Brexit - whats the difference.....

[mack341]

Clear Brexit feeling tonight as the UK got 0 points on the Eurovision Song Contest ?

that many! didn't watch it but maybe we can now face up to reality & give up entering

 

[Kroffe]

They should have followed the guide.

 

[mcgameboy]

Fair enough, I appreciate Brexit and Reality need to be kept a safe distance from each other

I think the same about me and my ability to read every time I visit this thread.....

 

[dunover]

Clear Brexit feeling tonight as the UK got 0 points on the Eurovision Song Contest ?

They got zero points simply because, as with every year, the UK entry was fucking shite. A static dog turd on stage with a backing track played over it would have got more points. Considering the musical pedigree of the UK, second to none, isn't the fact they even enter it a bit like Man. City entering a pub football tournament?

 

[dpp00]

in fairness wasn't as bad as our irish entry that didnt even qualify

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Short memories over at The Express.

Anyway, it's just Spain taking back control.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

How it started.



How it's going.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

And here's today's......

'Brexit red tape' being, of course, the natural result of choosing to leave the Customs Union and EU Single Market.

It's understandable that the Brexity Torygraph is pitching this as 'The EU doing this to us' when of course, we did it to ourselves.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

David Frost must be really upset with whoever negotiated that agreement and hailed it as a great success for the UK.

This has always been one of Brexit's biggest problems, the 'flavour' of Brexit that Theresa May decided we must have (hard Brexit, out of the Customs Union and Single Market) meant there was going to have to be a border somewhere.

The only variable was where it was going to end up, and wherever it ended up, it was going to cause a shitload of problems.

Everything else was hot air and lies.

 

[mack341]

In order to fix a problem you've got to recognise/acknowledge it, all 'paperwork' demands are capable of being improved, simplified etc... or the uk govt could provide subsidies and incentives, some of that 10 billion net fee we saved can be used to help.

Meanwhile i believe more trade deals have been made, norway was one.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Meanwhile i believe more trade deals have been made, norway was one.

Yes, the deal that's worse than the one we previously had as an EU member.

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Norway’s minister of agriculture and food, Olaug Bollestad, said it had been vital for the centre-right coalition government to protect its small but politically important agriculture sector from the threat of cheaper British beef and cheese.

She added that her Christian Democrat party had not wanted to reward the UK with better access to Norway than it enjoyed as an EU member state.

-------------------

David Henig, a former UK government trade official who is now director of the UK Trade Policy Project, said: “This UK-EEA free trade agreement provides better trading conditions than World Trade Organization terms, though with considerably more trade barriers when compared with the previous single market relationship."

“There are some useful provisions for UK business such as on professional qualifications or digital trade, but there will also be many difficulties as we see with the similar UK-EU trade and cooperation agreement. Overall this is quite a standard free trade agreement, with limited economic value.”

 

[mack341]

It's sensible for norway to protect it's farmers, and trade deals between individual countries are obviously easier to agree, fairer whereas the eu will demand a lot more conformity and regulations in return for access, things that add costs, and can favour the multinationals who spend millions lobbying the 'democratic deficient' EU.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

It's sensible for norway to protect it's farmers, and trade deals between individual countries are obviously easier to agree, fairer whereas the eu will demand a lot more conformity and regulations in return for access, things that add costs, and can favour the multinationals who spend millions lobbying the 'democratic deficient' EU.

That's great mack, but where's the stuff that Brexit was supposed to make better?

The current count is 178 downsides, 12 upsides.

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[mack341]

what's better than having a nice brexit chat of a sunday evening, if I get the time I will check out these 'negs' - save to say we're not in normal times so comparisons with previous years is not straightforward. If it comes down to the EU trying to make life difficult, a punishment tactic to deter others, then that simply reinforces my belief the eu is a force for bad and toxic.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Another piece of comical revisionism from The Torygraph.

This is increasingly becoming the narrative now, that the awful Deal was 'forced' upon the UK by a 'bullying' EU and that's why it's a load of shit, and why the UK is well within its rights to break international law in unilaterally breaching it.

