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Casino Complaint EuroSlots does not pay 1700EUR - Is this fair?

Discussion in 'Casino Complaints - Non-Bonus Issues' started by palapaisti, Feb 16, 2013.

    Feb 16, 2013
  1. palapaisti

    palapaisti Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Pro gambler
    Location:
    Finland
    I transfered my PlayCherry account to EuroSlots two weeks ago. I deposited 100EUR, got 200EUR bonus. I played slots
    for hours and won 1700EUR. Unfortunately, they will not pay me because I'm on holiday in Thailand and they have the
    following rule in T&C:

    "PLAYCHERRY does not accept Player registrations and / or deposits and / or play from the following countries:
    American Samoa, Bonaire, France, French Guiana, French Polynesia, Guadeloupe, Guam, Martinique,
    New Caledonia, Reunion, Saint Barthelemy, Saint Martin (French), Saint Pierre and Miquelon, East Timor,
    United States of America, Wallis and Futuna, Italy, Spain, the Netherlands, Denmark, Israel, Belgium and Thailand."

    I still don't feel that it's fair to use that rule for me:

    1) That rule is on "4.1. Account registration" section. I did not read it because I did not need to register
    (I have had PlayCherry accout for long time). PlayCherry did not have any rule for playing from Thailand -
    I played many times. My home country is not on the restricted country list.

    2) They allowed me to transfer my account, login and play without any problems. Now they were just freerolling
    with my money. If I had lost, they would have kept the money. Now when I won, they just returned my deposit.
    Easy money for casino... If they have that kind of rule, they should notify players who login from restricted
    country.

    3) There is no difference for the casino, if I have played from my home country instead of Thailand.

    Do you think it was fair to confiscate my winnings?
     
  2. Feb 16, 2013
  3. miso

    miso Meister Member MM

    Occupation:
    accountant
    Location:
    Ireland
    Well, I don`t think it is easy money for the casino, since they returned your deposit.
    I am sorry you didn`t get paid, but the terms are clear and you should have read them.
    Don`t hold onto PlayCherry rules, you did not play there.
    But one thing is true, they should not have let you play or deposit from a restricted territory.
     
  4. Feb 16, 2013
  5. ilovejesus

    ilovejesus Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    goldsmith
    Location:
    GREAT BRITAIN
    hi

    i agree with you the terms are clear and you should have read them. i played there never took any bonus casinos ok
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2013
    1 person likes this.
  6. Feb 16, 2013
  7. EuroSlots

    EuroSlots I-Gaming Industry Representative

    Occupation:
    Casino Manager
    Location:
    Malta
    The outcome of our investigation confirmed that the customer has knowingly breached our Terms & Conditions by both depositing/withdrawing through a Swedish VPN while in Thailand and by playing from Thailand.
    Failed deposit attempts were made and correctly blocked by our security system, however, a VPN was then used to bypass our security systems.

    We have clear guidelines in our Terms & Conditions that we do not accept player registrations and / or deposits and / or gameplay from Thailand, that includes customers accessing the site from a Thai IP.
    Evidence has shown that customer has been using VPN to bypass our security systems to deposit and that game play was made from Thailand.
    Having this said – if a VPN had not been used for the purpose of bypassing our security system, there would not have been a deposit nor gameplay in the first place.

    When accounts were migrated from PlayCherry to EuroSlots,Terms & Conditions were presented to all customers. Customers could either choose to accept these Terms & Conditions or choose to opt out and not have their account migrated to EuroSlots.
    By choosing to migrate their account customer/s have also agreed that they will adhere to the new Terms & Conditions.

    Fredrik
     
    9 people like this.
  8. Feb 16, 2013
  9. mrmark21

    mrmark21 Meister Member

    Occupation:
    Telecommunications Consultant
    Location:
    australia
    That's good to know. I was on vacation in Thailand recently and played a few spins at the hotel before going to bed (different casino). Does that go for all online casinos that you can't play while inside that country?
     
