features though I am wondering if MG has changed the variance but not the overall payout.
Of course this would be impossible if the slots were not weighted.

My last session:
Avalon 645
Sure Win 130
currently 465 spins without feature.
so 2 features in over 1200 spins

For the record KK the number of spins is in between features and the slot is just the last slot I triggered the feature.
So Avalon was actually 585 and I had gone 60 spins on another slot before that.
I am calculating number of consecutive spins without a trigger all slots and I do not include bonus round triggers unless that is the main feature for the slot such as What on Earth.