Club World

babs7262

Banned User
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Location
PA
I am posting this message here because it is a legitimate complaint that is a non bonus issue and can effect all players, not just US players.

Beware if paying with a Visa or any credit card. The processors that CW use double dipped me twice in one week. The first time, I got an apology, the second time I was asked to show my statement from the bank. I sent the info. I got an email with another apology and "We are going to investigate it" I waited and emailed them with an easy proposal of crediting my account so I wouldnt have to get my bank involved for the 2nd time in a week.

I now get an email from them stating that since I went public in another thread (which I didnt even start) they are not going to give me the credit in my casino account to make up for it and not only that, They LOCKED MY ACCOUNT. I cant even go back in to get the proof for here. They sent me some proof (which actually helps me) but since we cant paste PM's from other people in here, you will have to trust my word.

I have been a member here for over a year 10/2006 and come in here and participate everyday. Anyone that knows me from here will know that I would not make a huge stink over this $38 double dipping if it werent true. Why would they lock me out for posting them ? I was defending them and felt bad for them and they say I was bashing them?

This is the last thread I will start and will not post anything new on ClubWorld because they are not worth it. I will however answer any questions as to not be rude if you have any. Dont worry Bryan, this is it. I said my piece and this is a valid non bonus complaint seperate from the ATB thread that i didnt even start. No flaring or rampages. This is it! Im just hurt because I defended them for over a year and played every day and they treat me like this.




Just a quick update and final one: just now got a PM saying they will reopen my account but cant deposit. You know what, they locked me out , i will uninstall and not go back in. They shouldnt of locked me out in the first place. That just shows how spiratic(sp) they are thinking. reopening so they dont look bad,? too late
 

babs7262

Banned User
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Location
PA
can you move this to NON bonus complaints?

PLEASE move this, I meant for this to go to NON BONUS....I apologize for putting this here, Im just so mad I cant see
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
Pennsylvania
IMO, they had no right to lock your account before the issue was settled based on the sole fact that you came public with your complaint/situation.

If they no longer wanted your business, then fine...lock the account *after* settling the problem at hand.

This is complete BS. If a player makes a post that points out nothing but the FACTS of a situation, then what's the casino's problem? If they have nothing to hide, why try to suppress players from letting others know what happened to them, and be on the lookout so that it doesn't happen to others?

If the casino didn't want their dirty laundry aired in a public forum, then they shouldn't place themselves in a situation where it could happen.
 

mishun

Banned User - bogus account - violation of <a href
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Location
Atlanta, Georgia
YOU'RE HURT? FOR WHAT???

Online gaming has turned completely sour. Trust? Trust my ass. There is no trust in this industry anymore. NONE! If they will screw over their most loyal affiliates. What makes you think they give a damn about anyone else?
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
Hi Babs,

I've spoken to the operator over the phone and your account was locked because you threatened them with charging back. It was only locked for an hour or two. I believe it's back open so you can review everything.

Babs, you may have made a mistake. Each one of your deposits shows that it was played out. The cash processors sometimes sends their debits in batches. This is what you might be seeing. These deposits are all legitimate; you just may have forgotten some of them. The casino is able to match each deposit with your play through. Just to let you know.
 

clubworld

Rogue casino operator
Joined
Sep 20, 2006
Location
UK
We investigated this players claims thoroughly and it was clear that all the funds debited from her card were credited to her casino account and played on the games.

The evidence of this was supplied to the player however it was dismissed, regardless of the fact that her IP address and computer's serial number was logged against each deposit and each game played.

The account was deactivated for a short time as a precautionary measure as she indicated that she was going to attempt to defraud us. This is standard procedure and has no bearing on any other posts in any other threads. The account is currently open however the option to make further deposits has been removed.

We have made every effort at every stage of these proceedings to find an amicable solution, however we cannot give money to people purely in response to threats of fraud. Had she simply asked for a comp the $40 would have been in her account within moments.

Steve Morgan
Casino Manager
 

babs7262

Banned User
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Location
PA
First : I did not make a threat. I said "why dont we do it this way so we dont have to get my bank involved" I also told them that I would reverse the UNAUTHORIZED charges in which there are 2 if they dont refund it. Its not a threat, it was telling them how I was going to handle it and gave them an easier option.

It is not a mistake Bryan, I play $20 when I wake up in the morning and once in awhile I will make one at night. I did NOT make 2 deposits in one day in the morning. Also, Again, for over a year I am billed ClubWorld, never a processor.

I do not defraud people or companies for the fun of it and if I were it wouldnt be for $19.97 and $19.91 when I deposit around $600 a month or more. Ive been depositing over $600 a month for a year and now I am going to commit fraud over $38 and some change?

Im telling you, I did not make those deposits. This is happening to others as well which i will keep their confidence. Why do think I wont use a prepaid? Because you cant get that back if your robbed.

