Documents request: lawyer needed

roby1978

Dormant account
Joined
Nov 8, 2005
Location
milano
Hi

have you ever experienced a request from a casino support asking you to provide documents notarized by a lawyer?

I understand that casino needs to verify the identity of his players, but it is not going a bit too far?

Ciao
 

gfkostas

Ex-Bonus Whore
Joined
Sep 3, 2003
Location
London
Hi

have you ever experienced a request from a casino support asking you to provide documents notarized by a lawyer?

I understand that casino needs to verify the identity of his players, but it is not going a bit too far?

Ciao

That's unusual. Which casino is it?
 

roby1978

Dormant account
Joined
Nov 8, 2005
Location
milano
I just know it is a microgaming, I've received this complain from one of my players, and i've already asked me to give me more info on the matter; i believe that the casino has probably reason to make this request, I just wanted to know if anybody ever experienced a request like this...
 

Swede

Hell is only a word
PABaccred
PABnonaccred
Joined
May 1, 2006
Location
Anaon
I would also like to know which casino this is. And when you say lawyer, you mean notary public or equivalent, I'm guessing. No gambling institution in history has ever requested documents signed specifically by a lawyer, someone please correct me if I'm wrong here?!
 

TDTAT

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 7, 2006
Location
Gambleville
I just know it is a microgaming, I've received this complain from one of my players, and i've already asked me to give me more info on the matter; i believe that the casino has probably reason to make this request, I just wanted to know if anybody ever experienced a request like this...

I had never heard of any casino requesting anything notorized
by anyone until I read the "Are Jackpot Factory on the stuff" thread here at
Casino Meister.. :lolup: **keep in mind I do not get out much and have an awful memory
https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...-jackpot-factory-group-on-the-stuff-or.22742/
 
Last edited:

mush

Experienced Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2006
Location
not where i want to be
I would also like to know which casino this is. And when you say lawyer, you mean notary public or equivalent, I'm guessing. No gambling institution in history has ever requested documents signed specifically by a lawyer, someone please correct me if I'm wrong here?!


i agree totally. i'm a lawyer and i can assure you we do not possess the power to notarize any document. a lawyer may draft a document that is later notarized by a notary public, but a lawyer doesn't "notarize a document." if a casino does request this, i would immediately stop playing there.
 

bryand

Beach Bum
Joined
Jan 9, 2008
Location
Just Across the Hudson River
i agree totally. i'm a lawyer and i can assure you we do not possess the power to notarize any document. a lawyer may draft a document that is later notarized by a notary public, but a lawyer doesn't "notarize a document." if a casino does request this, i would immediately stop playing there.

With all due respect mush, in which country do you practice? Lawyers routinely notarize signatures in the US although one can be a notary without being a lawyer. I'm sure the casino in question meant to have the signature notarized by a notary public. Regardless, BE CAREFUL because any casino wanting notarized documents may be covering their ass for some reason. IMHO of course :eek2:
 

GGW Laurie

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
Joined
Jun 16, 2006
Location
In the Beautiful South !!
With all due respect mush, in which country do you practice? Lawyers routinely notarize signatures in the US although one can be a notary without being a lawyer. I'm sure the casino in question meant to have the signature notarized by a notary public. Regardless, BE CAREFUL because any casino wanting notarized documents may be covering their ass for some reason. IMHO of course :eek2:
.........im a notary public in the state of tenneesee and commonwealth of kentucky and im not a lawyer, i agree with bryand they are prolly wanting you to sign in front of a notory and and for them to put a seal on it and sign and date that you are whom you say you are. you can go to any bank, theres usually a notory there and the cost is min. i never charge for this service myself.....also having something notarized makes it a legal doc. i ve never heard of such a request but nothing suprises me much anymore....be leary....laurie
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
Pennsylvania
.........im a notary public in the state of tenneesee and commonwealth of kentucky and im not a lawyer, i agree with bryand they are prolly wanting you to sign in front of a notory and and for them to put a seal on it and sign and date that you are whom you say you are. you can go to any bank, theres usually a notory there and the cost is min. i never charge for this service myself.....also having something notarized makes it a legal doc. i ve never heard of such a request but nothing suprises me much anymore....be leary....laurie

FWIW, A notary's signature doesn't mean squat. They're only affirming the fact that you signed the paper. There's no way for them to prove without a shadow of a doubt that you're who you say you are.
 

