does anyone really know?

lucky21

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 12, 2006
Location
australia
Hi all
I have asked this question a few times but it seems no one wants to answer, know one knows or i am seen as a bad loser who doesnt except what online casinos are giving us, does anyone know if blackjack online is a true reflection of the land based game, this is not because i have lost lots of money, i have lost a little but won lots, why am i windging, well because of the wierd plays that happen in online Blackjack i had a record 25 lost hands in a row yesterday i also had 10 lost hands in a row where i was playing all five hands and the dealer beat all my hands 10 times in a row, this was not at a casino listed here but i have had similar things happen at casinomeister casinos where basic strategy goes out the window for hours and hours on end dealer getting 21 from and up card of 3,4,or 5 , if these things where happening in a land based casino no one would sit down, does anyone know if online casinos are able to set there payouts on BJ weather they be set hi or low if they can be set at all would answer my question as to why i get such strange card play, and i dont mean for someone to play 10 hands betting big and getting a good run then saying seems ok to me,
does anyone know?
Thanks Lucky
 

The Watchdog

Dormant account
Joined
May 5, 2006
Location
Costa Rica
No way

Black Jack online is not even close to black jack played on land based casinos

Here is why:

In most online casinos Black Jack is shuffled every hand. (this will make it 100% different... unless you are playing with a shuffler) Personally I hate shufflers.

Black Jack payout may differ from the amount of decks used. Well, you should always ask this. More decks, the harder the game. Some times in onlien casinos you are not aware how many decks they are using. TRY TO FIND SINGLE DECK BLACK JACKS.

In land based casinos you play black jack among with other players, this will affect your game in a way you can't imagine. Some one's call might change totally how the game develops.

The game rules might be similar, however is a 100% different experience playing it live that online.
 

Scooter7

Dormant Account
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Location
Toronto
The Watchdog said:
Black Jack online is not even close to black jack played on land based casinos

Here is why:

In most online casinos Black Jack is shuffled every hand. (this will make it 100% different... unless you are playing with a shuffler) Personally I hate shufflers.

A CSM (continuous shuffle machine) or an online casino that shuffles after every hand are very marginally better for a basic strategy player.

They eliminate all manner of advantage that a card counter could gather, but the little-known fact is that BS players are better off.
 

Scooter7

Dormant Account
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Location
Toronto
The Watchdog said:
In land based casinos you play black jack among with other players, this will affect your game in a way you can't imagine. Some one's call might change totally how the game develops.

In the long run, the most obtuse, witless blackjack player has absolutely no effect on your results.

In the short term, your mileage may vary :lolup:

Another factor to consider is that you are far more likely to remember the hand that the clueless wonder on third base made you lose than the one that his equally moronic play helped you win;)
 

bpb

Banned User - repeated violations of rule 1.14 (tr
PABnonaccred
PABnorogue
Joined
Jun 17, 2004
Location
Haverhill
I would guess that people aren't responding to your posts because they are extremely hard to read. You need to use capitalization and punctuation. Paragraphs are good too.


One of the following is true

1) Online blackjack games act exactly like their B&M counterparts, and you're going to lose a small percentage of your total action in the long run due to the house advantage

2) Online blackjack games are rigged, and you're going to lose a larger percentage of your total action than you would in the same B&M game.


1) is only marginally better than 2) in my opinion, so I'm not going to lose sleep over whether the games are fair.
 

bpb

Banned User - repeated violations of rule 1.14 (tr
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PABnorogue
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Location
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Scooter7 said:
They eliminate all manner of advantage that a card counter could gather, but the little-known fact is that BS players are better off.

I never considered this before. I assume this is because the majority of your plays will be the theoretically optimal ones, as basic strategy is derived from optimal plays off the top of a fresh shoe. Whereas in a shoe game, you'll encounter fluctuating counts where the optimal play is no longer the basic strategy play.
 

Scooter7

Dormant Account
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Location
Toronto
bpb said:
I never considered this before. I assume this is because the majority of your plays will be the theoretically optimal ones, as basic strategy is derived from optimal plays off the top of a fresh shoe. Whereas in a shoe game, you'll encounter fluctuating counts where the optimal play is no longer the basic strategy play.

