Casumo Source of Wealth issues

Slottery

Meister Member
PABnoaccred
MM
Joined
Aug 21, 2017
Location
Malta
How would you have those if the player wasn't high risk?
Thats also not what you said earlier about the situation.
If you have legitimately started the SOF process for a high risk player, the information provided along with deposit levels, gameplay etc give cause for you to suspect the funds aren't legitimate, and the customer refuses to supply clarification (assuming your requests are reasonable) then yes, a SAR should be submitted.
What casinos shouldn't be doing is blanket requesting every customer, then submitting a SAR when a customer refuses.

Didn't say casinos submit SAR for every player but that they do them, think i said few per month or something which is really small part of these requests. It's of course always up to casino and other are different than other but if you release funds to player without getting satisfying replies to your request, you are paying funds when you are suspicious about origin of deposits.

edit: There's not much sense but UKGC for example have added that line to their guide lines about levels of SAR submissions and they do expect operators to submit them. What request by operators are reasonable decided by operator (and take responsibilities about wrong doing, not asking enough or breaching some other regulations by asking too much). I don't have any agenda to tell SOW:s are good or reasonable, fact just unfortunately are that these will be requested probably more in future than less. There are loads of different guidances which probably also confuse some operators as you only usually learn that you haven't done enough when regulator find it in audit but not usually what has been too much. Seem that many operators have chosen better be safe than sorry, it do cost resources and players satisfaction so don't think many would do them just for fun but instead willing to be safe as possible.

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Last edited:
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colinsunderland

On a Break
Joined
Jan 28, 2016
Location
uk
Didn't say casinos submit SAR for every player but that they do them, think i said few per month or something which is really small part of these requests. It's of course always up to casino and other are different than other but if you release funds to player without getting satisfying replies to your request, you are paying funds when you are suspicious about origin of deposits.

You said ' Not supplying documents is one quite typical reason to submit SAR', I'm just saying it shouldn't be.

In the case of Casumo, as I said earlier in the thread, if they suspect someone has RG issues, or is using illegitimate funds, then they should not take more deposits. It's disgusting that they do so. Also, SOF/SOW requests are usually done on withdrawal by reports in here. I can see very very few reasons why a withdrawal should trigger a SOF request.

So they think you may have a gambling problem, but are happy for you to keep giving them your rent or food money for that month.

They think you may be using stolen money, they are happy for you to keep giving them your stolen money, no blocks in place to stop you depositing.

That is bad enough, but if you refuse to give them your mates driving license and full financial details who you borrowed a tenner from 3 months ago, then they just steal any money you have in your account.

Rogue casinos don't do that type of shit. Hope Casumo do leave the UK (and everywhere else) as we don't want shit casinos like these here.
 

Slottery

Meister Member
PABnoaccred
MM
Joined
Aug 21, 2017
Location
Malta
You said ' Not supplying documents is one quite typical reason to submit SAR', I'm just saying it shouldn't be.

In the case of Casumo, as I said earlier in the thread, if they suspect someone has RG issues, or is using illegitimate funds, then they should not take more deposits. It's disgusting that they do so. Also, SOF/SOW requests are usually done on withdrawal by reports in here. I can see very very few reasons why a withdrawal should trigger a SOF request.

So they think you may have a gambling problem, but are happy for you to keep giving them your rent or food money for that month.

They think you may be using stolen money, they are happy for you to keep giving them your stolen money, no blocks in place to stop you depositing.

That is bad enough, but if you refuse to give them your mates driving license and full financial details who you borrowed a tenner from 3 months ago, then they just steal any money you have in your account.

Rogue casinos don't do that type of shit. Hope Casumo do leave the UK (and everywhere else) as we don't want shit casinos like these here.

Apologies, meant more specifically if requested information for the reason like bank statement look weird etc.. and player refuse to comply.

Haven't defend Casumos actions at all, my guess was just that even they do submit SAR:s there and then.
 

Playford7

Permanent Ban: Too much flaming
MM
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Location
North east England
So why never ever have William hill, even betway, Ladbrokes, Boyle sports or sky never gave me a bit of bother depositing or making a withdrawal...

ive made over 4K bets on races in the past multiple time’s in days, had big withdrawals over the years and the money was always paid no questions asked....

why is it certain casinos want to take you literally to the cleaners for making a bet?..
it’s a disgrace, clearly it can’t be all (ukgc bad) as all the above over the past ten years I’ve had no issues at all....
 

