Card Spike

[winbig]

You should try not to let your personal friendship and financial ties blind you...
That goes out to both Dom and Win.

No comment. Too much drama for my blood.

*goes back to the sidelines, like everyone else should do unless they have pertinent Facts to let us know about.*

 

[lots0]

A lot of personal and financial relationships getting tangled here...

Damn I hate to lose friends, especially when it's over people like Lou and Warren.

 

[winbig]

A lot of personal and financial relationships getting tangled here...

Damn I hate to lose friends, especially when it's over people like Lou and Warren.

I have nothing against anyone...

Friendship or not, I know Dom very well, and trust me, she'll do what she can, and not let relationships - friends or money - stand in her way or cloud her judgement.

 

[mojo]

I think many of us are angry that we are ALL put in this awkward position in the first place. No matter who steps up. No offense intended Dom. We all know it was Lou and Warren who landed us here in the first place. What we really need first and foremost is:

1. CardSpike payments made
2. Full transparancy on the CardSpike/CAP relationship
3. Full transparancy on the Absolute Slots/Effective Media/Cap relationship
4. Disclosure on any other properties Effective Media and/or Cap have interest in.

Only then can Cap begin to rebuild. JMO

 

[dominique]

I need to clarify something here.

I am not part of affiliate media in any way.

I can't and have no desire to try to have any dealings with the business of affiliate media. I have never been part of it, have no idea what they are doing and don't consider it my business.

All I want to do is to keep CAP running effectively, CAP being a message board that sorts affiliate issues the same way Casinomeister sorts player issues.

CAP is just a message board, and I have moderated there as volunteer for years. There is only one change I would like to effect, and that is the way bannings are handled.

Seeing about card spike affiliates being paid is just part of normal business, it's what CAP does, see to it that affiliates are treated fairly.

Will I succeed? I don't know. Is it a tall order? Yes. Should I just turn the other cheek and not even try? Of course not.

Only time will tell what can be accomplished there.

IMO CAP has been very beneficial to affiliates as a whole, whether they are part of the community or not. Just as Meister benefits all players, whether they visit here or not.

Both boards are some sort of self regulation for an unregulated industry. Without the communities the casinos would be able to walk all over everyone.

I would hate to see something that has been beneficial for so many years get into trouble because someone made some bad decisions.

So my motivation and goals are really very simple. Not every player issue can be resolved, that's why casinos are rogued. The same goes for affiliate issues. If I can't solve the affiliate problems with card spike, they too will be rogued. Really, they are already rogue. I just want to see if a fresh approach can make a difference. If I can just one affiliate paid, it will be worth the effort. Let's hope I can do better than that.

 

[Nandakishore]

Dom, I wish you the best of luck.

 

[lots0]

If I can't solve the affiliate problems with card spike, they too will be rogued. Really, they are already rogue.

let me get this straight...

Your going to Rogue the owners of the forum that you volunteer at???

It has been shown beyond any doubt that Lou and Warren operate Card Spike. There is a very very good chance they own it...

And your going to Rogue them from a forum they own????

Sorry Dom, that just does not make any sense.

Sounds to me more like Lou and Warren want an honest face (Dom's) to run their forum so it and their other programs appears legit to casinos and other affiliates.

 

[mojo]

Didn't want this to get lost. I know London is going on but perhaps while in London someone asked about this?

Originally Posted by Ridge
Hello I am Randy and I was a long time member of PAP/CAP. I had the screen name Ridge on both those forums too before I was banned for speaking about about not getting paid. I was lucky enough to get a good start with Cardspike and even built to dedicated Cardspike sites and I have a very active forum with some high stakes grinders that I signed up there.

You guys know the story that follows, we never got paid, we started several thread to try and get a resolution and in the end we got banned for speaking out at PAP and CAP..

To date I have only been paid a small amount directly from Warren Jolly and I was told to keep quiet and I would get the rest. After a couple more months I realized I was never getting paid and started speaking with Lou and Warren to get paid.. They threatened me, cussed, me and finally banned me..

I have documentation of everything including PM's, Emails, IM's, and screenshots from Lou, Warren, Greg Powell (Former AM).

