Casumo offering payments via mobile contract bill

spintee

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I will have another say, Its a danger game, so much for responsible gaming, But its no different from using credit cards or even a debit card and use overdraft,

It is a convinces, And casino think using ewallets is got some fraud in it? wait to see the how much trouble they get with mobile payments
 

vinylweatherman

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I will have another say, Its a danger game, so much for responsible gaming, But its no different from using credit cards or even a debit card and use overdraft,

It is a convinces, And casino think using ewallets is got some fraud in it? wait to see the how much trouble they get with mobile payments

I can see the golden opportunity for scammers, but the £30 per day limit won't be enough for the career scammers who (allegedly) make Neteller a dying option for the legitimate player. It's all down to how well the phone providers secure the system to ensure that only the subscriber is able to charge £30 to their bill, but as we know from the disaster that was the in-app purchase model, anyone who has hold of the phone can spend money from the contract because the handset itself acts as the authority because the app payment system itself put money before security by not requiring authentication for future payments once the first had been authorised. This lead to parents being stung by huge bills because they bought an app game for their kid, and though that because the kid didn't know their password they would not be able to make in-app purchases without having to ask for the parent to enter the password. How wrong they were, but they only found out the next month after the kid had played all month with what they thought was "fantasy money" within the game.

Phones are stolen on a regular basis, they are a prime target for thieves because they are small, valuable, and people have them and use them when out and about because this is the whole purpose of them. A stolen contract phone can now be used to syphon off £30 per day via a casino, and all it needs is the scammers to hatch a scheme to move that £30 from one account to another players' account so that it can be withdrawn with less scrutiny than might apply should they try to withdraw it direct. Phone payments BY DESIGN aid such scams because it's impossible to withdraw back to the deposit method, so the casino will not be suspicious just because a player has deposited by phone bill, but is being awkward about insisting that they have to be paid via another method. With Neteller, casinos insist on paying back to the same Neteller account.

For your small time crook, I am sure £30 per day per nicked phone for up to a month before the bill payer sees what's been going on is well worth the effort.
 

spintee

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£30 PER DAY per SITE. Like you said if the phone is being used daily for this type of stuff than it will not really get flagged up much, If a house is robbed and some one is on holiday thanthey got a few weeks to do what ever, Yes its a long shot but it does happen,

My sister has got my nephew and niece all the latest gadgets and kids now days are bad with all the games etc, Unbelievable as I had to resort to brook jumping and climbing trees back in the day,

But my sister got a phone bill the other week, I will be lying if I said how much or what site, but was in the region of £500 and I am sure she said it was connected to face book, Any way it was not casino but standedd playing games, But nothing was flagged? Yes she got the bill took off, I have also read many storys of this going on with much higher bills,

Phones can be a lump of gold now days in the right hands, bank details are stored, passwords, Years ago a house got robbed and took 3 people to carry a T.V out and another person to carry the VCR, Now days you can pick up 20 T.Vs but need a open back truck due to the sheer size big scrteen that is and not a old skool big back one, But people not botherd about none of that, a mobile phone will do, If no info or locked than still worth money, Check out the new Iphone 7 price :eek2:

I can see the golden opportunity for scammers, but the £30 per day limit won't be enough for the career scammers who (allegedly) make Neteller a dying option for the legitimate player. It's all down to how well the phone providers secure the system to ensure that only the subscriber is able to charge £30 to their bill, but as we know from the disaster that was the in-app purchase model, anyone who has hold of the phone can spend money from the contract because the handset itself acts as the authority because the app payment system itself put money before security by not requiring authentication for future payments once the first had been authorised. This lead to parents being stung by huge bills because they bought an app game for their kid, and though that because the kid didn't know their password they would not be able to make in-app purchases without having to ask for the parent to enter the password. How wrong they were, but they only found out the next month after the kid had played all month with what they thought was "fantasy money" within the game.

Phones are stolen on a regular basis, they are a prime target for thieves because they are small, valuable, and people have them and use them when out and about because this is the whole purpose of them. A stolen contract phone can now be used to syphon off £30 per day via a casino, and all it needs is the scammers to hatch a scheme to move that £30 from one account to another players' account so that it can be withdrawn with less scrutiny than might apply should they try to withdraw it direct. Phone payments BY DESIGN aid such scams because it's impossible to withdraw back to the deposit method, so the casino will not be suspicious just because a player has deposited by phone bill, but is being awkward about insisting that they have to be paid via another method. With Neteller, casinos insist on paying back to the same Neteller account.