Note how it's become the EU's Brexit Treaty, like we didn't actually negotiate it and sign it voluntarily.....

SIX MONTHS AGO we were told this was a fantastic deal for Britain and it got forced through the Commons in record time.

BEFORE:



AFTER:

 

[mack341]

I read yesterday's telegraph comment piece, their view was the problem started with Theresa's plan for a NI protocol, the EU seized upon it and boris wasn't able to negotiate much of an alternative, as the EU insisted it would be no deal otherwise. But for the EU to say it was about protecting the good friday agreement was laughable as it ignored the unionist side/interests. In the end I predict the EU will have to be more flexible re products from britain to northern Ireland.

There was also another article from a former irish diplomat that ireland may wish to exit the EU at some point, the new tax laws for big international corporations are going to have an effect on their economy, and they've lost some of their fishing grounds/catch percentages to the french and dutch to make up for their loss in uk waters. Plus their membership fees have gone up.

 

[pinnit2014]

I read yesterday's telegraph comment piece, their view was the problem started with Theresa's plan for a NI protocol, the EU seized upon it and boris wasn't able to negotiate much of an alternative, as the EU insisted it would be no deal otherwise. But for the EU to say it was about protecting the good friday agreement was laughable as it ignored the unionist side/interests. In the end I predict the EU will have to be more flexible re products from britain to northern Ireland.

There was also another article from a former irish diplomat that ireland may wish to exit the EU at some point, the new tax laws for big international corporations are going to have an effect on their economy, and they've lost some of their fishing grounds/catch percentages to the french and dutch to make up for their loss in uk waters. Plus their membership fees have gone up.

Might all be moot anyway in years to come with the SF bandwagon continuing to gather pace down south

In terms of selling it to the people, they'll just do what they did with the Lisbon Treaty: we'll referendum you until you say yes (which, incidentally is exactly the SNP's view on their own one)

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Nice to see Johnson actually get asked a tough (albeit entirely fair) question about the Northern Ireland Protocol.

The answer of course, it bluster and flannel.

A year ago you said there'd be a border him the Irish Sea - and I quote you "over my dead body" - and here we both are, there is a border in the Irish Sea. Were you lying when you said no border or did you not understand the treaty you signed over Brexit?

 

[mack341]

That's a bit of 'gotcha' or playing to the remainer media gallery type question, he's hardly going to say 'yes i was lying on that issue', she needs to ask less leading questions, from the answers provided the public can then judge the rights and wrongs.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Well the thing is mack only one of those two options can be true, either Johnson deliberately lied, or he didn't understand the Brexit treaty he'd signed, there is no other explanation.

It's not new, this graphic was doing the rounds in 2018, people who understood the issue understood the choices and what they meant.

Johnson either didn't understand, or he lied about it.

 

[mack341]

Who looks the bad guy if there are food shortages due to 'rules must be obeyed' ?

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Who looks the bad guy if there are food shortages due to 'rules must be obeyed' ?

Hmmm, I dunno, how about the person who negotiated, signed, implemented and enshrined into law the treaty that had the potential to lead to food shortages?

None of what's happening now is a surprise, it's all a direct result of Johnson's 'oven ready' Brexit deal being implemented.

 

[dunover]

I have noticed there has been no Haywards Strong pickled onions for months now. Silverskin, spicy, standard but no Strong ones.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

I have noticed there has been no Haywards Strong pickled onions for months now. Silverskin, spicy, standard but no Strong ones.

You need to have sinister shadowy underworld connections to get those sorts of pickled onions now. Yet another Brexit calamity.

A single jar can fetch up to fifty pounds, bloke round here called Dodgy Dave sells them out of the back of his Ford Transit, along with heroin and guns.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Onions aside, this is when Johnson was told by (the rather lovely) Sophy Ridge what his deal would entail when it came to NI checks and he was literally just like, 'No that's wrong we won't be having any checks'.