Mr_Slot5

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2019
Location
Cheshire
So why never ever have William hill, even betway, Ladbrokes, Boyle sports or sky never gave me a bit of bother depositing or making a withdrawal...

ive made over 4K bets on races in the past multiple time’s in days, had big withdrawals over the years and the money was always paid no questions asked....

why is it certain casinos want to take you literally to the cleaners for making a bet?..
it’s a disgrace, clearly it can’t be all (ukgc bad) as all the above over the past ten years I’ve had no issues at all....
I think it has been touched on that the bigger UK sites have access to more electronic records when profiling you. I still find it baffling that Maltese casinos don't just invest in this kind of infrastructure to cut down on all this bullshit.
 

colinsunderland

On a Break
Joined
Jan 28, 2016
Location
uk
So why never ever have William hill, even betway, Ladbrokes, Boyle sports or sky never gave me a bit of bother depositing or making a withdrawal...

ive made over 4K bets on races in the past multiple time’s in days, had big withdrawals over the years and the money was always paid no questions asked....

why is it certain casinos want to take you literally to the cleaners for making a bet?..
it’s a disgrace, clearly it can’t be all (ukgc bad) as all the above over the past ten years I’ve had no issues at all....

Because they do it properly, using a risk based approach. William Hill were asking for SOF documentation well over 10 years ago, but very rarely, and only when justified.

People think these rules are new. They aren't. Money Laundering laws have been around longer than most casinos. They are only now doing it because of the massive penalties the UKGC have started handing out.
 

Playford7

Permanent Ban: Too much flaming
MM
Joined
Jul 10, 2016
Location
North east England
I think it has been touched on that the bigger UK sites have access to more electronic records when profiling you. I still find it baffling that Maltese casinos don't just invest in this kind of infrastructure to cut down on all this bullshit.
Maybe it’s better business they don’t actually use such methods...

don’t get me wrong I’ve been treated great by l and l for example, also believe it or not ikibu in the past, but I’ll never sign up to a maltese casino again.

Just far too risky, sad thing is many Will sign upto the likes genesis, nektan, aspire.... it’s a disgrace places like those are allowed to conduct business as they do.

reality is loads whom are not clued up or don’t know of casinomeister will just get ripped right off, they watch a divvy and think it’s all real, playing £40 a spin for example almost daily.

It’s the genuine players that feel the ukgc fallout and the nonsense that comes with it, also the responsible affiliate, this was always going to happen.
wont get into for obvious reasons, but the whole house of cards can only stand so long mate.
 

mcgameboy

NEVER GO FULL WOKETARD
CAG
mm2
Joined
Sep 8, 2013
Location
Belfast
Yes I am convinced it is because after 4 years I am slightly ahead. I deposit a lot, I withdraw a lot. GUTS did exactly the same, as I was slightly ahead with them after 2 years.The only difference being they said it was because of bonus abuse. In the previous 6 months they had given me 10 free spins at 20p. It’s laughable at best but from a business point of view I am no good to them.

Hypothetically let’s say I had lost £10,000 over that period (and let’s remember I passed SOW and all other verification). Would they still be closing my account? I highly doubt it as any overseeing organisation would be hard pushed to find them negligible and I would be the perfect customer.

Take that scenario a step further and as a disgruntled player I make a vain attempt to claim Casumo failed to take care of me properly and I want my 10k back. Would anybody give me a chance of succeeding? Would Casumo of turned around and said, “Yes we were wrong have it back”? No of course not, which tells you they are using double standards here and manipulating rules to suit their agenda.

Strange how my withdrawal for £300 stayed pending for 2 weeks and was then paid out, whilst the other guy had his 4K returned to his account and blew it. Who is the more responsible there? Would they have closed his account had he completed SOW? Not a chance, he would probably have been greeted with VIP status.

For any players just getting into online slotting, who may be looking in, I would say be very careful where you play and take heed of what is written here on the forum.

I personally think UK players will find themselves short of somewhere to play in the next 2 years that isn’t asking you to jump through hoops, running games at full rtp or completely trustworthy.

I am also convinced that is the case.

Correct me if I am wrong, but one of your monster wins on DOA2 happened at Casumo, didn't it?
I'm fairly sure that when CasumoLouis did one of his monthly big wins at Casumo posts,
your said your DOA2 win was among the top 10 wins listed (in terms of x bet) for that entire month.
£3,500-ish on 18p or something?

So it's safe to assume that prior to that win (which happened around March?), you were a fair bit in the red overall at Casumo (around £3k?).

Call my a cynical middle-aged bastid, but it wouldn't surprise me if (after that huge win),
Casumo were kind of expecting you to suddenly start depositing a craptonne more often.
And possibly reaching your monthly £2k deposit limit on a regular basis.
And eventually spunking back the entirity of that win right back into their coffers.

To your credit, you haven't even come remotely close to doing that. And THAT was the problem.
You were the low-rolling cash cow that never materialised.

My biggest bugbear with this industry in general is the sheer hypocrisy of some of these casinos.
If you so much as dare to complain about the piss-poor levels of so-called entertainment that you are receiving in relation to your total spend, you immediately get accused of being a problem gambler.
Not a sore loser, a problem gambler.