For your small time crook, I am sure £30 per day per nicked phone for up to a month before the bill payer sees what's been going on is well worth the effort.
 

spintee

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£30 PER DAY per SITE. Like you said if the phone is being used daily for this type of stuff than it will not really get flagged up much, If a house is robbed and some one is on holiday thanthey got a few weeks to do what ever, Yes its a long shot but it does happen,

My sister has got my nephew and niece all the latest gadgets and kids now days are bad with all the games etc, Unbelievable as I had to resort to brook jumping and climbing trees back in the day,

But my sister got a phone bill the other week, I will be lying if I said how much or what site, but was in the region of £500 and I am sure she said it was connected to face book, Any way it was not casino but standedd playing games, But nothing was flagged? Yes she got the bill took off, I have also read many storys of this going on with much higher bills,

Phones can be a lump of gold now days in the right hands, bank details are stored, passwords, Years ago a house got robbed and took 3 people to carry a T.V out and another person to carry the VCR, Now days you can pick up 20 T.Vs but need a open back truck due to the sheer size big scrteen that is and not a old skool big back one, But people not botherd about none of that, a mobile phone will do, If no info or locked than still worth money, Check out the new Iphone 7 price :eek2:

I will edit this,

I just spoke to my sister, It was actually just short of £100 and it was from Itunes buying credit for fifa
 

brianmon

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No doubt Casumo will say it's for their customers' convenience.
But if someone is so short of a £30 deposit and so desperate to play, that they have to resort to taking credit against their phone bill. Then they really shouldn't be gambling.
So as far as I'm concerned, the casino is just being irresponsible and taking advantage of 'vulnerable' players.

They're not bothered about where a deposit is coming from, as long as the money is coming in.

The other problem i can foresee, is what happens to withdrawals?
I know from experience that Casumo have always insisted that any withdrawals I've ever made there, have always had to be taken by the same method, as the deposit was made.

So if someone makes a £30 deposit via their phone bill and wins £1000. Will they end up being £1000 in credit with their phone provider?
Or will Casumo be making exceptions to their own rules and paying to alternative method
 

Jono777

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Or will Casumo be making exceptions to their own rules and paying to alternative method

They will have to mate.

It says on a few of the sites who offer this deposit method that withdrawals cannot be made this way.

I would make an educated guess that withdrawals will have to be via Bank Transfer, a bit like when players who deposit via Pre pay vouchers such as Paysafe Card.

My other 'concern' with this horrible deposit method is how will/would it work for PAYG mobile users. Will the casino(s) be able to differentiate purely from an 11 digit mobile numer who is on a contract and can be billed and who is on a PAYG only sim.

If it is possible can the casino / payment provider also check if there is enough 'credit' on the PAYG phone as IMO that leads into other avenues in that just how much can they find out / know about our personal details / information etc??
 

brianmon

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My other 'concern' with this horrible deposit method is how will/would it work for PAYG mobile users. Will the casino(s) be able to differentiate purely from an 11 digit mobile numer who is on a contract and can be billed and who is on a PAYG only sim.

If it is possible can the casino / payment provider also check if there is enough 'credit' on the PAYG phone as IMO that leads into other avenues in that just how much can they find out / know about our personal details / information etc??

I'm sure they'll check the credit.
Otherwise there's a scam waiting to happen, lol

You can get PAYG sim cards for free at any of the network's shops, or from most supermarkets for 99p or less.
£30 deposit for 99p anyone??
 

Jono777

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I'm sure they'll check the credit.
Otherwise there's a scam waiting to happen, lol

You can get PAYG sim cards for free at any of the network's shops, or from most supermarkets for 99p or less.
£30 deposit for 99p anyone??

Foiled before I got started lol...

Just checked and although I wouldn't have touched it with a barge pole, the mobile option does not show for me.

Untitled.png

Happy Days! :D
 

vinylweatherman

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I'm sure they'll check the credit.
Otherwise there's a scam waiting to happen, lol

You can get PAYG sim cards for free at any of the network's shops, or from most supermarkets for 99p or less.
£30 deposit for 99p anyone??

It won't work. I tried to download an Android weather app with more than enough PAYG credit, but it didn't go through because this service was not available for my SIM, so there is clearly a way for this level of differentiation. It's probably the phone service provider, a bit like the system with cards where the first transaction is to request an authorisation for the amount being claimed, and if the bank does not authorise, it won't go through. After all, if a PAYG SIM goes into debit, it's going to be impossible to enforce payment.
 

vinylweatherman

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No doubt Casumo will say it's for their customers' convenience.
But if someone is so short of a £30 deposit and so desperate to play, that they have to resort to taking credit against their phone bill. Then they really shouldn't be gambling.
So as far as I'm concerned, the casino is just being irresponsible and taking advantage of 'vulnerable' players.

They're not bothered about where a deposit is coming from, as long as the money is coming in.

The other problem i can foresee, is what happens to withdrawals?
I know from experience that Casumo have always insisted that any withdrawals I've ever made there, have always had to be taken by the same method, as the deposit was made.

So if someone makes a £30 deposit via their phone bill and wins £1000. Will they end up being £1000 in credit with their phone provider?
Or will Casumo be making exceptions to their own rules and paying to alternative method

Unless it's Neteller that is, and then with many casinos you are instantly classed as a second rate "potential scumbag" who would probably abuse the hell out of any bonus or promotion you might get, so are blanket excluded from pretty much everything.

Casinos don't need these new methods, they need to stop shunning the old methods, working with the service provider to sort out the problems.