I believe that's the mathematical basis.

Keep in mind, however, that the effect is so small that it isn't likely to be statistically significant.
 

Linus

Dormant account
Joined
Feb 26, 2005
Location
TX
The chances of losing 25 in a row are something on the order of one out of 33 million, according to my (quite possibly faulty) math.

As far as whether it's rigged... well, mostly casinos use software from 3 or 4 major software providers. Given chance, I don't doubt that some casino operators would rig the software in their favor. But, to my understanding, the big software providers don't allow it. (And if they did, I can't imagine that that secret wouldn't out.) So the bottom line, is that, probably, if you're at a Crypto, or a Playtech, or MG, you're relatively safe... at least from cheating software.

Now, if you're at a site that has control over its software, like, for example Odds On/EH... well, I suspect you're less safe.
 

TheBloke

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Joined
Mar 9, 2005
Location
London
lucky21 said:
where i was playing all five hands and the dealer beat all my hands 10 times in a row, this was not at a casino listed here but i have had similar things happen at casinomeister casinos

So you lost 50 hands in a row?

If I am calculating this correctly, the odds of that is 9 trillion to one. I would leave this casino at a very great pace. Who is it?

Maths/excel people - I am using the following formula, is this correct (give or take a couple of % on the win probability)?
=BINOMDIST(0,50,48%,TRUE)
 
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lucky21

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 12, 2006
Location
australia
bet on bet

Thanks for everyones input.

The casino I am refering to is betonbet, does anyone know much about them.
I used them because they send winnings back to your neteller acct instantly.
They use Net Entertainment software
 

phynqster

Experienced Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2004
Location
los angeles, ca
Another thing that nobody pointed out is the speed of the game. You do not realize how fast the game is on line, espessially when the house is grinding out their % every hand. In a land based casino a player would never stay at the same table and sit after losing 25 hands in a row, unless the dealer was wearing a very low cut top.
 

carramrod

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 23, 2006
Location
West coast
TheBloke said:
So you lost 50 hands in a row?

If I am calculating this correctly, the odds of that is 9 trillion to one. I would leave this casino at a very great pace. Who is it?

This is incorrect. The 50 hands are not all completely independent of one-another. Each group of 5 hands are very coorelated because they all face the same dealer up-card and final hand.

It's still very unlikely if this indeed did happen, but nothing near 9-trillion-to-one.
 

franklin

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Joined
May 18, 2006
Location
New York
TheBloke said:
So you lost 50 hands in a row?

If I am calculating this correctly, the odds of that is 9 trillion to one. I would leave this casino at a very great pace. Who is it?

Maths/excel people - I am using the following formula, is this correct (give or take a couple of % on the win probability)?
=BINOMDIST(0,50,48%,TRUE)
No. Assuming the probability of losing a given hand were 48% (close enough for most forms of BJ), and that all 50 hands were uncorrelated (completely wrong), the probabiliy would be given by: =BINOMDIST(0,50,1-48%,TRUE); or more simply: =0.48^50.
 

aka23

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Joined
Jun 11, 2006
Location
Planet Earth
lucky21 said:
where i was playing all five hands and the dealer beat all my hands 10 times in a row,
TheBloke said:
So you lost 50 hands in a row?

If I am calculating this correctly, the odds of that is 9 trillion to one. I would leave this casino at a very great pace. Who is it?

Maths/excel people - I am using the following formula, is this correct (give or take a couple of % on the win probability)?
=BINOMDIST(0,50,48%,TRUE)
franklin said:
No. Assuming the probability of losing a given hand were 48% (close enough for most forms of BJ), and that all 50 hands were uncorrelated (completely wrong), the probabiliy would be given by: =BINOMDIST(0,50,1-48%,TRUE); or more simply: =0.48^50.
Lucky21 mentioned playing 5 hands at once and losing those 5 hands 10 times. This is not the same probability as losing 50 hands in a row. A player is far more likely to lose all 5 hands at once to a single dealer 21 than to lose 5 sequential single hands.
 
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