GGW Laurie

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
Joined
Jun 16, 2006
Location
In the Beautiful South !!
FWIW, A notary's signature doesn't mean squat. They're only affirming the fact that you signed the paper. There's no way for them to prove without a shadow of a doubt that you're who you say you are.
when i put my seal on something i want to see a drivers lic, ect before i affix my name and my stamp to it and yes it does mean squat:p
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
Pennsylvania
when i put my seal on something i want to see a drivers lic, ect before i affix my name and my stamp to it and yes it does mean squat:p

yes, but if someone "knows someone" who has that stamper thingy, then it doesn't mean squat :D

btw, what does it take to actually get that stamper thingy? I'm sure if someone was really wanting to pull a scam on online casinos, they could get one and go to town...
 

RobWin

closed account
Joined
Apr 24, 2004
Location
A Vault!
Hi

have you ever experienced a request from a casino support asking you to provide documents notarized by a lawyer?

I understand that casino needs to verify the identity of his players, but it is not going a bit too far?

Ciao

This sounds like the beginning of yet another Jackpot Factory thread...jeeze
 

GGW Laurie

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
Joined
Jun 16, 2006
Location
In the Beautiful South !!
yes, but if someone "knows someone" who has that stamper thingy, then it doesn't mean squat :D

btw, what does it take to actually get that stamper thingy? I'm sure if someone was really wanting to pull a scam on online casinos, they could get one and go to town...
well i guess you could do that but i keep records of everything i affix my name and seal with. theres ways around everything we do in life winbig but some of us have morals that we try to live by. i have been bonded and my "stamper thingy" comes from the county clerks office.
 

RobWin

closed account
Joined
Apr 24, 2004
Location
A Vault!
well i guess you could do that but i keep records of everything i affix my name and seal with. theres ways around everything we do in life winbig but some of us have morals that we try to live by. i have been bonded and my "stamper thingy" comes from the county clerks office.

Laurie, you think you could maybe get me and Win one of those "stamper thingys"...:D
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
Pennsylvania
well i guess you could do that but i keep records of everything i affix my name and seal with. theres ways around everything we do in life winbig but some of us have morals that we try to live by. i have been bonded and my "stamper thingy" comes from the county clerks office.

Sorry, I didn't mean for it to sound like you didn't take your job seriously, or didn't have any ethics!

I just wanted to point out that there's some out there that don't take their job seriously, and will do anything for a buck :(
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
This was certainly unusual a couple of years ago, but there have been quite a number of threads here where players have told of being asked to "get the POLICE" to "notarise" their documents.
The POLICE almost NEVER offer this, the most likely place to get this done is a Notary Public, yet this is the one "office" the casinos never seem to mention. They will advise trying a LAWYER, or your BANK if the Police let you down.
Quite often, the casino risk department will want to be able to contact the Notary who signs the document, so they are well aware of the potential for the fraudulent application of a Notary's seal and signature on what is, in effect, a JPEG of GIF image of the actual Notarised document.

Oddly enough, NONE of this rigmarole is actually necessary for most countries. Here in the UK, it is possible to access the applicants history at no less than THREE credit reference agencies. Data is not just held about their credit worthiness, but can be used to verify other important details. These checks are enough for someone to be granted an unsecured loan of up to 30,000 (or a secured mortgage of a much larger amount), but clearly not enough to receive a cash-in of a few hundred bucks from an online casino, or in some cases, even receive back the initial deposit:confused:

What is most interesting is that a Notary only checks that the documents are genuine, and not fakes (to the best of their ability), they are not going to be able to determine that the person presenting them is using their "proper" name and address - they could have obtained GENUINE documents (passport, drivers licence, bank statements), but committed a fraud in the application process. IF they were using "a friend's ID" to play a second account, they would get the "friend" to present themselves to the Notary and get the relevant signatures, and then hand them back to the person using their ID to play a second SUB (or more). Decent fraudsters will go to such lengths, and there would be profit in it, innocent players will only be playing their ONE account, and using the correct details, but will be put to additional inconvenience for no obvious reason. As far as the innocent player is concerned, they are being singled out for a substandard level of service that is at variance from that promised and expected (even though the terms allow anyone to be given such a "substandard level of service" purely at the whim of "management")
 