This new method can also bypass card issuers restrictions, as although I can't make gambling deposits with nearly all my cards, it's either "high risk" and the bank blanket blocks them, or they charge a 2.5% "processing fee", however, it's possible to pay a phone bill by the same card, and it's treated as a regular purchase, no fees, and no indication that it ended up in a casino, rather than on apps, texts, and chat.
 

refre

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Videoslots offer this as well.

The maximum deposit is NOK 120 (€13), the fee is NOK 80 (€9) (!)

They also have an invoice option which I actually looked into a while back.
You are limited to taking out one deposit or loan which has to paid back before depositing again using the same method.'
I think the maximum deposit is around €100.
The fee was quite reasonable. What stopped me though was not being able to pay back using your balance.
You would have to wait for the invoice then there's several days of processing before your payment being registered.
No withdrawals allowed the mean time.

Freddy
 

CraiGDaniel

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Videoslots offer this as well.

The maximum deposit is NOK 120 (€13), the fee is NOK 80 (€9) (!)

They also have an invoice option which I actually looked into a while back.
You are limited to taking out one deposit or loan which has to paid back before depositing again using the same method.'
I think the maximum deposit is around €100.
The fee was quite reasonable. What stopped me though was not being able to pay back using your balance.
You would have to wait for the invoice then there's several days of processing before your payment being registered.
No withdrawals allowed the mean time.

Freddy


It just gets worse. I am genuinely shocked.

I feel like the casumo rep will be scrolling past this thread.. this is nothing more than giving people with no available money, the chance to play.

There will be so many players getting their phones cut off and credit rating destroyed due to not being able to afford the bill when it comes in.

Why should Casumo care?

If i was Byan they would be straight in the rogue pit for giving people an easy chance to ruin their future.

(Edit) not just casumo but any casino offering this method. Just very shocked to see casumo employ it as i rated them highly
 

Jono777

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Maybe worth a quick watch of CT's stream tomorrow night, see if he's promoting this new method or has any views on it etc?
 

goatwack

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It just gets worse. I am genuinely shocked.

I feel like the casumo rep will be scrolling past this thread.. this is nothing more than giving people with no available money, the chance to play.

There will be so many players getting their phones cut off and credit rating destroyed due to not being able to afford the bill when it comes in.

Why should Casumo care?

If i was Byan they would be straight in the rogue pit for giving people an easy chance to ruin their future.

(Edit) not just casumo but any casino offering this method. Just very shocked to see casumo employ it as i rated them highly

I agree in that any casino offering this payment option should become unaccredited or even rogued. Fast payments, friendly chat and good game selection is irrelevant when compared to what is essentially the polar opposite of Responsible Gambling.
 

CasumoAffiliates

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Thank you all for your feedback. BOKU is a highly-requested payment method that adds additional diversity to our payment product. That being said, we understand your concerns and are investigating limiting this method even further on our side.
 

babyjoker

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Never heard of this highly requested BOKU and I speak about gambling with other gamblers 7 days a week for maybe 3-12 hrs a day. Sounds like a good way to destroy someone with no credit, anyone can get a mobile contract, and I mean ANYONE!

You'll get those that take out contracts purely to use for gambling, the James Pethericks of society, not good at all :confused:
 

vinylweatherman

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Thank you all for your feedback. BOKU is a highly-requested payment method that adds additional diversity to our payment product. That being said, we understand your concerns and are investigating limiting this method even further on our side.

You should investigate WHY some people are asking for this method? If it's because they want to play now, but are currently broke, then this would be a dangerous request to agree to implement. Credit cards are also a big problem because again people are borrowing money to play, and may not be able to repay the card company.
 

brianmon

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You should investigate WHY some people are asking for this method? If it's because they want to play now, but are currently broke, then this would be a dangerous request to agree to implement. Credit cards are also a big problem because again people are borrowing money to play, and may not be able to repay the card company.

Although, at least with credit cards, only a (minimum) payment towards the balance is due at the end of the month.
Where as with a mobile bill, the whole balance is due.

It's also perfect for identity thieves.
It's so easy to get a mobile contract, much easier than a credit card.
 

spintee

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I agree mobile phones are becoming big in society now days, But also with that people have apps connected to the blowers and takes a few clicks for a deposit, without the use for mobile payments

Why on earth has a mobile payment been bought in is beyond me, I suppose its a cheaper alternative to some sites payment methods an charges that come with them, But I can see this becoming a disaster,

At the minute sites are worried about charge backs, Well they have seen nothing yet if this phone option comes in to effect for sites,


Stolen mobile phones, people taking out contracts just to gamble, people claiming they did not deposit, Maybe any one that does choose this method must be fully bonafide before hand,
 

colinsunderland

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there was a big scam about 10 or so years ago with mobile payments. A bookie opened up that only took £3 bets by text, and you collected your winnings at a post office. There was a £30 limit you could bet per day.
People made a lot of money by taking out sim only contracts on, mainly Sony Mobile, not paying them but running up bills of £200+
 
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