How many people here truly believe slots to be random?

Haha I did! Just like to know people's opinion, I still enjoy playing them but I just find it hard to believe they're 100% random
 
Well, I can't believe there is no way it can be random if they say the RTP is a certain percentage! Ok, it's random in so far that you don't know what the next spin will be, so in theory how much more random can it be? The win/lose situation is determined upon the press of the spin button as opposed to how the reels fall, so that is not so random.
 
Exactly! The fact a slot says it has an RTP of say 96% must mean there's some sort of mechanism at work to make sure it pays that long term, so in theory it isn't random, it knows exactly what it's doing, it's just a very clever way of taking 4% of your money over a long period surely haha
 
Momma always said.......Random is as random does........online slots, the worlds greatest secrets.
 
After playing slots for many years I 100% believe there is no way they are random!

Firstly please discount social gaming slots, as these are quite often not random... mainly because they don't need to be....

Put simply, slots ARE random and I can all but guarantee this. But the easy mistake it to confuse the random selection of an outcome with a random outcome.

Let me explain with a simple example.

I have a bag with 10 balls in it. All the balls are numbered 1 to 10. I blindfold you and get you to select a ball. There is an equal chance of you pulling a 3 out of the bag. And because you were blindfold and couldn't have known what ball you were picking out, the outcome is random. Right?

Now I give you a bag with 12 balls in it. Ten of the balls are numbered 1 to 10, but there are an extra two balls both with the number 3 on then. You're still blindfolded, so your pick is still random, but now you have a higher chance of picked the number 3.

This is exactly how slots work... not every prize is distributed evenly... it can't be. But the outcome is still randomly determined. Using the ball example, after every spin of the slot, all the balls are put back in the bag and the next game, another random draw happens to get the result.

Does that make sense? Please feel free to ask any other questions this throws up if you still aren't sure or don't believe they are random and feel free to add further explanation as to why you feel they are not random if this doesn't dispel that myth.
 
Firstly please discount social gaming slots, as these are quite often not random... mainly because they don't need to be....

Put simply, slots ARE random and I can all but guarantee this. But the easy mistake it to confuse the random selection of an outcome with a random outcome.

Let me explain with a simple example.

I have a bag with 10 balls in it. All the balls are numbered 1 to 10. I blindfold you and get you to select a ball. There is an equal chance of you pulling a 3 out of the bag. And because you were blindfold and couldn't have known what ball you were picking out, the outcome is random. Right?

Now I give you a bag with 12 balls in it. Ten of the balls are numbered 1 to 10, but there are an extra two balls both with the number 3 on then. You're still blindfolded, so your pick is still random, but now you have a higher chance of picked the number 3.

This is exactly how slots work... not every prize is distributed evenly... it can't be. But the outcome is still randomly determined. Using the ball example, after every spin of the slot, all the balls are put back in the bag and the next game, another random draw happens to get the result.

Does that make sense? Please feel free to ask any other questions this throws up if you still aren't sure or don't believe they are random and feel free to add further explanation as to why you feel they are not random if this doesn't dispel that myth.

I´d like to inquire further on your example. Does this mean that there are 500000 balls (winning combos) but some of them exist more often? So lets say a 10 cent win ball, does it exist 1000x more often than a 1000€ win or is every possible win is just 1 ball? If so, 10 cent wins shouldn´t be so frequent, so I assume its the first option. Is that correct?

In terms of a feature, you usually get much better hits than with the base game, is that because they lower paying "balls" are removed in the feature or there are just a higher amount of big "balls" :D ?
 
Uh oh, you said the 'R' word :eek:

Is it worse than the "F" or "L" word? :D:D

And to respond on the topic.
No, I do not believe slots are random.
It depends what you classify as random but for a slot to achieve it's advertised RTP it cannot be random in my eyes.

Also, and I am sure lots of people agree:

How many of you have hit let's say a 1000x + stake win on a slot and very shortly after another one on that very same slot.
Be sure, your personal RTP might be skyhigh after that first win and I believe there is no chance in hell that slot will "give" you another mega win.
It might happen but I would say the chances are 1 in a billion. :)

Too many people also get very cold streaks after a massive win, all a coincidence? :eek2::eek2:
 
A good video that helps explain RNG's (or at least the one PokerStars use) can be found
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.
.

(If you want to skip the intro, the detail starts at 1m 05s in & explains how their software combines 2 completely separate and independent sources of hardware input to determine results).
 
Exactly! The fact a slot says it has an RTP of say 96% must mean there's some sort of mechanism at work to make sure it pays that long term, so in theory it isn't random, it knows exactly what it's doing, it's just a very clever way of taking 4% of your money over a long period surely haha
Sorry, but I'm fed up with hearing nonsense like this. :(
But not so rare or surprising from someone in the UK who has grown up with HIGHLY RIGGED, compensated fruit machines all over the place!

