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Casino Complaint Casino Reward Group, be aware of certain terms and conditions

Discussion in 'Casino Complaints - Non-Bonus Issues' started by corrie1946, Aug 6, 2012.

  1. corrie1946

    corrie1946 Banned User - troll PITA

    Hi everybody,
    Here is my story about depositing and withdrawal I experienced short time ago.
    Read it if you want, call me an idiot afterwards if you like, up to you, but be warned.
    By the way, ofcourse I had some short discussion with Rene before I post this but did not come further than her mentioning read the terms and conditions of our group altough I asked her honest opinion about those terms and conditions. OK, here ite goes :

    am a regular player on slotmachines at various internet-casinos, find casinos like Unibet, the Dutch Kroon Casino as well as some other reliable casinos as I may say so. But sometimes you want to try other slotmachines and therefor other casinos.
    Got promotional material by post from this CR group, inviting me to start playing at Quatro Casino. Ok, gave it a try.
    Received a 25 euro bonus, had to deposit at least 1 euro to get started, registered under my own name and up we go.
    Deposited not 1 but 5 euros via Ideal /direct bankaccounting.
    Now when you are in the deposit process via Ideal you get the choice from which bankaccountno. you want to pay your deposit.
    My wife and I play together and have the same bank, just different bankaccountnumbers.
    This time we deposited from my wifes bankaccountnumber. Saw no harm in doing this (my wife neither hehe), and this is really not a problem at all for mentioned casinos like Unibet, Kroon and many others we play. In fact, when it comes to a withdraw later they simply ask you to which bankaccount you want to have transfered your withdrawal.
    Made the wagering requirements and requested for 500 euro withdrawal, later sent in the paperwork like DL, utilitybills etc and a copy of the bankaccountnumber-registration, which was my wifes bankaccount..
    End of the story : CR Group conviscated the 500 euro (plus they kept 5 euro deposit from my wifes bankaccount lol) because I was the registered player and the deposit was from my wifes bankaccount.
    Rene calls this blackmailing, publishing this, but I already informed CR / Riskmanager by mail last week wednesday I dont want to receive the 500 anymore, be happy with it, you will not see me again, I just want to inform players in this business about these terms.
    To me a customerfriendly casino should have asked further to a client, from whom was that bankaccount you used or be sportive and act like f.i. Unibet and others mentioned. I am not talking abt the various email offers you get from CR and some others shortly after you asked for a withdrawal, inviting you to play on with more bonuses and meanwhile losing your pending withdrawal,its just this warning about the mentioned terms and conditions. Now go ahead fellow players or who ever, call me an idiot:)
     
  2. raj

    raj Dormant account

    No disrespect, and I understaand it's all completely innocent , but ANY casino where you use a payment card in a different name to that on the account is going to cause you problems IMHO.

    Raj
     
    2 people like this.
  3. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Did your wife also use the same offer by making another casino account?

    These "deposit 1, get 20 (or 25)" offers seem to be a magnet for multi accounters. I think they should be ditched altogether, rather than have the casino group suffer the bad PR that comes along when things turn sour.

    I don't know about this "ideal" deposit method, but in my experience it takes some effort to use someone else's bank details to fund a deposit method. I could understand it if this were a joint account where both parties have the legal right to use it, but when the accounts are separate, the default position taken is that the funds arising do not belong to the player, and that permission has not been granted for their use.

    This mistake seems to be down to having both yours and your wife's account selectable on the same conduit. It would be better to completely separate your funding methods such that such mistakes become impossible to make by accident.

    The deposit should be returned to where it came from in due course.

    Casino Rewards are regulated in the Kahnawake territory, and have recently shown considerable concern in protecting players from wrong decisions made by casinos. An appeal to Kahnawake may be worthwhile.
     