But if you win big and do not spunk it back, then you are a problem customer.
IE One that doesn't make them any money.

You've been binned because you were in profit overall at Casumo.
And that you never looked like spunking back that £3.5k anytime soon.
They have chosen to get salty about it, taken their ball and said "we're not playing with you anymore".

But look on the bright side. They have enabled you to leave their casino as a WINNER.

So fuck 'em. Sideways. With a chainsaw. Two times.

Move on and give another Bonanza-providing casino, one that treats their customers with a little bit of respect and a lot less BS, a chance to give you their money. ;)

And then, when they eventually realise that you are in fact "the Bonanza whisperer", a guy who is taking them to the cleaners, they will bin you too. :p
 

pinnit2014

Ueber Meister
PABnoaccred
mm1
Joined
Dec 13, 2014
Location
Glasgow and Home - N Ireland
One of the few casino's I'm actually up in. These amounts will stay static because there's literally no reason, au contraire, to deposit there: no offers, dodgy practices (incompetent at best) and just a dark cloud over every withdrawal request (which should never be the case)

What a shame as probably the loosest Bonanza on the market.

Screenshot 2020-07-22 at 08.53.01.png
 

snorky510238

Chief glockenspiel maker
Joined
Jan 12, 2018
Location
Uk
Let’s look at the scenario again.

1. All my documents were passed so my funds are legit.

2. I have never reversed a withdrawal

3. I am in profit lifetime.

4. Casumo set my monthly deposit limit at £2,000 without asking any questions and tell me I have got a problem.

5. I have played there for 4 years.

If those facts still merit my account being closed due to IG then apart from the SOW, Casumo already had all the other information but did nothing and let’s be honest how many players have they got who are losing money they cannot afford?

The answer is thousands, literally. Make no bones about that’s how the industry survives and always has done. If every player was checked tomorrow and my case used as the yardstick to judge others, Casumo would lose a hell of a lot of their players (that goes for any Casino tbf).

So, if it takes this level of intrusiveness to determine, that I have a gambling problem, then unfortunately the logic says, that to carry out due diligence to all players, this procedure must be applied to everyone who opens an account, at any Casino.
 

danofthewibble

Meister Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2018
Location
UK
The UKGC has responded to me. I... don't think they understood my complaint, so I've gone into FAR more details in my response to them.

Please accept my apologies for the delay in responding to you.

From your email I can see that you are having difficulty withdrawing your winnings. This is because the gambling business has asked you to provide further documentation.

You have contacted us for help in this matter. I am afraid we cannot become involved in your complaint or get money back for you. This is because we are an industry regulator and not an ombudsman. Our role is to consider whether a gambling business has breached their licence conditions. We will take regulatory action where appropriate. But we do not have the power to get money back for individuals.

All gambling businesses must establish your name, address and date of birth before allowing you to gamble. They may be in breach of a licence condition if they don’t do this.

The gambling business may be able to verify this information electronically. For example, they may use credit referencing agencies and the electoral roll. If they can verify you in this way, the gambling business will allow you to place bets without providing further information. If not, they will ask you for your identity documents. This can include copies of your passport, driving licence and utility bills.

There is currently no requirement to check bank card details as part of the ID verification process.

I understand that you feel that the gambling business is delaying your withdrawal by asking for further information. But there will be circumstances where customers hit risk triggers later in the relationship. This may mean that further checks are required.

All gambling businesses must comply with Anti Money Laundering (AML) and Know Your Customer (KYC) rules. This may mean that they will ask you to provide more information at any time, including at withdrawal. For example, you may be asked to provide copies of bank statements and payslips.

These requests are rare. The business should let you know the type of information that they may need before you register.

If you have concerns about the information requested or how your data is stored, you should contact the gambling business. You can find their complaints process in their terms and conditions on their website.

If you are not happy with their final decision, you can contact their chosen Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR). This is an impartial adjudication service which is free of charge. You can find details of the nominated ADR in the complaints process. The ADR will ask you to exhaust the complaints process before taking your complaint to them. They may ask for a “deadlock” letter as evidence of this.

Thank you for bringing this matter to our attention. We have made a record of your complaint against the gambling business. We cannot become involved in your complaint, but this information helps us in our ongoing work to drive up standards within the gambling industry. 

The red bit is my highlight...
 

Slottery

Meister Member
PABnoaccred
MM
Joined
Aug 21, 2017
Location
Malta
I think that is how it is, no operator verify your payment method before letting you deposit but these other details they need to.
 

danofthewibble

Meister Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2018
Location
UK
Oh, and my response...

Thanks for your response. I have since been verified and received my winnings, however this was not the issue I was concerned with as such.