My stats were altered and my Cardspike affiliate account has since been locked/Closed - I am doing rakeback there so I still have players but cannot get paid, see stats or even log in.. I have emailed Cake Poker several times and they are not helping get my players, money, or my account unlocked.

I'm not sure if this is the proper place to post the screenshots of my affiliate account before my stats were altered, so I will wait until I hear something back..

This whole mess has really took a toll on me and I really want to put it behind me, but if there is a chance we can finally see our money and maybe Cake Poker will step up and kick CS off their network.


I will be more than happy to send an Admin here every bit of documentation I have on this issue..

 

[lots0]

So any new status on CAP's Lou and Warren's website CardSpike site cheating affiliates out of their money?

Or how about News on how many Casino programs walked away from CAP because they were being double dealt by CAP?

 

[Simmo!]

I am of the opinion that the fallout from this saga will rumble on for months. There seemed to be a general concensus from all sides that the public "assessments" have served their purpose in making the industry aware of the facts, but are now being used to pursue more personal agendas which can only damage the industry. Consequently, I suspect whatever actions/reactions there are will be communicated privately and with the minimum of public fuss.

That's just my opinion based on what I heard over the week.

 

[lots0]

Like I said in the other thread.

Money talks... Greed wins...

Why do I feel so dirty?
I guess it my close association to this online gambling business and all the really great and honorable people in it.


I love to quote myself.

This whole thing stinks...

The rotten core of a lot of things are showing in this episode...

And now I see the cover up coming (I hope I'm wrong).

Money is talkn, and the parities involved are currently joining together in silence and denial, no one wants to lose any money or business, especially these days. So the business will continue, with a new unspoken censorship in place...

P.S. Rob, one of CAPs dirty little tricks is to put pressure on the affiliate programs you promote to drop you or just ignore you or they just tell the programs your a 'bad' affiliate. They've done this to me...

BTW - Did everyone forget that this whole thing started because CAP was double dealing and playing dirty with the affiliates and the Casino programs???

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/my-cap-thoughts.29309/

 

[Pinababy69]

but are now being used to pursue more personal agendas which can only damage the industry. Consequently, I suspect whatever actions/reactions there are will be communicated privately and with the minimum of public fuss.

Communicated privately = greed wins out (surprise, surprise). All is forgiven and business as usual. Ethics? Morals? What are those? And the money train rolls on out of the station.

 

[jas2587]

I need to clarify something here.

I am not part of affiliate media in any way.

I can't and have no desire to try to have any dealings with the business of affiliate media. I have never been part of it, have no idea what they are doing and don't consider it my business.

All I want to do is to keep CAP running effectively, CAP being a message board that sorts affiliate issues the same way Casinomeister sorts player issues.

CAP is just a message board, and I have moderated there as volunteer for years. There is only one change I would like to effect, and that is the way bannings are handled.

Seeing about card spike affiliates being paid is just part of normal business, it's what CAP does, see to it that affiliates are treated fairly.

Will I succeed? I don't know. Is it a tall order? Yes. Should I just turn the other cheek and not even try? Of course not.

Only time will tell what can be accomplished there.

IMO CAP has been very beneficial to affiliates as a whole, whether they are part of the community or not. Just as Meister benefits all players, whether they visit here or not.

Both boards are some sort of self regulation for an unregulated industry. Without the communities the casinos would be able to walk all over everyone.

I would hate to see something that has been beneficial for so many years get into trouble because someone made some bad decisions.

So my motivation and goals are really very simple. Not every player issue can be resolved, that's why casinos are rogued. The same goes for affiliate issues. If I can't solve the affiliate problems with card spike, they too will be rogued. Really, they are already rogue. I just want to see if a fresh approach can make a difference. If I can just one affiliate paid, it will be worth the effort. Let's hope I can do better than that.

