Your Input Please FOBTs stake reduction brought forward.

dunover

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The government (after pressure by some its own MP's) has abandoned the delayed reduction to £2 max bets which was due to arrive October 2019 and it's now starting in April. Good. :lolup:
 

snorky510238

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The government (after pressure by some its own MP's) has abandoned the delayed reduction to £2 max bets which was due to arrive October 2019 and it's now starting in April. Good. :lolup:
I should think so too. Still 15 years to late IMO because the damage they have done to two of my friends is irreparable. A couple of other friends whose self exclusions have expired have both received personal phone calls from the local betting shop manager telling them they are free to walk back in and there is a new promotion they may be interested in concerning slot play ( both used to be (£100 a spin roulette merchants) I find that totally shocking as they have kicked the habit and now prefer to come with me to the land based casino and have a real chance of winning. I sincerely hope nobody ever plays another FOBT ever, they are the scum of the gambling world and I would truly love to see them wiped off the face of the planet.
 

goatwack

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Amazing what these politicians would love to get away with given half a chance, were they not pressured into not doing so.

And of course it's not a reflective moral awakening, it's in view to being seen to do the popular thing, for upcoming vote-swinging :D
 

dunover

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Amazing what these politicians would love to get away with given half a chance, were they not pressured into not doing so.

And of course it's not a reflective moral awakening, it's in view to being seen to do the popular thing, for upcoming vote-swinging :D
I'd be up for just some straightforward swinging.
 

goatwack

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The Tories would be up for that no doubt, just look at the likes of David Mellor & co. Anything goes :D
 

Reelsoffun

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I still remember my mate taking me to show me FOBTs soon after they came out and was gobsmacked as I watched him win 15k that afternoon, and by that weekend he was 25k up.

Of course it didnt last and before the next month was out he had lost it all, plus his savings.

Fast forward another 6 months he lost everything else, job, car, wife, friends, house and bankrupt the lot.........


Pure evil, I have never put a penny in them myself but can easily see how dangerous they were/are so this news is good that they moving it quicker, they had no business being on the high street in the first place.
 

mack341

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south east england
was the roulette limited to a £500 jackpot as well on these fobts? Its mad to think politicians/regulators ever thought it was a good idea people in poor areas could do £100 bets every 20 seconds on computerised roulette [what is the name for this type of game, video/electronic roulette :confused:].

I think bearing in mind christmas is coming up the stake reduction should come in now to prevent more misery for unsuspecting families, the bookies have got loads of money and also made colossal amounts [hundreds of millions, possibly billions] from these games during the last 12+ years they've had them running.

I suspect the GOVT knew all along they'd be an uproar that the £2 stake limit wasn't being introduced ASAP, and on purpose set the date to Oct 2019 to give them wriggle room to negotiate back to April 2019 and make it look like they've listened and compromised, but in reality they've just given the bookies another 6 months they shouldn't have to fill their boots.
 

shadow123

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Saddest thing is that the government say they going to increase the tax on online gaming to
compensate for the "lost" revenue, cheeky or what,the revenue never existed until these
machines of satan were introduced and now they think they are entitled to the tax
in one form or another forever.At the end of the day the it will be the gambler who will
still provide this revenue as the casino operators can only absorb a portion of the increased tax
and will have to increase their earnings to pay the rest
 

snorky510238

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was the roulette limited to a £500 jackpot as well on these fobts? Its mad to think politicians/regulators ever thought it was a good idea people in poor areas could do £100 bets every 20 seconds on computerised roulette [what is the name for this type of game, video/electronic roulette :confused:].

I think bearing in mind christmas is coming up the stake reduction should come in now to prevent more misery for unsuspecting families, the bookies have got loads of money and also made colossal amounts [hundreds of millions, possibly billions] from these games during the last 12+ years they've had them running.

I suspect the GOVT knew all along they'd be an uproar that the £2 stake limit wasn't being introduced ASAP, and on purpose set the date to Oct 2019 to give them wriggle room to negotiate back to April 2019 and make it look like they've listened and compromised, but in reality they've just given the bookies another 6 months they shouldn't have to fill their boots.
Yes the most you could have straight up on a number was £13.80 and you could make it up to £500 max with a bit on the street of corner. The thing is despite what anybody says or tells you it certainly doesn’t pay out 97.3% and is definitely not random. It is one of the biggest scams ever. People have literally been ROBBED blind by these atrocities and it’s been allowed to happen. The only excuse that can be made for the people who have allowed this is they don’t know any better and have no knowledge and are totally oblivious to reality when it comes to FairPlay. They have voted with their pockets. Another thing is where or who are the governing bodies responsible for checking these things out? That they run at the percentages stated because if roulette doesn’t run at 97.3% and it doesn’t then it’s obviously rigged yet nobody has ever been brought to task over it. Which tells me there are either no governing bodies doing these checks, the programmers are a step ahead of them or they like brown envelopes with £50’s inside.
 

zreb

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Not being from the UK, someone care to explain why there's so much animosity towards these machines? Why they should be any more hated than a normal casino? Is it the locations? Somehow worse than being able to bet from your own computer? Dishonest/targeted advertising towards problem gamblers? Concerns about RNG integrity? Just annoying to have them on every street corner?