Just to be clear, I have no issues with supplying source of wealth information to reputable operators, and indeed supplied bank statements and payslips to Casumo as soon as they requested them.

I was also fully verified with them previously in terms of standard KYC checks, and had been for several years.

My concerns with them are solely:-

* In requesting the additional source of wealth information, they advise that they will not process any withdrawals until this information is provided. (Copy of the initial email attached)

* Further, they advise that despite this investigation, the player is still able to deposit there, they just won’t payout. This would indicate that they are not acting responsibly by encouraging the player to potentially spend (and win) money which they may ultimately decide not to pay out.

* The time taken to review these documents is excessive; it took around a fortnight for them to complete the review. Oddly, the payout was made four days before the review had been completed - they rejected a document initially, but still made the payment. This would indicate to me that the payout was not delayed due to concerns over my source of wealth, rather as a business decision.

* Checking various sources (Twitter, TrustPilot, internet forums) indicates that this issue of requesting documents for source of wealth was only affecting their players under their UKGC licence, and that this issue was widespread and has been ongoing for some time. Please see the attached thread, indicating the issue was not limited - Casumo Source of Wealth issues

As such, I have concerns that they have been using this request as a tactic to delay payment to players, rather than any genuine concerns over sources of wealth.
 

souldragon

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Location
Kent
Yes I am convinced it is because after 4 years I am slightly ahead. I deposit a lot, I withdraw a lot. GUTS did exactly the same, as I was slightly ahead with them after 2 years.The only difference being they said it was because of bonus abuse. In the previous 6 months they had given me 10 free spins at 20p. It’s laughable at best but from a business point of view I am no good to them.

Hypothetically let’s say I had lost £10,000 over that period (and let’s remember I passed SOW and all other verification). Would they still be closing my account? I highly doubt it as any overseeing organisation would be hard pushed to find them negligible and I would be the perfect customer.

Take that scenario a step further and as a disgruntled player I make a vain attempt to claim Casumo failed to take care of me properly and I want my 10k back. Would anybody give me a chance of succeeding? Would Casumo of turned around and said, “Yes we were wrong have it back”? No of course not, which tells you they are using double standards here and manipulating rules to suit their agenda.

Strange how my withdrawal for £300 stayed pending for 2 weeks and was then paid out, whilst the other guy had his 4K returned to his account and blew it. Who is the more responsible there? Would they have closed his account had he completed SOW? Not a chance, he would probably have been greeted with VIP status.

For any players just getting into online slotting, who may be looking in, I would say be very careful where you play and take heed of what is written here on the forum.

I personally think UK players will find themselves short of somewhere to play in the next 2 years that isn’t asking you to jump through hoops, running games at full rtp or completely trustworthy.
I had to laugh at the first part of your initial post where Casumo say they want playing at their casino to be a relaxing and entertaining experience.After all the stresses various forum members have been through over Source of Wealth,'relaxing' is the last word i would use to describe playing there.As for entertaining,forget it unless for have masochistic tendencies.
 

pinnit2014

Ueber Meister
PABnoaccred
mm1
Joined
Dec 13, 2014
Location
Glasgow and Home - N Ireland
Always did wonder as never had to send card pic to SV, William Hill etc.

Never had SOW from them either, despite neck for neck depos

Doesn’t take Turing to identify a pattern.

Why then, if it’s not a requirement, are folk told ‘we can’t payout without front and back of your card’?
 

goatwack

We call him....Humperdoo
CAG
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
Always did wonder as never had to send card pic to SV, William Hill etc.

Never had SOW from them either, despite neck for neck depos

Doesn’t take Turing to identify a pattern.

Why then, if it’s not a requirement, are folk told ‘we can’t payout without front and back of your card’?
With the four corners visibly showing. Please don't overlook this crucial element to tackling cyber crime
 

shadow123

Ueber Meister
MM
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Location
midlands
Often wonder how much info is communicated to the dunno what you would call it, player team possibly from the SOW team regarding the financial status gleaned from submitted bank statements etc.
I sent a bank statement to casino showing a respectable balance and was made a VIP without any chunky
deposits, not complaining,get treated very nicely but makes you wonder, that info really should go further than
people scrutinzing it for the purpose it was sent.
 

goatwack

We call him....Humperdoo
CAG
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
Often wonder how much info is communicated to the dunno what you would call it, player team possibly from the SOW team regarding the financial status gleaned from submitted bank statements etc.
I sent a bank statement to casino showing a respectable balance and was made a VIP without any chunky
deposits, not complaining,get treated very nicely but makes you wonder, that info really should go further than
people scrutinzing it for the purpose it was sent.
Don't worry too much. Rest assured, all personal info sent to casinos is treated with the utmost contempt and bandied about like a lady of easy virtue :thumbsup:
 
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