  4. corrie1946

    corrie1946 Banned User - troll PITA

    Raj, thanks for your reply.
    I did not use a card for depositing but Ideal.
    Furthermore I wrote already that this is not a problem at reliable casinos like unibet, kroon and others.
    Really, my 5 euros are as much as 5 euros from my wifes bankaccount. And only 1 euro was necessary :)
    In case CR would have any doubts if I perhaps stole these 5 euros first from a stranger and then deposited it to them, a clientfriendly casino could have asked more info before conviscating or even placec the amount back on your player account.
     
  5. corrie1946

    corrie1946 Banned User - troll PITA

    Hi vynilweatherman, no my wife did not have an account at CR , we play fair, together most times and not trying to get double chances.
    Thks for your reply.
     
  6. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    CR have been hit so often by these "double chancers" on this offer that they are likely to assume the worst. Maybe they believe that the "mistake" you made was in not covering your tracks well enough and making that slip-up of using your wife's bank account is what they think "busts" you as a "chancer" who is up to no good.

    These other casinos are familiar with you as a player, so are more likely to accept you and your wife sharing and exchanging funding methods, and/or playing the same account. CR do not know you, so your first impression with them has been to do something that looks dodgy, and only try to set the record straight AFTER you win €500.

    It is also against the terms of these other "reputable" casinos to do what you have done, but some will allow it by prior arrangement. Had you discussed this in advance with CR they may not have been so harsh, although they may have told you to not do it, or for your wife to register her own account rather than use her bank account to deposit into yours.

    You may even be in breach of the terms of use for Ideal, as they may think both accounts belong to you. Other eWallets allow several funding methods, but they must always belong to the account holder. The fact Ideal seem OK with this may be down to them not knowing, rather than approving. This could also be the case with these other casinos that have accepted this arrangement.
     
    1 person likes this.
  7. Jasminebed

    Jasminebed Closer to 100 than Birth

    Sorry you have learnt this lesson the hard way. If you read the casino terms and conditions (and it is the same most places), the method used to fund your account must be in your name. Even with permission from your spouse, this rule is not normally waived.

    This rule is in place to protect people who may have had their credit card information either stolen, or misused by someone with access to their card details, like a family or household member.

    The $5 deposit should be refunded to the source however. Otherwise there is a failure to protect the card holder who is not the account holder.

    I hope either you or Renee can update when the $5 is refunded.
     
    4 people like this.
  8. Jasminebed

    Jasminebed Closer to 100 than Birth

    I think you would be wise to clarify with the other casinos, and get it in writing, that this shared funding between spouses is acceptable.

    Some withdrawals get more review than others. A certain number are audited randomly, sign-up bonuses, and large amounts.

    If you don't have it in writing from your other casinos, you might find yourself in a for shock at some future date with a big win, for the exact same reasons as Casino Rewards.

     
  9. homerbert

    homerbert Meister Member webby MM

    one of the worst (is this mean bad?) not sure) MG group in the world. Hate them so much, for their idiotic everyday spam...
    Also i believe that casino, that want really will be nice for players, and had nice reputation, should made really good investigation about cases like this. I mean if player really had only 1 account, but deposit from wife acc, casino should pay. Because if player lost, everything ok, and nobody ban player, but when player win, they ban.
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Tirilej

    Tirilej Still a Lady CAG MM

    That's because the casino don't know he uses his wife's account until he tries to cash out.

    I don't get it really. Why use someone elses account for such a small sum of money?
    I don't think it's even legal, at least not here, to use, pay or shop or anything with someone elses money. A couple that share their economy usually have only one that both can use.
    I'm sorry if I sounds rough, but this is my thoughts of this issue.
     
    2 people like this.
  11. homerbert

    homerbert Meister Member webby MM

    hm, ITS HIS WIFE :D
    he take just 5$, who cares it? Also, if she know it, it cant be problem!
     