I know it's painful to see problem gamblers ruin their lives, but I don't see what makes it so different from other types of gambling. At least a 2.7% house edge game (if honest) would be much better than you'd expect to find at most places outside a real casino - meanwhile there are people dumping their money into state lotteries with a 50% house edge + additional taxes if you win.
 

electronictonic

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The timing of this is not a coincidence..announced on the same day a Brexit deal reached, start of a new tax year in April
 

Kerply

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its about bloody time imo.

the bookies are no longer bookies anymore, they couldnt care less about the sport betting, and quite happily empty machine after machine of notes whilst taking nothing on proper bets.

hopefully now all the bookies should have to fight to get back all the sports customers they have pissed off over the years just to keep their multiple shops open in one town.

I mean, when was the last time you saw a bookie full of people watching the racing, or having proper bets? the only people i see in there these days are the people stuffing the FOBT's, and are purely the ones keeping the current amount of shops alive
 

Kerply

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@zreb all of the above. you can spin away thousands of pounds in less than an hour with the computer pumping out losing number after losing number. many of the machines in the bookies have been smashed up by irate customers over the years, but the bookies dont do anything about it as they want them to come back to do it again, so unless there was something major that happened, the bookies wouldn't pursue it with the authorities. I think that says a lot in itself.

I no longer even look at them, but I do remember years ago playing them and covering just about every number on the roulette wheel, and the amount of times it spins that one number that you dont have, or the one you have the lowest amount on is just literally unbelievable. its really something you have to see to believe. I know people will say yeah its a computer, or yeah these things happen live as well, but its very much different to me.

its up there with being rivered on pokerstars every hand!
 

electronictonic

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its about bloody time imo.

the bookies are no longer bookies anymore, they couldnt care less about the sport betting, and quite happily empty machine after machine of notes whilst taking nothing on proper bets.

hopefully now all the bookies should have to fight to get back all the sports customers they have pissed off over the years just to keep their multiple shops open in one town.

I mean, when was the last time you saw a bookie full of people watching the racing, or having proper bets? the only people i see in there these days are the people stuffing the FOBT's, and are purely the ones keeping the current amount of shops alive


The reason nobody bets on the horses in the shops is the pain in the arse when trying to get a decent sized bet on, they phone up and make a trading decision, so most people use exchances.
 

snorky510238

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@zreb all of the above. you can spin away thousands of pounds in less than an hour with the computer pumping out losing number after losing number. many of the machines in the bookies have been smashed up by irate customers over the years, but the bookies dont do anything about it as they want them to come back to do it again, so unless there was something major that happened, the bookies wouldn't pursue it with the authorities. I think that says a lot in itself.

I no longer even look at them, but I do remember years ago playing them and covering just about every number on the roulette wheel, and the amount of times it spins that one number that you dont have, or the one you have the lowest amount on is just literally unbelievable. its really something you have to see to believe. I know people will say yeah its a computer, or yeah these things happen live as well, but its very much different to me.

its up there with being rivered on pokerstars every hand!
Yes have to agree with everything stated in this post. I spent a lot of time studying the behaviour of FOBTS and low rolling the roulette on mammoth sessions to see how these things played out. In my time doing so I got to know a lot of big hitters (£100) a spin merchants. I would watch their play also. I was left in no doubt whatsoever these things are hideously rigged. I have seen it all. You would have to be away with the fairies to not realise what’s going on. There is not a chance the roulette pays out anywhere near 97.3%. I remember meeting a guy who would come in every Friday evening with about £2,000 and play red or black £100 a spin. No matter what he did the machine beat him every time. If he stuck with red the machine would throw out 15 consecutive blacks and so on. It was just blatantly rigged. Yes you can get these freak occurrences live but they happen once in a blue moon not every day and not every time you are doing the complete opposite. I could give you a list of events I have witnessed that are truly beyond belief. In contrast I have played live roulette at the casino regularly for years and I haven’t got a single story to tell that would amaze you. Imo these things play like they are super compensated as in once they have xpounds in the sack they pay out x% like nothing you have ever seen then they will take constantly until they have enough banked to repeat the process. The only thing we will never know is the true percentage these things paid out but if you did I guarantee you would be astounded.
 

