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Crystal Palace is a scam artists. Something needs to be done

Discussion in 'Casino Complaints - Bonus Issues' started by gamblegtown, Nov 16, 2006.

    Nov 16, 2006
  1. gamblegtown

    gamblegtown Dormant account

    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    dc
    Crystal Palace and it's sister sites are not paying up the bigger wins.
    They removed 23k winning from my account naiming a bullshit reason.
    This was a win from depositing $1,000. I was desperate after losing more than 10k at various casinos in matter of five hours. I felt so relieved after I won some back only to find out that I am being cheated. I had heard numerous stories circling around of being wins not being paid by this scum casino Crystal Palace and it's 9 other sister companies. (scroll down for list of these 9 others to avoid playing.) They had no problem taking my losses but when I did win they refused. A win like this was very rare and it is devastating to not be able to claim it especially after having lost money so quick.

    To give some history of my situation, the $1000 deposit was my 2nd deposit which I deposit after I lost all my original deposit and bonus few days prior. They removed all my money by saying that I had 70 in the account at the time of the $1000 deposit and claimed a 2nd bonus. At least at a legit casino like those owned by microgaming, I would not have been cheated out of my winnings. These guys deposited 70 into my account which I would not have cared to have(what the hell would i have done with $70 when I deposited 1k?). Also I traced back and it actually turns out that the bonus I got would not have affect my winnings since i hit a win streak from the start. No where in their terms does it say that they will void out all winning if you make a deposit and claim a bonus with any previous balance remaining. It does state somewhere that inorder to claim 2nd bonus, you have to have lost all deposit+bonus+winnings, which I did. By their logic, if someone had just .50 in their account, their winning would be voided because they had a balance. This clearly shows the idosyncracy of this policy.

    It's bullshit to make some unreasonable excuse to not pay up a valid win because it is large. Even assuming that terms of bonus was not met, worst thing that could have happened at Microgamming would have been to deduct the bonus. A casino voiding it on this basis is unheard of at a legit casino.

    That is why I write to all of you to avoid playing at places like Crystal Palace. I recently logged back there before I removed the software and I find also that they lowered down the maximum withdrawl limit to half of what it was before. This is just bullshit. They are nothing but scam artists, they steal your money in the rare chance you win. I have kept records of transactions as well as various snapshots as proof of this cheat. I am new to online gambling so I do not know if there are any regulators in this industry. I would like to submit complaints to them if someone would let me know who they are. Also I'd very much like to pay someone to be my webmaster. I want to create a review site of various casinos and to defame these sons of bitches no matter how much it cost. I'm also considering a class action lawsuit against them if I can find more people scammed by them. Someone needs to stand up and make online gambling more legit. I hope to get some replies from those who like to help.


    Crystal Palace also goes by:

    Golden Nile
    Real Vegas
    American Grand
    Highrollers
    Lucky coin
    Lucky pyramid
    Royal Circus
    Mighty Slots
    Powerbet
     
  2. Nov 16, 2006
  3. babs7262

    babs7262 Banned User

    Occupation:
    On Disability,p/t online slots reviewer
    Location:
    PA
    hmmm

    Im afraid to say anything because there would of been posts by now. Okay, Ill dive in and ask this question.(my week cant get much worse)

    First: I think if you go through the other casino threads, There is a post about this casino. Sorry your having problems but Im a small roller and kind of new to online gambling. Im here for your other question

    I find it odd that you are asking someone from this website that provides accredited as well as rogue casinos to help you build your own site. To me, that is like a Target Manager going to Kmart and getting advise for advertising tactics. So my question is this........Why? I know Im new and don't have much pull in here but find it a bit respectful to ask for this kind of help, paid or not.

    I just feel that your starting off in here on the wrong foot and won't get much help if your intentions are to start your own website.
     
