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CASINOS TURN OFF SWITCH

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by wayram, Jul 6, 2008.

    Jul 6, 2008
  1. wayram

    wayram Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Australia
    I am totally convinced that the casinos have a turn off switch, a couple of examples...playing at a very reputable MG casino and had a good win on the weekender of 1600 and turned that into 2800, silly me thought that i wont pull it out i will play a little higher and maybe build it up, but no, OFF GOES THE SWITCH and no matter what denomination i played i got tiddly squat and blew the lot over a couple of days..Should have withdrew.. Same casino about a week later put in 100 and built it to 1000, smarter this time withdrew 500 and guess what, OFF GOES THE SWITCH, and over 2 nights blew the other 500 again getting NOTHING worth while on any game. My wife had a the same experience with another MG casino, withdrew 700 from 1300 and BANG, off went the switch and couldn't get anything on any game she played, It seems that IF you are lucky enough to get something , if you play on, the SWITCH goes off, and if you withdraw that is also a sin and the switch goes off. This seems to happen at all of the MG casinos that i play. Any one else had a similiar experience ?
     
  2. Jul 6, 2008
  3. wayram

    wayram Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Australia
    I forgot to add that my wife and i will be doing it different from now on, If we are lucky enough to have a reasonable win we will withdraw the LOT. We will then not play at that casino for at least a week and play at another hoping that they turn the switch back on. At least it is worth a try...........:thumbsup:
     
  4. Jul 6, 2008
  5. Audioz

    Audioz Banned User

    Occupation:
    call center agent
    Location:
    Austria
    That's very normal, because always after a big win, you'll get after that nearly nothing, but that's random ;)

    So if you get a bigger win, make directly a cashout, because i made the same error and believed, that i could get much more, but after that i always loosed back my money to the casino :(
     
    2 people like this.
  6. Jul 6, 2008
  7. lauram

    lauram Dormant account

    Occupation:
    self employed
    Location:
    toronto
    I use to get up there and do the same keep playing thinking more will hit then nothing left to take out. So now i do my reg deposits depending on casino im a low roller though. So my deposits are between 20 and 50. If i double up or triple up i withdraw and move to next casino. Last week i couldnt do anything wrong i had withdraws all over the place in each casino i deposited. This week its like as you said cant hit a thing only few features i had paid close to nothing. Its like they just all go sour. I would prefer a casino that at least if you hit a feature gave you longer play time but its not fun when all you hit is dead spin after dead spin. So far past few days mg rtg rivals are all like on that off switch button.
     
  8. Jul 6, 2008
  9. GGW Laurie

    GGW Laurie Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Self Employed
    Location:
    In the Beautiful South !!
    i know how you feel and can understand where yout comming from but as someone said earlier its all random...........................laurie:)
     
  10. Jul 6, 2008
  11. funky_seagull

    funky_seagull Dormant account

    Occupation:
    unemployed, on incapacity benefit.
    Location:
    scotland
    I don't know if there is an on/off switch. But recently I have been doing dire at mg casinos. Its not just the slots but the table games are dead. Winning nothing in 3card poker. The blackjack is awful. I am lucky if I can win 1 game in 5. All the mg games I play are ridiculously hard. I think maybe I have hit one of the worst losing streaks ever. The only thing which I can seem to do ok in is the live dealer baccarat, the live roulette is too expensive, and they dont offer live blackjack. In frustration I wonder if there is a dodgy scrougeRNG seed and you just have to wait patiently for the more genourous seed to be loaded into the program. But this is probably not true. I think in reality i had a winning streak but it has gone now and i have lost faith in my ability to win at casinos anymore. I thought maybe just play the free slot tournaments to feed the need but without the greed, but the free tournaments are not really free if you want to win, as it seems the only way you have any chance of winning them is if you buy the continues. And stupidly I did this and felt annoyed with myself, because it was a waste of money and I should know better. I am starting to feel it is time to quit gambling altogether. I don't seem to have the self control needed to succeed anymore which is scary and makes me wonder if I'm developing a problem. Best to quit now before i end up in serious debt.

