Diamond7 casino, confiscation of winnings.

Birdy84

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 11, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
Hi guys a little help please. I made my first deposit at diamond 7 via skrill, i then contacted support to enquire about a bonus. They credited the bonus after seeing i had made this deposit. Now that i have won they have confisated the winnings with the term,

7 (vii) Deposits made via Skrill or NETeller are not eligible for the Welcome Bonus and if taken, any winnings will be confiscated.


As they manually applied the bonus after seeing my deposit/method, do i have any grounds for having the winnings reinstated?


Thanks
Jen
 
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incrediblestuff

SearchingForTheHolyGrail!
webmeister
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Mostly the Netherlands
In my opinion absolutely. Even if it was an automated system, it's basically their responsibility to ensure excluded players don't even get the chance to take a Bonus in such a case. But especially after manually applying the Bonus, i feel it's quite ridiculous to come up with that reason as excuse to not pay.

Would advise you to PAB, but maybe wait on input from other members first :thumbsup:
 

dunover

Unofficial T&C's Editor
Staff member
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the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
Unfortunately many casinos don't bonus Neteller or Skrill deposits.

So correctly you never got the bonus as per the terms.

You obviously never read the terms and thus didn't realise you were ineligible.

You asked CS about it, and all they would see is the fact you made the deposit, not by which method.

So they give you the benefit of the doubt and place the bonus.

Upon cash-out this comes to light and it is voided. (You should get the deposit back or reinstated if the bets were void).

Notwithstanding any of the above, the terms will have a line along the lines 'shall not benefit from errors, faults etc.'

So really it's unfortunate but I'm with the casino on this one, as it all stems from you requesting the bonus not having read the terms.
 
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incrediblestuff

SearchingForTheHolyGrail!
webmeister
CAG
Joined
Mar 22, 2010
Location
Mostly the Netherlands
You asked CS about it, and all they would see is the fact you made the deposit, not by which method.

So they give you the benefit of the doubt and place the bonus.

I don't think this is likely, as far as i know, support should be able to see what method is used, as soon as they retrieve the account: all transactions in and out should be visible to them.
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
CAG
MM
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Sweden
I don't think this is likely, as far as i know, support should be able to see what method is used, as soon as they retrieve the account: all transactions in and out should be visible to them.

It is, but only if they look for which method was used. I don't think everything is shown automaticly since it would be too much information at once.

Edit: What I do think though is that support should have asked, or informed the player, that some methods aren't allowed when you want to use bonuses.
 

Birdy84

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 11, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
Thankyou for the responses, i tried to discuss it with the casino as an initial step but they said the decision is final and basically if i don't like it speak with ecogra. This is the first time i have had winnings confiscated, really gutting . It really does feel like it's win win for them give me a bonus and no matter what happens i can't win. Anyway thankyou for your input everyone. I selected no bonus when i deposited and then support added one on after i gave them the welcome offer code.
 
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KasinoKing

WebMeister & Slotaholic..
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Aug 25, 2004
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Bexhill on sea, England
Thankyou for the responses, i tried to discuss it with the casino as an initial step but they said the decision is final and basically if i don't like it speak with ecogra. This is the first time i have had winnings confiscated, really gutting . It really does feel like it's win win for them give me a bonus and no matter what happens i can't win. Anyway thankyou for your input everyone. I selected no bonus when i deposited and then support added one on after i gave them the welcome offer code.
If it's a significant sum I would do a PAB.
You only have one of these at non-accredited casinos - but it might be worth it.

I think this case is outrageous and that they should pay up, as they obviously manually gave you the bonus.
Don't let them get away with it.

KK
 

Birdy84

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 11, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
Thankyou KasinoKing, it's for just short of 3.5k, which is a lot of money to me. I will put in a PAB have never done one before but i haven't really got anything to lose by trying.:thumbsup:
 

dunover

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Staff member
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the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
Thankyou for the responses, i tried to discuss it with the casino as an initial step but they said the decision is final and basically if i don't like it speak with ecogra. This is the first time i have had winnings confiscated, really gutting . It really does feel like it's win win for them give me a bonus and no matter what happens i can't win. Anyway thankyou for your input everyone. I selected no bonus when i deposited and then support added one on after i gave them the welcome offer code.

Why did you opt for 'no bonus' then ask CS for one? :confused:
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
CAG
MM
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Sweden
Because that's what the live support told me to do, it was a "special" offer you had to claim via support.

I still don't understand why you didn't read the rules for bonuses. It clearly states that all first deposit bonuses have the same rules as the Welcome bonus.
You can pab and hope to be lucky but I really doubt you will be. A tough lesson but you have played long enough to not miss reading anything.
 