  10. Feb 16, 2013
  11. miso

    miso Meister Member MM

    Occupation:
    accountant
    Location:
    Ireland
    Not necessarily Mark, but Ive seen Thailand restricted at a lot of casinos, but as usual it says residents of. I would assume that while you are in a country, it doesn`t matter for how long, be it a holiday or 6 months. You are residing and thats it.
    Check with your favourite casinos before going somewhere. I remember playing Bet365 on holidays and after few spins the support asked me
    to proof my identity, to make sure no one has hacked my account from another country. I was actually quite impressed when it happened.
     
    1 person likes this.
  12. Feb 16, 2013
  13. clees42

    clees42 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    oulu
    I would not play at a casino that would refuse my deposits while on a trip.
     
  14. Feb 16, 2013
  15. palapaisti

    palapaisti Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Pro gambler
    Location:
    Finland
    Why do you think I have knowingly breached T&C? In that case, it would be very stupid not to use VPN all time time... I thought the problem was with my ISP so I tried to use VPN. The deposit page was just stuck, I did not get any information that I would not be allowed to deposit from Thailand.

    This is all true, I have told all the time that I'm in Thailand. The only thing that you tried to block was the deposit (but I did not get any infomation about that). All the gameplay, logins and account transfer was done from Thai IP.

    As an old Playcherry customer I don't feel fair that the rule was hidden in the "4.1. Account registration" section. This is the only casino I have seen that does not allow play from Thailand (many do not allow Thai residents). What's the difference for you if I have played from Finland instead of Thailand? Why you really need to be strict about this rule? Especially when your system let me login and play from Thai IP (and I did not get any warning when trying to deposit from Thai IP).
     
  16. Feb 16, 2013
  17. palapaisti

    palapaisti Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Pro gambler
    Location:
    Finland
    That was my second biggest slots win ever... first time in any slots I got 5 scatters on one spin. Hurts to lose that :(

    [​IMG]

    The first time I noticed that rule was when I tried to make a withdrawal. I got some error message (maybe just "error" but a message anyway - when depositing I did not get any message...). That did not appear when I tried to use VPN and withdraw. After that I realized that withdrawal from Thai IP was blocked so I rechecked the T&C and found the rule. Anyway I thought it is better to tell them the truth that I'm on holiday in Thailand. I always thought PlayCherry as very reputable company, so I was pretty sure I would receive my winnings because they let me play anyway from Thai IP and it does not make any difference for them if I'm in Thailand or Finland.
     
  18. Feb 16, 2013
  19. mn001

    mn001 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Troll
    Location:
    Casino
    So you could deposit and play with a thai ip? You didnt use VPN until withdrawal? If so I think you should be paid since they allowed a thai IP to deposit and play.

    But they say you deposited through a VPN. If thats true you should not be paid.

    Just my 2 cents
     
  20. Feb 16, 2013
  21. palapaisti

    palapaisti Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Pro gambler
    Location:
    Finland
    Deposit was through a VPN too. When I was trying to deposit the page got stuck (I did not get any kind of error message). I thought the problem was with my ISP so I opened VPN. If I had got any kind of error message, I would have understood that EuroSlots tried to block my deposit (like I noticed when withdrawing). All logins to casino and play was from Thai IP, they did not block it.

    Quite unlucky anyway to win that much on the only casino that have "no play from Thailand" rule....
     
  22. Feb 16, 2013
  23. Sovietsky

    Sovietsky Senior Member

    Occupation:
    Live
    Location:
    Swe
    Best thing would be if they closed your account and contacted you.
     
  24. Feb 16, 2013
  25. Mouche12

    Mouche12 Kitty Lover PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Translator and facilities manager
    Location:
    Amsterdam
    I agree, but apparently their security did not work that well. This is a sour story and I do feel for the OP. Why do players always seem to win (big) and subsequently face serious issues when it comes to withdrawing their winnings?

    I know, I know, residents of Thailand are not allowed to register/play at this casino, but strictly speaking the OP is a resident of Finland and was on holiday in Thailand. He can prove this with his passport and utility bill, airline tickets etc. Do we need a legal definition of the word "resident"? The T&Cs do not take into account that legitimate players may want to gamble while on holiday in a country that is banned by the casino.
     
