Brexit - whats the difference.....

[geordiecolin]

This is why I voted to leave

 

[ChopleyIOM]

A bunch of tired old discredited tropes, spouted by the usual motley collection of talking heads.

Gotcha.

Daniel Hannan, for god's sake. The man who pretended he was going on a patriotic walk through the countryside and used stock photographs to illustrate his imaginary ramble with.

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[dunover]

This is why I voted to leave

The kleptocracy couldn't get remain hidden forever. The corrupt gravy train has been derailed.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Well not really, the EU will get on fine without is, we've just converted what was our UK mainline 'EU train station' into a little Englander branch line that doesn't go anywhere.

Fortunately there are more BREXIT DIVIDENDS incoming.

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The Road Haulage Association, the trade body representing road transport and freight logistics operators, told the Standard on Friday the “real extent of the impact this red tape is having on industry and businesses” will only start to be felt in the coming weeks.

Traffic through the port of Dover is currently down 85% from its 2019 average.

RHA spokesperson Paul Mummery said: “We are not trying to be doom-mongers, but this is just the tip of the iceberg.
“The volumes for import export are at the lowest point in the year anyway, and it is probably even quieter than usual, because the feedback we are getting from the industry is that firms were stockpiling before the Brexit deadline.

“When volumes of freight movement get back to normal levels, and they are set to start rising from next week, we will start seeing the real extent of the impact this red tape is having on industry and businesses.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

EU/UK trade is starting to fall apart, many EU purchasers of UK goods are going elsewhere, and there many eager companies in other EU countries more than happy to take the business from us.

Many UK companies are finding it intolerably difficult to trade with the EU.

And this is going to get worse.





One example of what selling fish to the EU now looks like, as we are FREE OF THE RED TAPE OF BRUSSELS.

 

[Slottery]

Wasn't that fishing thing near to 0% of UK GDP and still it's almost daily used hear as an example about the catastrophic situation? Wouldn't yet find it either end of the world if many haven't get along with new procedures in less than two weeks time since they came in place, obviously it looks with these examples that planning and forecasting changes has been really poor in many companies (only can say about ones posted to this thread who have totally fcked up their businesses, there was quite many years to prepare and now everything comes as surprise...).

Maybe they get better within next few years if they didn't do anything to prepare this since Brexit won referendum, if people who run these businesses do it by slogans in busses and tv shows, god bless them in competition in real-world...

 

[ChopleyIOM]

They didn't have years to prepare though Slottery, the deal was only finalised right at the end of December. Some things were known and could be prepared for, but fundamentally the whole thing was up in the air until the end of last month.

Yes the referendum was back in 2016, but the actual Brexit we ended up getting wasn't known until six days before it actually happened.

Many businesses were simply trying to survive 2020 as it is with Covid, they simply had no spare capacity or resource to prepare for an unknown Brexit as well.

Also remember the lies of the Brexit campaign itself.

 

[Slottery]

Would just have thought that many would have prepared themselves for many possible different scenarios which could be possible to happen, from no deal to everything stays same and everything from the middle.

edit: of course there are challenges and things are worse for many but believe that most can sort their problems somehow and stay alive.

 

[dunover]

Did my first big shop since December 21st. The shelves were bare, everything was stuck on lorries, no fresh veg, no meat. Then I woke up at home with a full shop, everything I normally buy was there. It seems some stuff has been getting through Dover after all.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Stuff will be getting in reasonably unimpeded, not least because we've basically decided to just wave everything through for six months. NI is in a much stickier situation as they're still inside the single market and a lot of stuff is now getting stopped, and there are shortages of some products on the shelves.

Just because you can still buy everything you want from Tesco doesn't mean that UK businesses aren't suffering horrendous strife, added cost, paperwork and red-tape in dealing with the EU, with many of them now facing ruination.

 

[geordiecolin]

Here is a bit of a paradox for remainers who are also fully paid up supporters of the covid measures.
The EU have been so frozen by delays,in fighting,red tape and selfishness among its member states that the UK has thousands more French living in London alone than have had the vaccine in France.
Still,we could always send the EU Cod Liver Oil capsules to tide them over?

Edit. I was going to use the word Oxymoron but I knew where using that would lead too

 

[geordiecolin]

This is why I voted to leave

Censorship is getting tiring now and it will only get worse

 

[interlog]

Many businesses were simply trying to survive 2020 as it is with Covid, they simply had no spare capacity or resource to prepare for an unknown Brexit as well.

What the heck has Covid to do with not having the resource? Or can this preparing not get done by working from home?

 

[bamberfishcake]

This is all speculation and worry at the moment.

Dover is always busy and the queues are the effects of Covid restrictions i would assume.

The Rules Of Origin look like a change for some businesses but not all. They also encourage our own exports - what you need for a push on GDP.

Too early to see any real effects yet isnt it? Apart from the fisherman moaning but both sides have always felt hard done by and been passionate.

 

[irish-ranger]

Stuff will be getting in reasonably unimpeded, not least because we've basically decided to just wave everything through for six months. NI is in a much stickier situation as they're still inside the single market and a lot of stuff is now getting stopped, and there are shortages of some products on the shelves.

Just because you can still buy everything you want from Tesco doesn't mean that UK businesses aren't suffering horrendous strife, added cost, paperwork and red-tape in dealing with the EU, with many of them now facing ruination.

Is NI in a stickier situation? funny that because I was in tescos in Newtownards today and there was no empty shelfs loads of fruit/veg etc.

 

[pinnit2014]

Is NI in a stickier situation? funny that because I was in tescos in Newtownards today and there was no empty shelfs loads of fruit/veg etc.