GrandMaster

Dormant account
Joined
Jan 21, 2004
Location
UK
There seems to be a lot of confusion here. Only notaries public can notarise documents (not lawyers, police officers, etc.) The casino may mean certifying a copy of a document, which may be done by solicitors in the UK, or for certain purposes by a larger class of people. The role of notaries public varies from country to country and from state to state, in civil law jurisdictions they have much greater powers, and form a separate branch of the legal profession. In the UK there are very few notaries public and all or almost all are solicitors who do notary work on the sideline. In the US, there are 4.5 million notaries public according to Wikipedia, but they don't need to have legal training and in some states they are not even allowed to notarise copies of documents.

Notarisation doesn't verify the authenticity of the documents, only that they are true copies of the original, or that the person signed the document in the presence of the notary. Forging a notarised document or notarising a fake document is usually considered perjury, which may dissuade some people from doing it.

Notarised documents are accepted in court proceeding in most of the civilised world, although they may need an apostille. (Please don't tell casinos about the apostille because they will start demanding it as well.)
 

mush

Experienced Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2006
Location
not where i want to be
grandmaster is exactly correct. btw, i practice in the us and i do know what i'm talking about. i agree that there seems to be a lot of confusion in this thread. maybe notary publics and the term "notarize" have different meanings in jurisdictions other than in the us, but in this country the purpose of a notary public is to authenticate the SIGNATURE on any document. notarizing a document does not make a document a "legal document" or verify the authenticity of any part of the document except the signature. when a document is notarized, this means that the person who signed the document did so in front of the notary public and presented identification verifying they were the same person as the signature indicates they are. having a document notarized serves no other purpose.

also, ONLY notary publics (certified by the court) can notarize a document, no other person whatsoever can do so. as a lawyer, i have no authority at all to notarize a document. yes, i may draft a will or some other document that must be notarized in order for it to be valid (since the signature must be authenticated), but i could not notarize this document. most attys have paralegals or secretaries who are notary publics in order to simplify things for their clients. you may be directed to a bank or a lawyer to have a document notarized (i've personally never heard of the police) because it is general custom for these businesses, banks especially, to have a notary public on staff. i refer people to their local bank all the time to have things notarized because most provide this service for free to their customers.

i should add, i don't see a reason that an atty couldn't also be a notary public, which would then allow them to notarize documents, but i've personally never known an atty who is also a notary public.
 

GGW Laurie

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
Joined
Jun 16, 2006
Location
In the Beautiful South !!
grandmaster is exactly correct. btw, i practice in the us and i do know what i'm talking about. i agree that there seems to be a lot of confusion in this thread. maybe notary publics and the term "notarize" have different meanings in jurisdictions other than in the us, but in this country the purpose of a notary public is to authenticate the SIGNATURE on any document. notarizing a document does not make a document a "legal document" or verify the authenticity of any part of the document except the signature. when a document is notarized, this means that the person who signed the document did so in front of the notary public and presented identification verifying they were the same person as the signature indicates they are. having a document notarized serves no other purpose.

also, ONLY notary publics (certified by the court) can notarize a document, no other person whatsoever can do so. as a lawyer, i have no authority at all to notarize a document. yes, i may draft a will or some other document that must be notarized in order for it to be valid (since the signature must be authenticated), but i could not notarize this document. most attys have paralegals or secretaries who are notary publics in order to simplify things for their clients. you may be directed to a bank or a lawyer to have a document notarized (i've personally never heard of the police) because it is general custom for these businesses, banks especially, to have a notary public on staff. i refer people to their local bank all the time to have things notarized because most provide this service for free to their customers.

i should add, i don't see a reason that an atty couldn't also be a notary public, which would then allow them to notarize documents, but i've personally never known an atty who is also a notary public.
thats pretty much how it goes except that ill add that when a notary affixes a seal and signs and dates a document and that document is filed with the court clerk it does then become a legal doc.
 
Top