    I am uneasy with RNG's. I have been seriously skanked lately. I don't think anyone is cheating, but computers are too good to play against as opponents. it feels like maybe they have A.I. That learns about your style of play and adapts itself to it over time, but it is more likely that random number generators by their nature are impossible to beat. I tend to mainly play live games now as i do seem to do slightly better in them, but even in these the losses at times can be great and to be honest I wish I hadn't started gambling. I think maybe it is time to quit and do something better with my time and money. But this could be the ramblings of a paranoid lunatic who is a sore loser and should know better than to let a bloody machine kick my arse.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2008
    3 people like this.
  12. Jul 6, 2008
  13. james01

    james01 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Webmaster
    Location:
    Germany
    I don't know if there's really anything untoward going on, but I'm kind of suspicious. I would totally drop a casino where all the games went dead on me after a good win.
     
  14. Jul 6, 2008
  15. Jufo

    Jufo Three-toed sloth

    Occupation:
    Teacher
    Location:
    Finland
    Suppose you deposit 100$ to the casino and play the lowest house-edge game such as Classic blackjack and manage to turn that $100 into $1000 with 1 in 10 chance. The question is: Do you still have the same 1 in 10 chance of turning that already won $1000 into $10000 or does some mechanism (switch) activate in order for the casino to not lose too much?

    The thing is that random games don't have memory. It shouldn't matter how much you have won in the past, you still have the exactly same chances of winning as when you started.

    It would be nice to see some data of these cases where the odds have supposedly turned against the player. Enough data would show whether the odds were true or manipulated by the software.
     
  16. Jul 6, 2008
  17. funky_seagull

    funky_seagull Dormant account

    Occupation:
    unemployed, on incapacity benefit.
    Location:
    scotland
    Here is one session from last night I will copy and paste for you.


    This is my last session on double exposure blackjack. I was using a martingale, which is admittedly not a good system to use. But I decided to try it out of desperation due to failing miserable using flat betting and the double up if you win strategy, it doesn't seem to matter what system you use eventually the tables get turned on you and you hit a cold patch of constant losses.

    As you can see it started off quite well, with me winning, and then suddenly tails off into disaster with me losing 9 games in a row and my entire bankroll.

    7596 View 7/6/2008 2:13:48 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7597 View 7/6/2008 2:14:22 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $4.00
    7598 View 7/6/2008 2:14:35 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7599 View 7/6/2008 2:14:52 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $4.00
    7600 View 7/6/2008 2:15:09 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7601 View 7/6/2008 2:15:22 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $0.00
    7602 View 7/6/2008 2:16:14 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $8.00 $16.00
    7603 View 7/6/2008 2:16:28 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7604 View 7/6/2008 2:16:40 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $0.00
    7605 View 7/6/2008 2:16:55 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $4.00 $8.00
    7606 View 7/6/2008 2:17:14 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $2.00
    7607 View 7/6/2008 2:17:29 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $2.00
    7608 View 7/6/2008 2:18:17 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7609 View 7/6/2008 2:18:27 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $4.00
    7610 View 7/6/2008 2:18:41 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $2.00
    7611 View 7/6/2008 2:18:54 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $2.00
    7612 View 7/6/2008 2:19:06 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $4.00
    7613 View 7/6/2008 2:19:17 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7614 View 7/6/2008 2:19:27 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $4.00
    7615 View 7/6/2008 2:19:49 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7616 View 7/6/2008 2:19:59 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $4.00
    7617 View 7/6/2008 2:20:15 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7618 View 7/6/2008 2:20:21 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $4.00
    7619 View 7/6/2008 2:20:42 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    7620 View 7/6/2008 2:20:53 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $0.00
    7621 View 7/6/2008 2:21:06 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $0.00
    7622 View 7/6/2008 2:21:30 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $4.00 $0.00
    7623 View 7/6/2008 2:21:44 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $8.00 $0.00
    7624 View 7/6/2008 2:22:29 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $10.00 $0.00
    7625 View 7/6/2008 2:22:53 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $20.00 $0.00
    7626 View 7/6/2008 2:23:10 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $25.00 $0.00
    7627 View 7/6/2008 2:23:25 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $10.00 $0.00

    The hands dealt to me in the final 9, follow.