Birdy84

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 11, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
I still don't understand why you didn't read the rules for bonuses. It clearly states that all first deposit bonuses have the same rules as the Welcome bonus.
You can pab and hope to be lucky but I really doubt you will be. A tough lesson but you have played long enough to not miss reading anything.

I have played at a lot of casinos within the same group, i have checked through my accounts and can see a lot of the deposits with welcome offers were via skrill and nothing has been mentioned untill i have won, i don't know if the terms changed at some point, but yes sloppy on part for not noticing it. I still feel they are at fault also though for crediting a bonus that i would never be able to win from. If my PAB is not successfull then a harsh lesson learned, but thankyou everyone for your advice.
 

theapple

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 5, 2013
Location
far far away
good luck with it, if they credited it manually you should have some valid arguments for your Pab. maybe, but you never know with casinos because they really exist in different place compared to any other business, so in their eyes casino can do no wrong.

Something like this actually happened to me once, when "no skrill bonus" was still relatively new thing so i havent bothered checking terms for that specific term and deposited via skrill, at BGO. Didnt get bonus so contacted live chat who instantly credited it, no questions asked. I managed to complete wagering, made a cashout and got my money relatively soon (considering it was my first play there). But then again its BGO and not whatever7 casino with some generic name so theres that :/

but basically, what it boils down to - you were allowed to play without being able to cashout, no matter what. And still we have people here saying "its your own fault", even after casino in question credited that bonus manually.

Hey maybe live chat rep couldnt be arsed to check what was your deposit method, so its your fault. I mean we cant expect casinos to check that stuff when we deposit, can we. Afterall they have to concetrate all their staff to checking (and double, and triple checking) cashouts, so deposits are absolutely low priority.

How on earth does casino go away with crap like that is beyond me but it is what it is.

But yeah, lets side with casino on this one. Speaking of which, what happens to those $3,5k ? does casino get all the money? Maybe they donate it to charities? :O yeah im sure it goes to charity.
 

Jono777

Ueber Meister
CAG
mm1
mm4
Joined
May 13, 2014
Location
Wolverhampton
Quick input.

I can see both sides of the coin on this one.

Can't blame the customer for not reading all the terms and then NOT blame the casino for adding the deposit without considering the deposit method used, surely :what::what:

I feel an amicable solution would be "middle ground" and that the player is maybe payed half :confused:
 

elkoxon

Newbie member
Joined
Apr 18, 2017
Location
Czech
From my experience it's weird that the support did not see the deposit method, every time i contacted the support on a live chat on any site after a deposit they always immediately were able to say: "Oh, i see you have just made a deposit with Skrill\Netelle whatever other method".
 

BlaCGaming

Experienced Member
Joined
Dec 6, 2016
Location
Germany
I´m sure CS would check why the bonus was not credited and look at the deposit method for that reason.

This was a special bonus though, so its even more in favour of the player, because they should inform him that the code is not valid for his method. They should take the hit and train their staff on this topic.

If you can´t trust CS, you can´t trust the casino. What if CS offers you a 500% bonus on your next deposit but then it gets voided because "we don´t offer that actually".
 

maxd

Complaints (PAB) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia
I can confirm the winnings were reinstated and i have received the payment today. Thanks Mr PAB :)

Jen

Excellent! Thanks for letting us know. :thumbsup:

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theapple

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 5, 2013
Location
far far away
I can confirm the winnings were reinstated and i have received the payment today. Thanks Mr PAB :)

Jen

thats great to hear ! i just checked their site and T&C and i think you are lucky you got your winnings because you obviously broke a few terms there... like this one

7. Welcome Bonus [Also known as FIRST DEPOSIT BONUS or OPENING OFFER]

(vi) The maximum bet allowed while the Welcome Bonus is in play is 0. Should You bet higher than this while the Welcome bonus is in play, the casino reserves the right to confiscate all winnings.

(viii) The Casino offer is a 100% match with no maximum limit, for example, if you deposit 0 you will receive a casino bonus of 0, giving you a total balance of 0. If you deposit 0, you will receive a casino bonus of 0, giving you a total balance of 0.


im 100% positive you did in fact played at bet higher than their allowed bet (zero) so yeah...

9. No Deposit Bonus
(i) Diamond7 reserves the right to limit winnings and withdrawals from all forms of no deposit bonuses / free spins / free bets added to a customer’s account up to the value of 0.


edit:
jeez it looks like they replaced all numbers with 0. Seriously now, whats up with their terms and how does casino that is too lazy to check their own terms get a license to begin with :confused::D I know most sites have max cashout from no deposit bonuses but i really believe max cashout of 0 is a bit low.