I need to understand something here: I am just a player
you say I have moderated there as volunteer for years at CAP
well when all the bannings was going on what did you think?
What did you say to Lou an them?
If you didn't think it was fair then how can or could you go back an try to help clear this up?
What makes you think that you can do what CAP should have done all along?



you say (((( Seeing about card spike affiliates being paid is just part of normal business, it's what CAP does, see to it that affiliates are treated fairly.)))

well CAP clearly failed here

Should I just turn the other cheek and not even try?
yes if you fail you will be tied to this CAP mess forever

If I can just one affiliate paid, it will be worth the effort. Let's hope I can do better than that.
They Cap can pay any affiliate an then your goal to get one paid will be done
just how many are there 25 50 75 100 an you will be Happy to get 1 paid?

Good Luck they will pay that 1 an that will be it an the whole mess will start all over again Lou showed that in London

Cindy

 

[rowmare]

I am of the opinion that the fallout from this saga will rumble on for months. There seemed to be a general concensus from all sides that the public "assessments" have served their purpose in making the industry aware of the facts, but are now being used to pursue more personal agendas which can only damage the industry. Consequently, I suspect whatever actions/reactions there are will be communicated privately and with the minimum of public fuss.

That's just my opinion based on what I heard over the week.

I'm sorry for the tone of my post, but I am a little perturbed by your post, Simmo.

I, for one, am tired of the 'personal agenda' battle call, designed to quiet anybody who dare make a noise when unethical behaviour is occuring in the online gambling industry. Funny how is it has always only been directed at people condeming Lou and CAP. Reason it has always been that way is because Lou and CAP have ALWAYS BEEN unethical. I beg of you to please not use that tactic of bullies again.

And no, thank you very much, I don't believe actions or reactions should be "communicated privately and with the minimum of fuss". What has happened has an effect on every memeber of this industry from affiliate managers and casino owners to affiliates and players. It is everybody's business and the bigger the fuss, the more likely such behaviour will NOT occur again.

 

[dominique]

I need to understand something here: I am just a player
you say I have moderated there as volunteer for years at CAP
well when all the bannings was going on what did you think?
What did you say to Lou an them?
If you didn't think it was fair then how can or could you go back an try to help clear this up?
What makes you think that you can do what CAP should have done all along?



you say (((( Seeing about card spike affiliates being paid is just part of normal business, it's what CAP does, see to it that affiliates are treated fairly.)))

well CAP clearly failed here

Should I just turn the other cheek and not even try?
yes if you fail you will be tied to this CAP mess forever

If I can just one affiliate paid, it will be worth the effort. Let's hope I can do better than that.
They Cap can pay any affiliate an then your goal to get one paid will be done
just how many are there 25 50 75 100 an you will be Happy to get 1 paid?

Good Luck they will pay that 1 an that will be it an the whole mess will start all over again Lou showed that in London

Cindy

The banning craze was at Pap, not CAP.I don't have anything to do with PAP and found out about them when you did, on other forums I do read. Many of the bannings at CAP I was not aware of either, also until I read about it elsewhere. People post sporadically, if someone doesn't post for a while you don't automatically suspect bans.

Mostly what I have done all these years is moved threads to the appropriate forums, people have a tendency to post under "general discussions" even if there is a forum that fits the topic exactly. I also step in when people attack each other personally, that's a no-no.

I have no admin access. I barely ever speak with Lou, mostly just at conferences we both attend. This was different years ago, but the last few years Lou was busy with other things.

Some bannings I did witness, some I consider justified, as per the discussion regarding Casinomeister above. A couple I did see happening I didn't think were necessary but - I was there to moderate threads only.

If I am left to make the messageboard decisions in the future, I will be prepared to defend my own decisions.

Re getting people paid - so far I have only been approached by one. Actually, I approached him after reading his posts. There are no hundreds of people. It appears almost everyone was paid already, and there is a dispute regarding this one unpaid affiliate. Normally CAP would have nothing to do with this anyway, it's a PAP matter, Cap deals with Casinos and PAP with poker. I am sticking my nose outside the box here.

I know, with all this posting going on you must be thinking of CAP as a business. Affiliate media is the business. CAP to me is a community of my buddies exactly like Casinomeister is to you. My friends deserve to keep their place to hang out, and I would like to accomplish that. And I would like to bring it back to where it was a year or so ago, before all this banning and stuff started to happen.