    7619 View 7/6/2008 2:20:42 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $1.00 $0.00
    Dealer - - 19
    Player hand - 12 (hit) 24 lose

    7620 View 7/6/2008 2:20:53 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $0.00

    Dealer 19
    Player hand - 19 (lose) (in double exposure blackjack you lose if your hand ties with the dealers.)

    7621 View 7/6/2008 2:21:06 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $2.00 $0.00

    Dealer - 19
    Player hand - 13 (hit) get 17 (hit again) get 27

    Dealer hand 13 - dealer hits gets a 6- makes total of 19
    Player hand - 8 I hit get 18


    7623 View 7/6/2008 2:21:44 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $8.00 $0.00

    dealer has 19

    player has 19 (loss as push is a loss in double exposure.)

    7624 View 7/6/2008 2:22:29 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $10.00 $0.00

    Dealer has 20

    player has 16 - player hits goes bust with 23


    7625 View 7/6/2008 2:22:53 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $20.00 $0.00

    dealer has 20

    player has 13 - player hits gets ace, hits again gets another ace, hits again gets 2, hits again gets another 2, hits a fifth time gets queen and goes bust with 29


    7626 View 7/6/2008 2:23:10 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $25.00 $0.00

    dealer has 20

    player has 19 - player hits goes bust with 22


    7627 View 7/6/2008 2:23:25 AM Double Exposure Blackjack $10.00 $0.00

    dealer has 19

    player has 11 - player hits gets 7 - player hits again goes bust with 28

    Remember in double exposure the dealer doesn't have a hidden card, so players make their decision to hit or stand already knowing what cards the dealer has.


    However please don't get me wrong. I am not accusing anyone of cheating, and hate to sound like a whining loser, I am posting this as an example of how gambling can catch you out and why you should quit while your ahead, and why you should never never use martingale betting systems.

    Will copy and paste more games if you're interested, it is I guess simply the house edge coming into effect.

    I don't want to bore you with too many figures and stats as it is a chore to read through them, but will post more if your interested. But surely you need to see play history from many different people to build an accurate picture of fairness.

    The microgaming system has been certified as fair by independant auditors, unless they bribe them of course (just kidding)

    I think maybe people should be careful about spending too long playing the games though, any games - and should cash out when they've made 20 - 30% profit. I wish I could do this, I havn't enough self-discipline to know when to stop and that is why I fail.

    But I have to ask myself, why would someone who is cheating be willing to supply you with your game history? Wouldn't they try to hide this from you, so you couldn't just go and copy and paste it like I just did? I think maybe it was extreme bad luck. Or mathematically speaking shows that random number generators cannot be beaten.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2008
  18. Jul 6, 2008
  19. Jufo

    Jufo Three-toed sloth

    Occupation:
    Teacher
    Location:
    Finland
    The thing is that such play data doesn't show anything unusual in itself. Your session ended with losing 9 times in a row and that will happen sooner or later. I estimate 1 in 100 chance of losing 9 hands in a row. This means that it will happen to you on average every 100-200 hands you play. And did you stand on couple of hands when you both had 19? You should hit and hope for Ace or Deuce.

    To really show something, you would need to have, say, 10 sessions in a row where this same thing happens to you every time. Only then it might show that there is something off. It is difficult to show bias in these kind of situations, as it would require large number of playing sessions and probably thousands of hands played. And it's not possible to just gather losing sessions from different players because then you would select data by ignoring winning sessions, and this would make the whole thing invalid.

    Actually I have had difficulties in receiving my play history in some cases where I have had statistically extremely unlikely results.
     
