Question Butlers Bingo problem confirming ID

Marc Renowden

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Location
Birmingham
Hi guys, first time poster.

I have been a member of Butlers Bingo for a few months now and recently had my first win, well a win worthy of withdrawing.

I am a member of other sites so I am used to the whole ID needed to support your account so I was prepared and sent along the following:

-Front and back of my bank card
-Driving licence front and back
-Printed statement from the bank (stamped and date by the cashier as I have paperless banking with Santander
-My Vodafone bill with my name and address on the top.

I received an email back from 'Astrid' at Butlers explaining that my documents were not valid authorisation as the statement from my bank needs to be one that is posted to me, even though I have an email from Butlers explaining that this is fine.

Because of this I have probably gone overboard with the documentation I have sent in however I find it very unsettling that this is the case.

Yesterday evening I sent in copies of:

-My driving licence
-My passport
-My bank card that is registered on the site
-Two credit cards in my name
-My work payslip
-My work ID
-A letter from BT from August 26th confirming the end of my BT package
-A letter from Sky from September asking for me to go back to them
-The original stamped and dated statement from my bank.

I have since received an email from 'Astrid' letting me know that these documents have been sent to the security team for authorisation but in the meantime I have contacted my bank who are now sending me out a full paper statement.

Do you think this is unreasonable on their part? as with other sites I have confirmed ID with my driving licence and bank card image or my phone bill.

Grateful for any help to put my mind at risk as this is for a payout of £6500.

Thank you all in advance,

Marc
 

Jono777

Meister Member
CAG
mm1
mm4
Joined
May 13, 2014
Location
Wolverhampton
Defo OTT in my opinion but possibly linked to the amount involved and maybe as a 'stalling' tactic hoping you may spend some of your win back whilst waiting for the verification process to be completed.

On a plus note although I've not played there in recent months I have used BB a lot over the years making several withdrawals along the way.

The highest been £1,100 which along with all the others was paid to my Visa debit card no problems at all.

On another note, IIRC I wasn't even asked for documents on my first few cash outs (although this maybe due to them being around the £200 mark/low amounts)

In summary you will get paid (as long as you broke no T&C's along the way but I think they'd of mentioned this by now so your ok)

Just a waiting game now, your docs and details are safe with these guys, just don't spend any of your pending cashout:thumbsup:
 

Marc Renowden

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Location
Birmingham
Defo OTT in my opinion but possibly linked to the amount involved and maybe as a 'stalling' tactic hoping you may spend some of your win back whilst waiting for the verification process to be completed.

On a plus note although I've not played there in recent months I have used BB a lot over the years making several withdrawals along the way.

The highest been £1,100 which along with all the others was paid to my Visa debit card no problems at all.

On another note, IIRC I wasn't even asked for documents on my first few cash outs (although this maybe due to them being around the £200 mark/low amounts)

In summary you will get paid (as long as you broke no T&C's along the way but I think they'd of mentioned this by now so your ok)

Just a waiting game now, your docs and details are safe with these guys, just don't spend any of your pending cashout:thumbsup:



Thank you so much for your reply Jon. That has made me feel a lot better about it all. I did think that was the case but stalling tactics make you wonder will you ever get your winnings. It was originally £7300 but I played through a few hundred and decided to stop there!

They have put the funds back into my account but now suspended my account whilst waiting for the approval of my documents so at least that means I cannot spend it! I didn't have any bonuses attributed to the account and I've deposited around £500 in the few months I've been playing so I can't see them having any issues myself.

Glad to hear that you didn't have problems yourself!
 

Marc Renowden

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Location
Birmingham
I have just received a reply from Butlers Bingo:


Hi Marc,

Thank you for your email and for submitting your documentation. On review of your recent withdrawal request, our payments team have identified a duplicate account marcxc1983 set up on Butlers Bingo on the 12th June 2015. This account was set us using an Identical email address to the one used to register your most recent account marcxc83 on the 2nd September however it has the same physical address.