  26. Feb 16, 2013
  27. LaHutti

    LaHutti Sr. ÜberUnter Ass. Man. webby PABnonaccred PABaccred

    Occupation:
    .
    Location:
    East and West
    I'm sorry, but if you use means ... like seperate software, to hide where you are, you are fully aware of what you are doing.

    If deposit page gets stuck, contact CS and ask them why, instead of trying to bypass it, and I'm sure they would have told you, that you couldn't play from Thailand. Had the deposit gone through in a "normal" manner, the situation would be different, but it didn't.
    Using software to force a deposit through, tells me ....and apparently the casino, that you wanted to do excactly that.

    So in my opinion, the casino is right this time...sorry to see you lose a nice win, but you asked for it imo.
     
    6 people like this.
  28. Feb 16, 2013
  29. palapaisti

    palapaisti Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Pro gambler
    Location:
    Finland
    In Thailand all web pages do not load with some ISPs. That's why I use VPN many times here. And I did not definitely try to hide where I am. Support is very clueless about those things. After I was not able to withdraw, I went to the chat and asked about it. They told to clear cookies etc. They did not see that I was in Thailand. Of course this was my fault too, but still they had many chances to not allow me to play (login, loading slots, transferring account). If they have had any message when I tried to deposit from Thai IP this have never happened.
     
  30. Feb 16, 2013
  31. Nifty29

    Nifty29 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    PAID CASINO SHILL
    Location:
    Turn right, then right. then right again
    If you read the rules again, it does not state only residents of Thailand.....it says "play" from Thailand as well.....so that means it doesn't matter if you're a Thai resident or a poo salesman from Mombasa. The play itself is banned.
     
  32. Feb 17, 2013
  33. mrmark21

    mrmark21 Meister Member

    Occupation:
    Telecommunications Consultant
    Location:
    australia
    You should always read the T&C and had you done that you wouldnt even be in this situation at the moment.

    Each and every online casino has a set of rules. You may not have intentionally broken them but regardless you still did. The information was disclosed to you prior too making you're deposit.

    I was on vacation a while back in Thailand. Had a few spins, didn't win much (luckily). However had I won but failed to read the T&C then that would have been my problem, the casino had explained that to me before I made a deposit...

    Always read the T&C :)

    P.s. Can't help feeling a bit like Mr Wonka from Charlie and the Chocolate Factory 'you broke the rules' ;)
     
  34. Feb 17, 2013
  35. Mouche12

    Mouche12 Kitty Lover PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Translator and facilities manager
    Location:
    Amsterdam
    Point taken, if the T&Cs mention "play from [banned country] as well, then the casino is in its right to forfeit any winnings. At least the deposit was returned.
     
  36. Feb 17, 2013
  37. palapaisti

    palapaisti Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Pro gambler
    Location:
    Finland
    Yep, this was an expensive lesson to read T&C very carefully in the future. I just couldn't expect any casino have that kind of rule. The rule was put under "4.1. Account registration" and I did not need to register to their site...

    Anyway, if casino has this kind of rule, it should then not let people to play from a restricted country - otherwise they are just freerolling with players' money. As mn001 told, it would be clear that they should pay if I had not used VPN. I guess the VPN is reason that they think I "knowingly breached their Terms & Conditions". But I had no idea that they tried to block the deposit, because I did not get any error message while trying to deposit from Thai IP. And I was all the time able to login and play from Thai IP. They can also check that I went to the chat to ask why I was not able to withdraw (I would have asked from chat about the deposit too if I had got any error message)

    So according to T&C they can confiscate my winnings. That I already knew, I wanted to know if this was fair behavior from the casino. I still don't think it was fair to use that rule against me.
     
  38. Feb 17, 2013
  39. Mouche12

    Mouche12 Kitty Lover PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Translator and facilities manager
    Location:
    Amsterdam
    Perhaps the T&Cs should include a section on legitimate players (already registered) playing from other countries than their own (place of residence). You may want to consult a lawyer if you're willing to spend the money... just to make sure that there is no doubt whatsoever that the casino was in its right to confiscate your winnings.
     

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