  20. Jul 7, 2008
  21. NASHVEGAS

    NASHVEGAS Banned User - flamming, disrespecting admin,

    Occupation:
    LOL
    Location:
    MERS
    Too tired to do math or check but I believe 1 in 400+/- (it happens)......lots of other issues I have addressed in the past, even put my money where my mouth is by attempting to obtain an fair independent BJ audit (an oxymoron), have collected numerous amounts of BJ data on 5 of 6 of the most popular software platforms......BJ Tag Words=most data where not at expectataion is skewed always towards the house rather than the player but never by enough standard deviations (2 or more) to be considered anything but fair gaming, in most cases since only skewed the house has the defense of not enough hands played, correlated software (very hard for an auditor to determine even assumming an auditor with backbone which is rare as the corporate world proves) but the strange reoccurences of certain types of streaks for an example that occur skewed in favor of the house rather than player or expectation in the event it can be determined............................... my conclusions=who gives a rat's ass??????
     
  22. Jul 7, 2008
  23. funky_seagull

    funky_seagull Dormant account

    Occupation:
    unemployed, on incapacity benefit.
    Location:
    scotland
    Well I guess someone who keeps losing lots of money playing computerized blackjack would give a rat's arse...

    I can supply other play sessions, but have had enough... I am going to take a long break away from online gambling find something more useful to do with my time.

    My conclusions:

    Don't play at all, the odds are heavily weighted against you; keep your money, save it, do something lasting and worthwhile with it - don't take the bait unless you can be a very clever fish.

    Even if it is money you can afford to lose, it is still your money; and unless you have good self-control, money you can afford to lose quickly becomes money you can't afford to lose.
     
  24. Jul 7, 2008
  25. NASHVEGAS

    NASHVEGAS Banned User - flamming, disrespecting admin,

    Occupation:
    LOL
    Location:
    MERS
    EXACTLY!!!:thumbsup:....you wanna believe but numbers do not lie,.....as for the rat's arse reference, gaming fairness in importance imo ranks below fast payouts, being paid period, good customer service, and pretty pictures based on the threads I have read or been involved with over the past year and one half......hell gaming fairness might even be passed soon in importance by how winning correlates to what day and/or time of the day you play as well as the amount you deposited.:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
     
  26. Jul 7, 2008
  27. bromo98

    bromo98 Dormant account

    Location:
    Canada
    been there, seen it, got the T-shirt

    At last, I can finally respond to one of these threads.

    I have been in a position to see, not only the individual player logs (not this specific player - just in general), as well as hundreds of millions of hand results cumulatively.
    When you are able to see that view, you'll see the averages, the results, all those ups and downs blend into one beautifully stable number.

    There are no switches, no trapdoors, no pedals for those that have are the top of the casino industry (we have all seen too much to believe that there is no one out there who might attempt something). But from the top 4-5 in this industry, you do not have anything to fear - that is in terms of software providers.

    One more point. The casino companies that licence the software have 0 access to anything that is of significance to the programming of the software. They have options they can utilize to help manage their casinos (paytables mainly) and these depend on and vary by software manufacturer. They can't affect your results. They can't do anything other than pay or not pay, have good CS or bad, have good marketing or bad, honour bonuses and terms or not.

    Ah...that felt good.
    Cheers All

    bromo
     
    4 people like this.
  28. Jul 7, 2008
  29. Roar

    Roar Dormant account

    Occupation:
    SE
    Location:
    Philippines
    Which begs the question bromo, "Where is the data?"

    You rightly point out that being able to access millions of hands will alleviate allegations of rigged or tampered gaming software. So where is it?

    Why wouldn't every single Casino (SW provider) break their neck to publish the gaming data in full every single month? What's there to hide?

    But none of them do. A normal and prudent thinking person would conclude something was being concealed and that something would not bear close examination.

    As a player of both B+M and online Casinos I am left with little doubt the online version is of dubious quality. Whilst I might agree the major SW providers run a relatively clean game there are aspects of their SW that deserve an exacting audited examination.

    Outside of the major SW providers players are literally taking their financial life into their own hands.