The creation of this second account is strictly forbidden under the sites terms and conditions. When you signed up for both your original account and more recently your second duplicate account you acknowledged that you accept the Terms and Conditions of the site including the fact that you are limited to only one account. Please find below the terms and conditions relating
to the rules limiting players to one account:

5.1 By registering an account at Butlers Bingo, You:
5.1.1 Warrant that all information provided by You to Us is true and correct and acknowledge that, should it be discovered by Us that any information provided by You is false, We reserve the right to suspend Your account, including the payout of any cash-ins, until the true position with regard to Your identity is clarified;
5.1.2 Accept these Terms and Conditions as a binding agreement between Us and You.
5.2 Only one bingo account per player is allowed. If there is more than one account registered per household Butlers Bingo reserves the right to require you to provide our fraud department with the necessary documentation to verify that the individual accounts comply with the Terms and Conditions set out herein and
are therefore valid accounts.

17.1 You acknowledge that We may refuse to register You as a player or elect to de-register and exclude You as a player at any time and for any reason whatsoever, and that We are not obligated to give You prior notice of Our decision to refuse, de-register or exclude You nor to furnish You with any reasons for Our decision.
17.2 If We de-register, exclude or suspend You from Butlers Bingo, We shall have the right to:
17.2.1 Withhold payment to You of any contested funds if;
17.2.1.1 You have more than one active account for Butlers Bingo;

27.1 Butlers Bingo currently offers mobile gaming (Casino and Bingo) via a range of devices. Existing players may log in via mobile devices using their log in details, and new players may register directly on the mobile platform, but it is not permitted to hold multiple accounts on different devices.

Furthermore, by signing up for a second account you have also received a second first deposit bonus from the site and again as per our Terms and Conditions, this is not something that is permitted and is classed as bonus abuse.

20.3 We reserve the right to reclaim all bonuses awarded and any winnings accrued if You are found to be tampering with or abusing any aspect of our promotions.

Given all the information we have available management have taken the decision to permanently close your duplicate account with no option to have it reopened at any point in the future.

The Funds accumulated on this account will also be confiscated as per our Terms and Conditions. While we are not obligated to returned any deposits made to your new account Management have agreed as a gesture that you will receive a full refund of monies deposits in the amount of 820.

14.12 Butlers Bingo management may, in their sole discretion, withhold or delay any payment to you should it be discovered that:
14.12.1 You have provided Us with false or misleading information;
14.12.2 You are found to have violated any policy rule.

These rules will apply to all players signing up for an account with us; no exceptions are made.

Kind regards,

Butlers Bingo Support




My issue is that I cannot remember having an account with them last year, I'm sure if I did I self excluded myself but the fact that the site let me register last month and has taken deposits from me from the same bank account etc shows a big lack of professionalism on their part. I honestly don't know where to go from here.
 

colinsunderland

Experienced Member
webmeister
MM
Joined
Jan 28, 2016
Location
uk
Someone will be along soon who knows more than me, but I don't think you will get paid.

However, accepting a second registration using the same name, address, email address, presumably date of birth and card details is pathetic, as is accepting £820 in deposits, one must wonder if you had lost it would you have still got the email? I would say no as the fact your new account was opened on 2nd Sept and its now 5 weeks later would suggest they are quite happy to take money from you then only close the account if you win. It takes minutes to write a bit of code to check the email address against the database, so theres no excuse whatsoever for taking 5 weeks to find out it is a duplicate account and while you broke the terms, they haven't exactly done anything to make them look good.
 

Jono777

Meister Member
CAG
mm1
mm4
Joined
May 13, 2014
Location
Wolverhampton
Sorry - I'll apologise in advance as I feel this reply is not the one you want to hear :(

Whether you can remember the first account or self exclusion or not, I think they are correct on this one, they even provided the earlier username.

If it was a self-exclusion issue they there is no good will involved they HAVE to refund deposits made as per the UKGC rules and guidelines.