Since I have no financial ties of any sort, I will just quit if I run into a brick wall, or if it takes too much time away from tending to my own business.

Should I just turn the other cheek and not even try?
yes if you fail you will be tied to this CAP mess forever

Maybe so, but I will know for myself that I tried to do my best to make things right.

 

[lots0]

Dom if all you want is place for you and your buddies to hang out, why not start your own forum? It only takes a few minutes to set up and with your reputation you should be able to have a nice and very active forum with all your buddies in no time at all...

Why choose to continue to put yourself out in the front window of a tainted business like casinoaffiliateprograms.com?

casinoaffiliateprograms.com is a business that has been shown to have not paid affiliates and more important was fundamentally deceiving the entire online gambling community by pretending to be 'the' affiliate advocate when in fact they were lying to and preying on those same affiliates.

BTW - Dom who is it that owns pokeraffilaiteprograms.com (PAP)? Oh thats right, I remember now, it's Lou and Warren...

 

[dominique]

This is being suggested quite a bit, but frankly, I don't want to run an affiliate forum. I see my stepping in at CAP as temporary, to set some new guide lines.

If I did, it would have a different focus, a place for communication between players and affiliates, and that is already in the works elsewhere, besides Casinomeister does quite well with that aspect.

I really don't think this industry needs to be splintered any further, we should be looking at a cohesive community, in numbers lies strength. Existing forums need to cooperate and fix operator issues together, if all the existing forums were to cooperate on issues, rogues wouldn't stand a chance.

 

[RobWin]

I know, with all this posting going on you must be thinking of CAP as a business. Affiliate media is the business. CAP to me is a community of my buddies exactly like Casinomeister is to you. My friends deserve to keep their place to hang out, and I would like to accomplish that. And I would like to bring it back to where it was a year or so ago, before all this banning and stuff started to happen.

In all due respect Dom, do you mean you would like to bring CAP back to the point where Lou was allegedly selling player databases ??

 

[lots0]

I really don't think this industry needs to be splintered any further, we should be looking at a cohesive community, in numbers lies strength.

I don't know, there is also strength in diversity and new ideas.
I think there are too few, we need more, you know, spread the wealth around a little.

Existing forums need to cooperate and fix operator issues together, if all the existing forums were to cooperate on issues, rogues wouldn't stand a chance.

Hmmm... tell that to 888

Forums are very little defense for the average player against the onslaught of crooked casinos, crooked affiliates and crooked affiliate/player advocates. I think Bryan and Max would agree that most of their work is after the fact, trying to help players (and affiliates) after they already got screwed.

The ONLY way the ROGUES don't stand a chance is with strict government regulation... and with business like CAP & PAP out in the forefront, the law makers will find it far easier to justify outlawing the the entire industry than to try to regulate it.

 

[jas2587]

Dom I do Thank you for answering my questions
all tho I cannot for the life of me figure out why you would want to
align yourself with CAP specially after the fiasco in London

from my understanding you have a good reputation why ruin it now?

an IMO I think after London there wont be a Cap for very long

what was alleged to happen should seal their fate

but hey its your Rep

Good Luck think you are gonna need it

Cindy

(Why choose to continue to put yourself out in the front window of a tainted business like casinoaffiliateprograms.com?)

because she thinks she can work miracles an turn things around IMO dont think it will happen

 

[Simmo!]

Communicated privately = greed wins out (surprise, surprise). All is forgiven and business as usual. Ethics? Morals? What are those? And the money train rolls on out of the station.

I'm sorry for the tone of my post, but I am a little perturbed by your post, Simmo.

I don't mean to sound insulting, but I think you both need to re-read my post because it's clearly been mis-interpreted.

 

[Pinababy69]

I'm not insulted Mr. Muppet Man..not at all. I think maybe you misinterpreted my post, lol. I never took your post to imply that it was YOUR opinion you were offering...simply relaying what you had heard. The messenger, so to speak. I was simply commenting on the message, not the messenger. I think Row may have taken your post the wrong way.....thinking that you were telling everyone to "hush", lol.

We square?

 

[rowmare]

I definitely mis-interpreted your post, Simmo! Terribly sorry :thumbsup