    >
     
    1 person likes this.
  30. Jul 7, 2008
  31. wayram

    wayram Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    sales
    Location:
    Australia
    RANDOM SHAMDOM, if the spins were randon as they lead us to believe then it would not matter if you won 10k, you should then take them at their word and continue to play and build it up eventually to 20k, thats why i dont think that the spins are random at all, it is computerised so they can do anything they like, and DO turn the SWITCH. If it was random i should be able to play and get drops not get nothing at all...........Just play smarter and get off if you have a win and go somewhere else then come back a week or so later and see if the switch is back on...
     
  32. Jul 7, 2008
  33. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    William Hill (Crypto), Ladbrokes (MGS), Betfred (Playtech), Virgin Games (Wagerworks) , are either land based casinos/sportbooks, or have enormous tangible enterprises that are at stake if they were caught running crooked software. To assume that these companies have not done due diligence and are not monitoring their gaming software is absurd.

    By the way, the Vegas based MGM Grand casino was online a few years ago. They were using Wagerworks as well - which is owed by IGT (International Gaming Technologies) . If you think their games are crooked - well, I'd be willing to bet that they are not.

    Hell, even Betfair received the "Queens Award" emblem which it is entitled to do having won a Queen's Award for Enterprise, in the Innovation category, during 2003. A Queen's Award is given (as its name suggests) by the Queen of England, on the recommendation of the Prime Minister, and following a full assessment by the Department of Trade and Industry.

    I'd be quite surprised that the Dept. of Trade and Industry didn't scrutinize Betfair's software (Chartwell) before giving the thumbs up worthy of the Queen herself. :D

    And where are the whistle blowers? For those of us who understand the turbulence of the industry and how people move from one position to the other - (many times with other software providers) - why hasn't someone blown this scandal out of the water? Is it a grand conspiracy, or is there simply no scandal?

    In the past ten years of running this site, crooked software problems are rare. When it does happen, it's usually bad programing done by some of the rinky-dink casinos. This is why players need be careful with whom they are dealing with.

    Check the "Spot the Rogue" section - if a casino fails to identify what software it uses - move on.

    And if you still don't trust the software, then choose to play live games. I don't think live slots are offered though :p
     
    1 person likes this.
  34. Jul 7, 2008
  35. GrandMaster

    GrandMaster Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Mathematician by day, online gambler by night.
    Location:
    UK
    Well, Mugabe and Ceauşescu both had knighthoods, so the scrutiny is not always as thorough as you might imagine.
     
  36. Jul 7, 2008
  37. NASHVEGAS

    NASHVEGAS Banned User - flamming, disrespecting admin,

    Occupation:
    LOL
    Location:
    MERS
    I could rebut this statement as many others often have (accountability,transparency,whatever) but it would not matter. If only I understood what a "casino watchdog and player advocate" was. Blame me as I obviously have no clue.......Perhaps the answer lies elsewhere!
     
  38. Jul 7, 2008
  39. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    Go ahead and rebut it - no one is stopping you. Show me where William Hill or IGT is conspiring to cheat players using crooked software. Show me that Ladbrokes is cheating their players. Post it here.

    "Casino Watchdog and Player Advocate" is a title players have given to Casinomeister - it did not originate from me. If you're hung up on the title - then give it a vote and I'll gladly change it. By the way, I consider this site an information site and an advocate site for both player and industry representatives . It's always been this way.

    Perhaps you have forgotten that the forum is only a portion of Casinomeister. There is the Rogue section, Spot the Rogue, FAQ, News, Newsletter, Webcasts, Fight Online Casino Spam, and the Pitch a Bitch section. And the list goes on....

    For those of you who only dwell in the forum, you are doing yourselves a huge disservice.

    The bottom line is that Casinomeister provides the platform for people to share their thoughts, but it should be done responsibly. You can't just point fingers at some corporation and say that they cheat because you think so. You need to be prepared to provide enough evidence that they do so.

    Casinos have the odds in their favor - that's a fact. If you think you are going to beat the house, or come up with some snake oil system that will beat a game of chance, then you should have your head examined and defenestrate your computer.

    Lastly, I'm not defending anyone or anything. I am not the "casino apologist". I am pointing out facts or points of view and allowing anyone willing to invest the time to read and understand them to make up their own minds on how to participate in this industry.
     
    3 people like this.

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