NI can screw itself over on its own, so wouldn't worry: a few flegs and a heating scheme normally seal the deal.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Not really a Brexit thing but GB has always been the outsider when ordering online. Postage would be somewhere between €10 and €20 while ordering from the Netherlands, France or Germany is usually free or something like €3. Kinda been shooting themselves in the foot like that for years

 

[Playford7]

Just a short one,

as you know I voted brexit etc..

anyhow the past few months it’s astonishing how many sites, new builds etc ive been on that have been solely funded by the EU, I’m talking almost all of them..

just hoping now we left there is something in place to replace what we lost regards the above.

many projects I’m now managing are massive, one will be the biggest high rise in manchester, guess whom paid and funded it? The EU and it’s projects..

this is paid for and signed off so no issues, but what about future projects?

as a massive advocate of brexit I’m happy to say work wise I may of shot myself in the foot.

 

[dunover]

Just a short one,

as you know I voted brexit etc..

anyhow the past few months it’s astonishing how many sites, new builds etc ive been on that have been solely funded by the EU, I’m talking almost all of them..

just hoping now we left there is something in place to replace what we lost regards the above.

many projects I’m now managing are massive, one will be the biggest high rise in manchester, guess whom paid and funded it? The EU and it’s projects..

this is paid for and signed off so no issues, but what about future projects?

as a massive advocate of brexit I’m happy to say work wise I may of shot myself in the foot.

No, the EU did NOT fund it, the UK taxpayer did, by paying £10bn into the E-USSR, of which they grudgingly gave us about half back in 'grants' where they saw fit as to how the UK taxpayers should spend their own money.

 

[Playford7]

No, the EU did NOT fund it, the UK taxpayer did, by paying £10bn into the E-USSR, of which they grudgingly gave us about half back in 'grants' where they saw fit as to how the UK taxpayers should spend their own money.

Fair point.

only going on when I get said projects, I get the budgeting etc from the start..

also what we have whilst said project is ongoing.

I’ve now enough work on paper to see me into retirement (in theory)

but it’s after these projects, they are officially EU funded, I’ve seen it.

where will the other funding come from?

 

[dunover]

Fair point.

only going on when I get said projects, I get the budgeting etc from the start..

also what we have whilst said project is ongoing.

I’ve now enough work on paper to see me into retirement (in theory)

but it’s after these projects, they are officially EU funded, I’ve seen it.

where will the other funding come from?

UK funded, via the EU.

The UK now decides where those regional grants (which is what you have there, regeneration etc.) go. Some they may retain, some will be changed and some new ones could replace the ones the 'EU paid for' that have been halted. Who knows? This is where your local government comes in, i.e. a bit of democracy is thrown into the mix which was an anathema to the old EU.

 

[Playford7]

UK funded, via the EU.

The UK now decides where those regional grants (which is what you have there, regeneration etc.) go. Some they may retain, some will be changed and some new ones could replace the ones the 'EU paid for' that have been halted. Who knows? This is where your local government comes in, i.e. a bit of democracy is thrown into the mix which was an anathema to the old EU.

Yeah get that,

just a tad daunting when your faced with where it comes from exactly to where is it going to come from.

hope we thrive I really do, in fairness since I re trained my sector has never been as busy, infact it’s booming and they are throwing money at us..

but this is on projects and contracts already paid for and signed off with most things in place, that said we had zero issues for goods on any site thus far regarding delivery from europe.

maybe over anxious.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

No, the EU did NOT fund it, the UK taxpayer did, by paying £10bn into the E-USSR, of which they grudgingly gave us about half back in 'grants' where they saw fit as to how the UK taxpayers should spend their own money.

As reductive and disingenuous an outlook as ever there dunover

A lot of these builds were done through EU regeneration funds and other socially aware projects designed to spend money on neglected areas of the country, and indeed in many cases directed funds into projects that would never have been funded directly by the UK government.

We can argue the numbers endlessly and never agree, but several studies have shown that the economic damage caused by Brexit has already outstripped all our contributions to the EU over the entire course of our membership.

As for Ben's question about what will replace the spend of these EU projects, that in many cases have regenerated parts of the UK that were crying out for the investment, the Tories are notoriously bad at spending money on areas that don't vote for them (which also tend to be poorer areas), so I expect vast swathes of the North and other left-leaning regions will just get fucked again.

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[Playford7]

As reductive and disingenuous an outlook as ever there dunover

A lot of these builds were done through EU regeneration funds and other socially aware projects designed to spend money on neglected areas of the country, and indeed in many cases directed funds into projects that would never have been funded directly by the UK government.

We can argue the numbers endlessly and never agree, but several studies have shown that the economic damage caused by Brexit has already outstripped all our contributions to the EU over the entire course of our membership.

As for Ben's question about what will replace the spend of these EU projects, that in many cases have regenerated parts of the UK that were crying out for the investment, the Tories are notoriously bad at spending money on areas that don't vote for them (which also tend to be poorer areas), so I expect vast swathes of the North and other left-leaning regions will just get fucked again.

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View attachment 148885

In fairness chop, a lot of the new builds I’m on are actually social housing.

hence my concern about funding.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

In fairness chop, a lot of the new builds I’m on are actually social housing.

hence my concern about funding.

Yes, the EU regeneration funds were disbursed very heavily towards projects of that nature, stuff that isn't very 'glamorous' and is often neglected, but has a great societal value, and is generally targeted at poorer areas and/or stuff like social housing.

It is not clear at all that they will be replaced by the UK government, hence reports such as this.

So yes, technically we do regain 'control' of the spend, but you're then relying on the kind and generous nature of a bunch of multi-millionaire Tories to, for example, help out poor people with social housing.