  12. corrie1946

    corrie1946 Banned User - troll PITA

    Jasmine bed, big win ? 500 euros i am talking about which CR conviscated.
    Honestly won, beating wagering req. and being lucky above all ofcourse.
    If i go to a land based casino nobody is asking me if the 5 euros i deposit are mine or from somebody else and even if they are from somone else , if i win they pay me out. Not that this ever happened to me but you know what i mean.
    One step further and the internet casinos want to know how you earned your 5 euros which you deposited , guess why they would ask if you request for a withdrawal.
    At least CR did not ask me any question about my deposit from my wifes bankaccount before I requested a withdrawal.
    As for me, let me be honest, CR is a cheap company , a bunch of losers. But I may be wrong, find it out yourselve :)
    Same as companies like Platinum etc, offering you more bonuses by mail, whilst pending withdrawals.
    Fair gambling is you gamble money and then winning or losing,not having terms and conditions which make it even more difficult with your chances to win. I will keep it on casinos like Unibet, Kroon and some others in the future, not for the winning chances but for the reasonable conditions when you win. I will start a webpage soon, in Holland, about these facts concerning internetcasinos, there must come an end to this. Gambling is your own responsability and maybe not a clever way of doing things but why must we accept to be foold twice or more?
    (sorry for my bad english language maybe, i do my best) I wish to end this with wishing good luck to everybody who gambles and congrats when you later receive your earned money.:thumbsup:
     
  13. aceking123

    aceking123 Ueber Meister CAG PABnononaccred MM

    hi pointless having a moan @ jas the point is that money has indeed come from your wifes account , you should of made sure that the account was in her name then you wouldnt be here moaning about them taking your 500 quid , not your 500 to point out its your wifes 500 quid ) , there far to much fraud online as it is now , yes you both have the same account but you both also have different account numbers there is where the problem is ,you should of been upfront with them take it on the chin move on & dont take it out on meister members here there only giving out a different look & advice & good advice , i see it as youve taken moneys from your wifes account yes it well maybe your moneys but the fact is you should of used the proper account details , best of luck in future & please dont take it the wrong way )
     
    2 people like this.
  14. corrie1946

    corrie1946 Banned User - troll PITA

    Homerbert lol. She knew it, was sitting next to me.
    As a matter of fact, we only deposited 5 euros , knowing and experienced 9 of 10 of those internetcasinos in the meantime, having pitty with pple who did not experience these kind of internetcasinos and depositing 100, 500 or more.
    By the way, am curious for a serious reply on this from casinomeister and or rene, come on rene, call this blackmail in public.
    Tell me and readers you find this term / condition fair, whilst at least not sending back the famous 5 euros.:notworthy
     
  15. Jasminebed

    Jasminebed Closer to 100 than Birth

    I do actually find the term fair, the confiscation of the winnings.

    I don't find it fair not to refund the money.

    When I talked about a big win corrie, I meant if you go and read the terms at the casinos you play at, you will find the exact same term about deposits being from account in your name. And if you don't have authorization from the casino, you might find a large win or a random audit picks it up at some point.

    The casino cannot see that your wife is sitting right beside you and consents to her account being used. And I don't think they will take her word for it after the fact. People lie all the time to protect their spouses or family.

    If it is no problem at your other casinos, I'm sure they will be happy to confirm this for you if you don't already have written exemption. What I am trying to tell you that it might just be they have not noticed if you have not expressly been granted permission.

    Now, if you go to a land-based casino, they don't know if you snitched a $20 bill out of your wife's purse. But if you go to the cashier's cage with your wife's Visa card in hand to get a cash advance, they are not going to give you one.

    There are many people with gambling addictions who do NOT have their spouses permission to use their money to gamble.

    At some point you failed to read and understand the terms and conditions.
     
    3 people like this.
  16. Tirilej

    Tirilej Still a Lady CAG MM

    In a way it's maybe blackmailing, but if you go back and read all the answers you have recieved, I can only find one that's agreeing with you, and to be honest, he didn't see your wife sitting next to you either.
    We just have your words for it...and you still broke their rules.
    Even if I never would play at any of their casinos since I don't like them,I can fully understand why they can't and won't pay you.