(iv) Unless otherwise stated, winnings from free spins are credited in casino bonus and are capped to a maximum of 0. Winnings that exceed this amount will be removed from the account.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
thats great to hear ! i just checked their site and T&C and i think you are lucky you got your winnings because you obviously broke a few terms there... like this one

7. Welcome Bonus [Also known as FIRST DEPOSIT BONUS or OPENING OFFER]

(vi) The maximum bet allowed while the Welcome Bonus is in play is 0. Should You bet higher than this while the Welcome bonus is in play, the casino reserves the right to confiscate all winnings.

(viii) The Casino offer is a 100% match with no maximum limit, for example, if you deposit 0 you will receive a casino bonus of 0, giving you a total balance of 0. If you deposit 0, you will receive a casino bonus of 0, giving you a total balance of 0.


im 100% positive you did in fact played at bet higher than their allowed bet (zero) so yeah...

9. No Deposit Bonus
(i) Diamond7 reserves the right to limit winnings and withdrawals from all forms of no deposit bonuses / free spins / free bets added to a customer’s account up to the value of 0.


edit:
jeez it looks like they replaced all numbers with 0. Seriously now, whats up with their terms and how does casino that is too lazy to check their own terms get a license to begin with :confused::D I know most sites have max cashout from no deposit bonuses but i really believe max cashout of 0 is a bit low.

(iv) Unless otherwise stated, winnings from free spins are credited in casino bonus and are capped to a maximum of 0. Winnings that exceed this amount will be removed from the account.

Good job they paid. These terms are a legally binding contract, yet it's nonsense! Despite being nonsense, it is still governed by the UK consumer protection laws, and so all these terms would be struck out BECAUSE they are meaningless nonsense through having zero when there should be a number. Once struck out, the casino loses the provisions enshrined in the struck out clauses.

Their Skrill term could also fail on the grounds that an agent acting on behalf of the casino agreed to waive this provision in law by manually crediting the bonus. If their agent made a mistake due to poor training, that's the company's problem, not the customers. In this case, the term itself might be considered fair, but it has been applied in an unfair nature as a form of "bait & switch" by ill trained CS staff.

It seems that many online casinos are getting caught out by the fact that UK regulation means that it's UK consumer law that now applies to their contract with UK players, not the consumer laws of their primary licencing jurisdiction which have traditionally been heavily in favour of the casino.

In this case, it's time casinos and Skrill/Neteller got together and thrashed out whatever issue is causing some players such grief so that once again players can confidently use Neteller and Skrill for the purpose for which it was created, the specific use by gamblers to transact with gambling sites without their banks finding out.

If they don't do this, Neteller will find that customers begin to drift away, and others will be put off by seeing all the stories of confiscated payouts purely down to the choice of Neteller as the wallet used to hold the gambling fund. If banks were not so anti gambling, the demise of Neteller and other gambling specific wallets would be much quicker. Casinos may also suffer because of the attitude of banks when it comes to gambling deposits. The most notable issue here is the random and trigger happy bank block on cards used at gambling sites, which normally gives the player plenty of time to think about that deposit they were about to make whilst they wait for their bank to open so that they can get their card manually unblocked. By this time, the impulse to play may have abated, and even with the card unblocked the casino won't see the deposit.
 

slotter999

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 22, 2013
Location
UK
good luck with it, if they credited it manually you should have some valid arguments for your Pab. maybe, but you never know with casinos because they really exist in different place compared to any other business, so in their eyes casino can do no wrong.

Something like this actually happened to me once, when "no skrill bonus" was still relatively new thing so i havent bothered checking terms for that specific term and deposited via skrill, at BGO. Didnt get bonus so contacted live chat who instantly credited it, no questions asked. I managed to complete wagering, made a cashout and got my money relatively soon (considering it was my first play there). But then again its BGO and not whatever7 casino with some generic name so theres that :/

but basically, what it boils down to - you were allowed to play without being able to cashout, no matter what. And still we have people here saying "its your own fault", even after casino in question credited that bonus manually.

Hey maybe live chat rep couldnt be arsed to check what was your deposit method, so its your fault. I mean we cant expect casinos to check that stuff when we deposit, can we. Afterall they have to concetrate all their staff to checking (and double, and triple checking) cashouts, so deposits are absolutely low priority.

How on earth does casino go away with crap like that is beyond me but it is what it is.

But yeah, lets side with casino on this one. Speaking of which, what happens to those $3,5k ? does casino get all the money? Maybe they donate it to charities? :O yeah im sure it goes to charity.

I find that part utterly infuriating. How anyone can conclude this was the players fault is beyond me. The casinos don't even need to defend themselves anymore because they have people in forums doing their bidding for them like some odd Stockholm syndrome scenario.

Very happy to hear the OP got their money which is the right and fair outcome for this story.
 
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