Saying a slot can't be random and achieve 96% RTP is EXACTLY the same as saying a Roulette Wheel can't be random and achieve 97.3% RTP.
It's just basic mathematics (but on a pretty big scale in the case of slots!).

Having said that, to answer the original question:
I personally believe that the early slots (pre-2010-ish) are mostly what I call "truly random" in that each real stops 100% randomly in any position on the reel strip (at least, those from MG, NetEnt, Playtech, WGS, Rival and RTG).
In recent years I believe SOME slots are not "truly random" but many are more like a scratchcard game - the final result is determined by 1 random number instead of 1 number per reel.
IGT games for example, are 100% NOT truly random - the gimped reels totally give this away.
And having said THAT - they ARE still random in the same way that a scratchcard is random, in that the overall RTP is achieved fairly and you have an equal chance of any win from any spin. i.e. they are not compensated.

In essence, I believe the vast majority of online slots ARE random, but in different ways.
I would have said all - but having played Blueprint and Barcrest slots online - I seriously doubt the randomness of the mechanisms they use.
Especially Barcrest's Centurion - if that IS properly random, it's TRTP must be about 60%! :mad:

KK
 
Put simply, slots ARE random and I can all but guarantee this.

I wonder. Your explanation works fine for 'simple' slots, like the original Thunderstruck. But extra 'random' features like 'T-Rex Alert' on Jurassic Park cloud things a bit. It isn't the result of 3 scatters or something similar, i.e. not a reel configuration.
 
IGT games for example, are 100% NOT truly random - the gimped reels totally give this away.


KK

I work at IGT and I can categorically say they ARE 100% random....
 
I wonder. Your explanation works fine for 'simple' slots, like the original Thunderstruck. But extra 'random' features like 'T-Rex Alert' on Jurassic Park cloud things a bit. It isn't the result of 3 scatters or something similar, i.e. not a reel configuration.

Extra features such as the t-rex alert still occur randomly (based on a chance) and the outcomes in the this feature are still picked randomly.

Remember this - random DOES NOT MEAN equally weighted. It doesn't mean you have the same chance of getting 3 cherries as 3 wilds...

However if the chance of 3 cherries is 5% and the chance of 3 wilds is 1% then this chance is constant and the same on every spin.
 
In essence, I believe the vast majority of online slots ARE random, but in different ways.
I would have said all - but having played Blueprint and Barcrest slots online - I seriously doubt the randomness of the mechanisms they use.
Especially Barcrest's Centurion - if that IS properly random, it's TRTP must be about 60%! :mad:

KK

I assume you mean Inspired's Centurion... Which a good friend of mine was the producer on... I can tell you it is random.

Which Blueprint / Barcrest methods are you referring to...
 
Says you, but why should I believe that? What if there's a simple line of code like 'if RTP > 95 no more T_Rex' :)

RTP for what? You? The whole game?
Why would they need to do that?

Look it's pretty simple...

Games are mathematically balanced to hit the TRTP... We don't need to put in lines of code like that because maths dictates that over time the game will ALWAYS hit the TRTP. I'll never change your mind if you believe it's rigged just like people who believe in Chemtrails or 9/11false flag or religion. You believe what you want to believe. I do this day in day out and have done for 21 years and I know how these games work.

Do I know every company... No of course not... There might be some dodgy ones... But I guarantee you that 99% of all games you play are random and fair.

Please understand that does NOT mean they play well and that does not mean they won't FEEL hot and cold at times.

To answer a previous post.. Of course a game will feel like it's on a cold streak after a 1000x win... Those are unbelievably rare in any game and to get another one straight after or even close after is probably not far off 100m to 1 if not a billion to one.

You can discuss on here till you're blue in the face the non-randomness of games and that's fine.. But take it from someone who does this day in day out that they are random... That means every game is independent, every win is possible on every spin and the outcome is drawn randomly from all possible outcomes. And yes some outcomes may have multiple possibilities to be drawn as per my bag of balls explanation.
 
Bloody hell... You have too much money to spend lol

Well that was over a period of a few months and a lot of sessions of course.
This was basicly my final balance on that slot when I decided to give up on it.
I do not give up quickly on a slot but Cleo Plus beat me hands down.
What a vile piece of work from IGT that was, sorry to say that and no disrespect towards you. ;):D

I have seen massive wins on it from others so it can pay, never did for me tho. :-(
 
I work at IGT and I can categorically say they ARE 100% random....
Please read my post again.
I said they are random, but not "truly random" by my definition of that term.
You can not deny that.

Anyone who's played Golden Goddess for example, could not fail to notice how you don't see ANY Roses on the middle 3 reels for ages, then suddenly they are everywhere! Same with the other stacked characters too.

KK
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Meister Ratings

Back
Top