How come I dont have this problem with 3 dice? Ask Enzo if I ever asked him for a refund. I go months without winning and deposit on a daily basis yet I have never accused them of taking money or "forgetting" that I play. Go ask Club Player if I ever accused them after making several deposits or SuperSlots or any RIval. I just happen to pick the casino that has the fastest payouts to accuse? The one casino I love to play at? Go ask Play United if I ever reversed charges. The list goes on.......I am a reputable player and an honest player and I did not make those deposits. The only other casino I had this problem was with was an MG casino and that was dealt with.

I am finished defending myself. I dont know how they keep records or what they can do to make it look like I played when I didnt but this is not how to handle a long time customer.
 

mishun

Banned User - bogus account - violation of <a href
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Location
Atlanta, Georgia
BABS please keep in mind. Always pay attention to your warning signs. There's something telling you to leave that place alone. If you know they are stealing from you. Its a SIGN!

It's not about the $38 its the principle. You know a few years back. I broke a story about Party Poker stealing from the rake. If a player goes all-in (preflop) and everyone folded. They still took out a few cents from your large all-in and most people didnt even pay it no mind. Also, one senior accountant worked at a very large company. And he would subtract a few pennies from each employee payroll. When he finally was caught. He had stolen millions. So it happening every single day and they are making 100,000s of dollars. These casinos must make up for their short fall. Common sense will tell you this. Just look at how many casinos folded under the usa ban. Look at how many ewallets folded. Now what makes one thinks the casinos still active is doing good? They are not, and they are trying to stay afloat. And that means pinching from varies players from time to time. They are hurting BIG TIME!

Babs I know you are not LYING!
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
BABS please keep in mind. Always pay attention to your warning signs. There's something telling you to leave that place alone. If you know they are stealing from you. Its a SIGN!..Babs I know you are not LYING!
I don't think Babs is lying, but she may be mistaken. Babs, please check your deposit history and try to match this up with your bank debits ignoring the dates. They will match up in the end, I'm sure.
 

babs7262

Banned User
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Location
PA
Hiya Sexy Bryan

Actually that's what I was going to do when my account was locked. I uninstalled the casino because they locked it. I dont care if it was for 5 minutes, it was an unsettled matter when they locked my account, it my eyes, there is nothing left to do. They made that decision. I didnt go back to any boyfriend that cheated either, even if it was just a kiss and not a lay! Get my point?:)
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
Hiya Sexy Bryan

Actually that's what I was going to do when my account was locked. I uninstalled the casino because they locked it. I dont care if it was for 5 minutes, it was an unsettled matter when they locked my account, it my eyes, there is nothing left to do. They made that decision. I didnt go back to any boyfriend that cheated either, even if it was just a kiss and not a lay! Get my point?:)
But what I am saying is that they locked your account because you told them you would make a chargeback. This is standard SOP with most casinos. Tell them you'll charge back your funds and they will close your account.

But it's been reopened to you can review your deposits. It may be worth spending a few minutes to download the software and access your account so you can possibly straighten this situation out.
 

babs7262

Banned User
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Location
PA
Then please explain to me why they didnt close my account the last time this happened and they knew I did a reverse on that unauthorized charge? I can find the post where I told them and they didnt close my account then.

Rememer back last year when it happened the very first time and he went as far as calling me at home? I told him on the phone that the bank is paying me back? They didnt close my account that time

I actrually ashamed of myself for staying a customer after the first time. I should of listened to my husband when I told them it wouldnt happen again and he told me it might. My bank manager asked me why Im still dealing with them too.

And it's all because they pay fast if you win, but in the long run, we will lose as long as we keep this up. I looked at the pages before I even made the accusation Bryan. There are about 5 pages of transactions if I remember. I didnt play there from 2/9- to about the 2/12 because I was on a roll at CP for 4 days (that is documented in WS). I deposited once on the 13th and 14th and 15th and there were extra w/d's.

I dont need to go back because I wouldnt of accused without my homework. I dont care what it says now, I know what it said at the time and Im getting exhausted. Im not changing my mind and reinstalling and rechecking it again. I understand Bryan, you are in the middle and Im sorry for that and there are no hard feelings but Im not going back and Im getting my $38 back at thats the end of it. Its the 3rd time since October 2007 and Im done, stick a fork in me Im done!

Maybe its the best thing that could happen anyway. Ill play the free tournys and make my lil $10 -$15 deposits at 3dice and hopefully Ill win big at a B&M where I cant get double dipped or get lucky at 3 dice with a nice win. Either way, CW is no longer entertaining for me, its work now
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
The problem here is this "batching" the processors do. This can often lead to transactions "jumping the queue", and others getting left behind for weeks and suddenly turning up "out of the blue". Worse than this, the processors are "playing games" with the US banks by deliberately making the transactions hard to monitor by breaking up patterns. This involves switching the reference of the charging company, and making rounded amounts into amounts that look like a purchase, such as making them end in figures like 99c, 97c, or 95c. This actually give the PLAYER a slight edge, as they are making a couple of cents on each deposit;)