CasinoNinja

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Not being from the UK, someone care to explain why there's so much animosity towards these machines? Why they should be any more hated than a normal casino? Is it the locations? Somehow worse than being able to bet from your own computer? Dishonest/targeted advertising towards problem gamblers? Concerns about RNG integrity? Just annoying to have them on every street corner?

I know it's painful to see problem gamblers ruin their lives, but I don't see what makes it so different from other types of gambling. At least a 2.7% house edge game (if honest) would be much better than you'd expect to find at most places outside a real casino - meanwhile there are people dumping their money into state lotteries with a 50% house edge + additional taxes if you win.


The main reasons they are way more accessible than casinos, they are everywhere.
And the roulette is one thing where the RTP is consistent, but their slots which a major population plays are all the way down to 86%!!
Their highest RTP on newer slots is 91% on a £2 stake, so you are bound to lose.
 

ChopleyIOM

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@zreb all of the above. you can spin away thousands of pounds in less than an hour with the computer pumping out losing number after losing number. many of the machines in the bookies have been smashed up by irate customers over the years, but the bookies dont do anything about it as they want them to come back to do it again, so unless there was something major that happened, the bookies wouldn't pursue it with the authorities. I think that says a lot in itself.

Yep they literally just wheel out the broken machine and replace it with another, don't even take action against the player, because they know the player will be back the next day losing more - it's acceptable collateral damage for them to get smashed up.

They never had any place on the high street, a single bookmaker chain would open up multiple branches in the same town centre to get around the four machines per location limit, just to get more of these things out there.

Referred to as the 'crack cocaine' of gambling, and with good reason. If these things had existed during my darkest gambling days, I wouldn't have come out the other side.

EDIT - Timestamped links don't seem to work, skip to 45m44s

Direct link to the 'smashing up' montage at the end of one of my videos -
 

shadow123

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Will be very interesting to see how the games developers and bookies handle the reduction,I am sure as we
speak there will be a lot of brainstorming on how to keep some decent revenue flowing from the FOBT,s
there may quite possibly be some loopholes in the new regulations which could be exploited and authorities
would probably not be over zealous in their scrutiny.Never quite worked out how they managed to get
away with £50 super spins on the slot games.I presume these will also be banned.
With roulette on £2,they will somehow have to find a way of paying out £500 on a single
game,possibly spinning more than once a game and allowing accummulating chances to get over the £70
max payout on the standard game.
If the roulette cant be made to work,it will spell the end of the machines, I remember when they first introduced
into Corals,they took nothing, as soon as roulette appeared on them, you could not get on the machines
all day.
In the worst (or best) case I can see mass closures of bookies and a lot of derelict high streets, the market for
traditional sports betting has been in decline for years and only a small percentage of shops will remain profitable
 

snorky510238

Chief glockenspiel maker
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Jan 12, 2018
Location
Uk
Will be very interesting to see how the games developers and bookies handle the reduction,I am sure as we
speak there will be a lot of brainstorming on how to keep some decent revenue flowing from the FOBT,s
there may quite possibly be some loopholes in the new regulations which could be exploited and authorities
would probably not be over zealous in their scrutiny.Never quite worked out how they managed to get
away with £50 super spins on the slot games.I presume these will also be banned.
With roulette on £2,they will somehow have to find a way of paying out £500 on a single
game,possibly spinning more than once a game and allowing accummulating chances to get over the £70
max payout on the standard game.
If the roulette cant be made to work,it will spell the end of the machines, I remember when they first introduced
into Corals,they took nothing, as soon as roulette appeared on them, you could not get on the machines
all day.
In the worst (or best) case I can see mass closures of bookies and a lot of derelict high streets, the market for
traditional sports betting has been in decline for years and only a small percentage of shops will remain profitable
This is so very true. The only reason bookies started opening late at night was because of FOBTS. Some shops would have probably struggled to take £100 on sports bets but could take around £10,000 on FOBTS. They totally reshaped the gambling industry in the UK. The roulette as you say being the catalyst. I don’t go into betting shops that often nowadays as apart from catching up with old friends there is no attraction for me. I occasionally bet on football but I can do that online. However when I do visit the FOBTS are nowhere near as busy as they were 10 years ago. This is mainly due to the fact that all the big hitters have lost so much money they have either run out or self excluded. I don’t think slot players alone will be enough to keep all shops open. One of my friends to whom money is no object openly admitted to losing £100,000 in a single year on the roulette. Another who doesn’t even play roulette would regularly lose £1,000 a day just on slots. It was sickening to watch and I particularly remember one day when he played gladiator at £2 a spin. £964 in he got his first feature and was hoping just to get a reasonable amount of his money back. It paid £26. This story is not unique by any means.
 
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