  4. Nov 16, 2006
  5. BubbleG

    BubbleG Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    spark
    Location:
    Earth, man!
    Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm :confused: :what:
     
  6. Nov 17, 2006
  7. gamblegtown

    gamblegtown Dormant account

    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    dc
    That was not the point I was intending to make. I may have been carried away about making the website stuff in the heat of the moment. I don't care about making a competitor website to this. I don't care about competing with this site. that's not what i meant. I just want to let others know about the dishonesty practice of crystal palace which is my goal now. The website would be soley dedicated to informing other of crystal palace's practices and deter as much people as possible. I'm disappointed by the lack of replies. Since I'm new to online gambling, I 'd like to know if there is any place comparable to better business bureau that i can complain to and also if there is a board that can sanction crystal palace.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2006
  8. Nov 17, 2006
  9. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Waste of effort?


    I'm afraid trying to make a website against Crystal Palace would make no real difference to Mr Cloud (who runs these sites).
    He doesn't seem to give a flying rat's ass what others think of him & his casinos. He seems to act like an insurance company, not a casino, when it comes to paying out winnings. His cashiers department will audit any big cash-in to look for a reason not to pay out.
    Your experience, together with a previous ploy of this nature suggests a change of tactic. Previously, winnings would be denied due to the player having a locked account at a sister casino. Thoughtfully, the player was never informed of this locked account, and could only find out by logging on to it.
    I am afraid that many RTG casinos have these nasty terms buried in the small print about not claiming a bonus if there is a balance in the account or a pending withdrawal (some rule out having had a withdrawal in the last 7 days or so). Some bonus coupons also have a maximum cashout, sometimes as low as 2x deposit, so this would (and has) lead to the loss of part of a big win.
    My own view is that this new "cashback" tactic is designed to lead the player into breaching this no balance term. Even if the balance appears to be zero, it is possible to fake this with RTG software, as I have had this problem before with an RTG balance displayed as zero, but in fact my account had $25 in it, and I had to "refresh" the balance display in order to see it.
    What waould be important is whether the $70 was put into the account before or after the deposit, if it was before, then Crystal Palace are right in therms of the rules, but wrong morally in trying to pull off "advantage bonusing", wherre players are hung out to dry if found to be using "advantage play" in order to beat the house.

    Any new player should avoid this type of operation, despite promises that all this was a thing of the past, these issues crop up more at RTG (especially the likes of Crystal Palace) than other software. RTG lacks the facilities for players to check their own play history, if this were Microgaming, it would be easy to determine the facts of the case, and look for the order in which the bonus of $70 and the deposit of $1000 were credited.
    Had the $10K been lost at other CP sister sites in the space of 5 hours, I expect you would have had no trouble getting some of it back, and no doubt would receive one of the "silly" bonus offers in a week or two ($10,000 for 150% bonus of $15,000 30xWR etc)
     
  10. Nov 18, 2006
  11. Tester

    Tester Quit Gambling

    Location:
    Israel
    Rules?

    I know this is extremely embarrasing.

    But technically the bonus has rules and one of them was that you cannot claim a bonus with any baalnce in the account.

    The only point here is that of "good faith", which is not easy to request strongly.

    I would advice to sumbit a PAB with casinomeister here.
    http://www.casinomeister.com/problems.php

    He may work things out for you.

    Since your point with them is of good faith and not of formal obligation from their side, I would advice not to make yourself their enemy.
     
  12. Nov 20, 2006
  13. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    He already did, and this was submitted to the casino two weeks ago.

    Please read the "Must Read" section of this forum - and the forum rules as well:

    2.2 - Do not post a complaint without notifying the appropriate casino representative by either PM or email. The casino representatives are listed here.

    2.3 - Ensure your complaint is free from offensive or abusive language, and that the complaint is tactful and truthful...


    Calling people scam artists and scum won't further your cuase much. If you want to vent - vent. But if you want a casino operator to consider honoring your claim, I would suggest not going public until at least they answer my PAB.
     
  14. Nov 22, 2006
  15. gamblegtown

    gamblegtown Dormant account

    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    dc
    It's been almost a month since my pab and I have corresponded with brian thru email after several days of the pab but had no replied from him or anyone else to my emails since so I figure u guys weren't working on it and i was frustrated.

     
  16. Nov 23, 2006
  17. Tester

    Tester Quit Gambling

    Location:
    Israel
    Bryan is extremely busy.
    After all he is not paid for doing that, and he has a big portal to run.

    You may try send him another reminder in a week.
     