To properly review this kind of issue, as well as ignoring the dates, it may be necessary to go back some weeks, maybe even months, and look at the overall deposits debited against those amounts shown as being credited to the casino account. I once had this happen at a MG casino, and I traced some deposits that at first seemed "double dips" to casino deposits made some WEEKS before! This had NOTHING to do with UIGEA, it was before then, but it turned out that the casino used a rota of processors, and one of these delayed sending in the requests for nearly a month, then sent them in one go. If merchants do not claim their monies within a certain time, the card companies and banks drop them from "ring fenced" status and show the funds as available again. When the errant merchant finally gets round to requesting payment, the amounts appear as "new" transactions, and do not carry the date from when they were "ring fenced". This can confuse the player no end:confused:
The problem in this case was that the casino was certain it was right, so was of course NOT prepared to refund or credit the disputed amounts, which lead to the player stating that they would go to their BANK to sort it out. Although the word "chargeback" was not used, this is effectively what this was. The casino then managed to pour fuel on the fire by using emotive language like "threatened" and "defraud" with the player. This seeks to induce the impression that the player was being accused of criminal activity, or attempts at such activity, where what was more likely, and in need of investigation, was the possibility that the player had simply fallen victim to the "processor games" that make it hard for banks to trace gambling transactions, and naturally make it just as hard for players to do so.
It has not helped that SOME processors HAVE been using these "games" as a means to defraud players through confusion, so of course any player who sees this is going to think "oh not ANOTHER dodgy processor", rather than thinking that it is more likely that THEY have made an error in totalling up the deposits and debits.

A full analysis of the deposit history at the casino, and debits from the bank, will reveal who is right in this matter, provided it is possible to match Club World deposits with whatever "purchase" appears on the bank card statement. This may need Club World to provide information as to the processors that would appear on statements for each of the deposits, which is not found in the transaction history.
RTG casinos do not provide a play history, and transaction histories do not show the current account balance, so this kind of problem is what can happen at casinos whose software lacks the provision of certain information.
With the Playcheck facility at MG, players have a means to check for themselves whether they played out a deposit and then forgot they did, so if this is what casino support claim, they can check for themselves.

Since the player did not seem to know WHY they suffered the locked account, and made speculations in the posting, am I to assume that the casino did not bother to inform the player as to WHY their account had been locked UNTIL such time as this mess became a subject for forum debate.

The warning about the use of cards STILL STANDS though, mistake or "double dipping", this will happen again because of the way batching and processor's "games" make it hard to reconcile the figures against deposits at the casinos.
 

Cynthia777

Dormant account
Joined
Feb 4, 2006
Location
My house
Babs, I certainly don't blame you for how this situation made you feel, it is only human nature and most anyone would feel the same under the circumstances.

Its hard to be objective here, but I will explain one situation that I had, went through a couple of times, in fact, and believe me it was SEVERELY frustrating. It ended up being neither mine nor the casinos (yes plural) involved, fault.

It was only happening with one card I used, which happened to be a Wired Plastic (prepaid).

I used to see "double" transactions, same amount, same time. I'd check my balance online and see it was in the negative (YES..ON A PREPAID). It ended up being a problem on Wired Plastic's end...saying it was "double-processed". What was frustrating the most about it (number one, once I could get my problem across to someone in customer service at Wired Plastic), was the "waiting periods" they sent me through, or, they advised me to get the merchant (in this case, the casinos, which were 3 of different platforms, one MG, one RTG, and one Vegas Technology) to fax them an authorization to get the "extra" charge removed.

Ok..so now on to the casinos...one understood the problem, and said he would do what he can (still had to wait), one almost took it as me accusing them of "double-dipping", and gave me a somewhat arbitrary response (like, "you played what you deposited, and that's all we got"-they didn't lock my account though, and no its not CW, its another RTG that I still play at), and the other didn't seem to really help/respond at all (I haven't played there in over a year now).

Wired Plastic said the only other thing I could do was pretty much "wait and it will drop off once the final authorization goes through" which used to be 15 days (this really sucked, especially since part of my direct deposit would go to that card...which sometimes just brought the erroneous "negative balance" to zero- no fun on payday in those days). They've since shortened it to around 3 days or so, which isn't so bad, and the errors haven't happened recently. It was like a "horde of errors" of 3 instances bulked together, and, I guess from seeing my complaints enough, most of the Wired Plastic operators now knew what I was talking about...and it was fixed quicker...like "yeah, yeah..we know..same routine".

I hate to see things like this happen though, especially when a loyal player feels betrayed by arbitrary action. Perhaps things should have been handled differently by them. And we certainly have a right to speak out our concerns, without fearing retaliation.

I hope this whole thing works itself out someday.
 

kakata

Banned User - hyper flamming
PABaccred
PABnonaccred
PABnoaccred
Joined
Dec 2, 2006
Location
miami fl
wired plastic is one of the worst company..........
I use it for my convenience.
They do charge you if you call em...0.95 cents and 0.45 for every transaction and 3+ bux monthly fee and they have the worst CS ever.
If you breath......they charge you...... what a s^^^^t
 

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