    It's maybe a good thing that you posted this really, because there are always newbies that don't know about this rule and now we have had a chance to enlighten them;)
     
    4 people like this.
  17. corrie1946

    corrie1946 Banned User - troll PITA

    Hi Mr.Jones, you seem to forget that CR accepted the deposit which was from my wifes bankaccountnummer and she was not the registrated. That appeared not to be a problem. And again, here at home its not a problem, we play together and use our mutual bankaccounts whenever we like to do so.
    And as said again, this is not a problem for the most other (relionable) casinos i know of , like unibet etc.
    Just tell me, what would be wrong if CR asked me later more info about the deposit before they should pay the withdrawal?
    Would that not have been a descent clientfriendly manner?

    I do not really care about the 500 euro, told CR already a week ago they can keep it, invested only 5 euro after all which is my loss, my problem and objection is that this is not fair gambling with these terms and conditions of some internetcasinos.
    Unless CR is part of a police dept:D
     
  18. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Since you mention Unibet;

    This is the Unibet term, and is no different to the one at Casino Rewards. Using your wife's bank account at Unibet is just as much a breach of the terms as it was at Casino Rewards. It seems more likely that Unibet haven't spotted it, whereas Casino Rewards have. You are at considerable risk of having a similar problem at these other casinos should you have a noteworthy win that leads to a more thorough audit.

    The thorough audit at Casino Rewards is probably because you won from the welcome offer, one that has been hit heavily by chancers and fraudsters, which has meant that CR do a stringent audit of ALL withdrawals from this bonus, which is how they spotted this discrepancy. These thorough audits usually only get done on a withdrawal, so the deposit managed to slip through. They may even have not spotted it had you won from a later deposit from your own account.

    It would be best to contact these other casinos at a time when you have no balance or pending withdrawals, and get it in writing that they are happy for you both to continue using this same arrangement.

    A better way would be to transfer money between yourselves through your bank, rather than through the online casino payment systems. Casinos would then see the deposits come from your bank in the same way a land casino sees €20 given to you by your wife before you enter the gaming area as coming from your own pocket in play.

    As for online casinos wanting to know how you earned your deposit, this has actually happened!!! Although not common, a few online casinos have asked for "proof of employment" or a statement of wealth. Their reasoning is that it helps them spot potential "problem gamblers" who might be getting in too deep.
     
    4 people like this.
  19. corrie1946

    corrie1946 Banned User - troll PITA

    Hi Jasmine Bed, you are talking nonsense now.
    A landbased cannot see where you have your 5 euro from, internetcasinos do. I mean who pays the deposit.
    If it it is not from the registrated person they can refuse the deposit immediately.
    But why should they, he.
    Unless you have to pay out withdrawals later..
    Today I have spoken a lot of persons about this matter, about internetcasinos, terms/conditions etc etc.

    To hell with losses and profits, gambling is your own responsability, I made the mistake to start playing at a internetcasino with unreasanable conditions. I only blame myselve and CR.
    But really there must come an end to this. With or without Casinomeisters help, and I really appreciate the opportunity from them to get published this item.
    I accept that gambling sites create a 50/40 percentage in their advantage, but I will not ever again accept sites like CR.
    Up to you readers to act otherwise. And if you do , take care abt bonus terms as well:lolup: Good luck.
     
  20. homerbert

    homerbert Meister Member webby MM

    i repeated, if her wife can confirm that she agreed with this transcation, HE SHOULD get winnings. Or casino should block immideatly all transactions like this. I understand, that casino its not so nice, like we all want, but let imagine, you and your wife come to shop, and buy some stuff, you just taking items, your wifes paid for this(you give her all your money, for example). But in the shop told that you are thief, and call police. Funny? Yes. I bellieve that for example 32red or 3dice will see that problem and pay, but CR wont pay, they dont care their reputation. If user fraud, just prove it, and we dont ask any questions! But there is fair play, why dont pay this 500 euro???? User will told his friends, will post on forums, that casino okay! Casino only win with this. I think that we, gamblers, should help another gamblers, and only if we will be together, we can help each other. Casino will fear, and dont cheat players.
    Just my opinion.
     

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