Its a really crappy situation if indeed you didn't knowingly create a duplicate account but if there is any doubt I'd happily settle for the £820 refund.

If you are 100% and I mean 100% confident that you only ever created the one account (one you won the £6,500 on) then I'd message their rep on here (although I've gone thru whole page and can't see them :confused:)

Failing that I'd maybe attempt a PAB but as I say only if your are mega confident you have done no wrong at any point.

http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/faq.php?faq=cmfaq_pab
 

Marc Renowden

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Location
Birmingham
Sorry - I'll apologise in advance as I feel this reply is not the one you want to hear :(

Whether you can remember the first account or self exclusion or not, I think they are correct on this one, they even provided the earlier username.

If it was a self-exclusion issue they there is no good will involved they HAVE to refund deposits made as per the UKGC rules and guidelines.

Its a really crappy situation if indeed you didn't knowingly create a duplicate account but if there is any doubt I'd happily settle for the £820 refund.

If you are 100% and I mean 100% confident that you only ever created the one account (one you won the £6,500 on) then I'd message their rep on here (although I've gone thru whole page and can't see them :confused:)

Failing that I'd maybe attempt a PAB but as I say only if your are mega confident you have done no wrong at any point.

http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/faq.php?faq=cmfaq_pab


Thank you Jon. This is what I thought, if I had created another account after self excluding surely it should have flagged up that my email address or payment card was already registered with them and I couldn't have signed up in the first place. I'm unsure as I know they trade under the Broadway umbrella so it might be that I signed up to one of their sister sites? Like you say it's probably best to just accept the £820 as at least I've not lost anything in actual money.

I really believe that you should have to log ID as part of the signing up procedure, it takes away any reasonable doubt then doesn't it. After all they have had 3 emails from me with ID verification and numerous emails including on the live chat, why wasn't it flagged up then? When I sent my first ID in, my driving licence and bank card surely then they would've seen if there was a duplicate account especially as I am emailing from that email address too. But they said they needed more ID off me which I have provided and only then did they say I was in breach of Ts and Cs.

It all does seem a bit fishy
 

colinsunderland

Experienced Member
webmeister
MM
Joined
Jan 28, 2016
Location
uk
you might like to ask them where the policy rule's are that you breached, as I can't find any mention of them on the site, except in the terms and conditions.
 

Marc Renowden

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Location
Birmingham
you might like to ask them where the policy rule's are that you breached, as I can't find any mention of them on the site, except in the terms and conditions.
Hi Colin,

I agree with you. Surely it would've flagged me up as having an account with them already under that email or with that bank account when I signed up in September? It makes no sense. It really does feel like they're doing everything in their power to not pay out. I've contacted the Gambling Commision to ask for advice so fingers crossed but I'm not holding my breath :(
 

Marc Renowden

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Location
Birmingham
Just a thought...

Just a thought to add to this, if they're saying I had a secondary account with them but this was not flagged up at the time of me signing up in September, surely my 'old' account will have been closed, therefore I don't actually have a duplicate account as only one exists, the one I have now.
 

Harry_BKK

Meister Member
CAG
mm1
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Location
Balcony
Sorry Marc, but I am not buying your story to 100%.

Are you opening so many casino accounts that you can't remember that you had one with Butler's Bingo? You even seem to use a system on how to have consecutive accounts by using the same username but just with a slightly different end. :confused:

No casino has to do the KYC procedure until the total withdrawals exceed €/£/$ 2,300. Hence BB has done nothing wrong, they just acted according to the rules. Certainly doesn't look very professional and i do not condone this "wait until the player wins and withdraws" policy but those are the rules set out by the UKGC and other regulatory bodies.

But you seem to be a seasoned gambler, hence you should know these things.

You opened a duplicate account (the onus to avoid this is on YOU), claimed the SUB twice (the onus to avoid this is again on YOU), and still would like to have the winnings. Be happy, very happy that they returned your deposits. :rolleyes:
 

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