  18. Nov 23, 2006
  19. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    I've already sent two reminders to the operator - he hasn't responded yet.
     
    1 person likes this.
  20. Nov 23, 2006
  21. suzecat

    suzecat Dormant account CAG MM webmeister

    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    California
    It may be time for a serious reality check. First, there are some folks here at CM who would not patronize any of Cloud's casinos for any reason. And there are probably more people every day who learn the same tough lesson the OP has learned. The "CR clip joints" (among others) are in business to make money from you and they will do so any way they can. As far as laws or regulation - forget it, there are none. Now I could go into a tirade about using bonuses (and subjecting your lowly chance of winning to a slight quiver) but that is a player's choice and so enough has been said about it. Maybe sound mental health would be best served by looking at gambling as an expensive hobby. There are indeed "professional gamblers" who make a nice living and they may be one percent of one percent of those who make a nice living for the casinos they frequent.
     
    1 person likes this.
  22. Nov 23, 2006
  23. dc9999

    dc9999 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Analyst
    Location:
    the Wild West
    The real problem though, with online gambling, is that the lack of any internationally recognized regulatory board, allows rogue operators to flourish and prosper.

    What a sad commentary on the industry, that the Crystal Palace's of the world, have to be "goaded" into paying up rightfully accrued winnings (assuming of course, they pay at all, which is highly unlikelyl!)

    Insofar as casino bonus promos go (most notably with RTG sites..), again, the primary intent of many operators is to thoroughly confuse and yet entice the player to make a large deposit.

    Of course, when a cashout is requested, then the litany of obscure bonus rules violations are rolled out, and the player is ulitmately screwed - and winds up on a board like this!

    Yes, I agree that "buyer beware" is still very much part of the deal here....You wager at a disreputable site with a sordid history and you're asking for trouble....STILL.....it's downright shocking - and disgusting - to see so many of these clowns still in business for so many years regardless of the volume or intensity of player complaints..

    While I do not agree with the current US position to severely restrict/ban online gambling activity, count me as a very strong supporter for the British and Australian systems of truly REGULATING online casino operators.

    Final comment: it's time for RTG and other "software developers" to stop hiding behind that flimsy curtain, and terminate licensees who consistently behave in a below board manner. Even those that are top producers,,,:thumbsup:
     
  24. Nov 27, 2006
  25. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    I've just come across this remark - sorry to let it slip by:

    This player was contacted by me to submit her complaint to Montana disputes in May. She and her friend had used the same debit card at AmericanGrand casino. Her friend had admitted to this, she was told to contact Montana disputes as well. Guess that was a big mistake, but what recourse did she have?

    Montana ruled against her, but I tried to have them review this since I thought - if she was being truthful, it didn't seem fair - it was merely a misunderstanding.

    But I guess if you are going to rely on the empathy of these casinos - you may not have your issues resolved in your favor.
     
  26. Nov 29, 2006
  27. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Real World.

    While using the same card on two accounts is a bad idea, and the experienced online player knows this all too well; in the real world, family and friends will often make purchases for each other on their cards as it can be convenient. If they are new to online casinos, they may not realise that this will get their account flagged as a duplicate. Exactly how casinos determine whether accounts are duplicates is rather vague, they go on about IP and MAC addresses, and registration details and households Vs colleges, but they don't have a list detailing all the possible pitfalls that new players would not believe could be a problem.
    I have a friend in Reading (near me), and I will often use my card when we buy things, and he will always settle up with cash. This helps me, I can get cash from my card without paying fees, and I can benefit from the card loyalty rewards on the purchase.
    In the case of casinos and two friends starting out, one may find their card not working, and trust each other enough to use one of their cards and settle the amounts between them; in the real world this is not a problem, online it most certainly IS a problem, and should be avoided at all costs. Also to avoid is cohabiting partners using joint card accounts at casinos, this too can be an issue. Couples also need to be open with each other so both don't end up claiming the bonus from the same household. Talking to lodgers and teens is also recommended, just in case.
    I live alone, and have been in this house since 1986. This is not a problem I have experienced, as online casinos did not exist before I bought this house. Everything is in my name, and matches all the registration data I supply to casinos.
     

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