Bitstarz Removes 3.45 Btc Balance According to Breaking Bonus Terms

You tend to find that there is a difference in terms as usually 30% of bonus limited stake applies to low multiple return games such as roulette or BJ etc. whereas slots have a 5-unit limit or 6.25 due to their potential to pay several thousand x stake from one game.
 
I will add one disturbing term I found in the bonus terms once I managed to navigate a few pages of the site to get to is this :

Players who are solely making deposits when there is a bonus available will risk of having their winnings from the bonus confiscated and being left with the initial deposited amount of the bonus in question. Players who make 5 deposits in a row (excluding welcome package) to the casino and trigger a bonus on all of those will risk of losing their winnings from the bonus.

At least a single genuine deposit without bonus release has to be made prior to reaching 5 bonus releasing deposits in a row. The amount of the deposit has to be at least the average amount of the previous deposits made that triggered a bonus.

Decision if to confiscate funds will be made by the BitStarz Management and the decision made will be final.



As far as I'm aware from previously playing on Bitstarz is that all of their bonuses that they offer are automatic meaning that if you don't want a bonus on that deposit you have to specifically checkmark you do not want to receive bonuses. Weekly if not more I'm always receiving an email to go ahead and click on the link to take me to their deposit page and enjoy a 50% bonus. An unaware gambler that hasn't read this term may deposit weekly using the 50% and lose on the previous four and on the fifth deposit manage to enjoy some luck go ahead and make a nice cashout only for Bitstarz to deny their winnings based on term 2a of the general bonus terms and conditions. Wow. Given this term I do not think as highly of bitstarz as I previously had and think I will just unsubscribe from further promo emails from this company.

This is even nastier as it uses social engineering to entrap players. Not only do they have 2 differing sets of terms, one much harder to find than the other, they have an automatic system that puts players into the position of involuntarily violating the harder to find set of terms, and even where the player knows the rules, the automatic system still drops them into the trap and makes them climb out before they can just get on and play.

If a 30% rule NEVER applies, and it's always 10%, why is a 30% rule even mentioned at all, let alone in the wrong place.

The whole thing is a deception aimed at players who take bonuses, and it's no real mitigation that players who don't take bonuses end up getting very good treatment. A new player is meant to find the terms I found, but not the far stricter terms that actually apply. These they probably find out about after the fact, when their winnings get confiscated because they broke an unpublished term, even though they had found, read, and understood what is already a dozen pages of terms and conditions.

This isn't something that will affect a UK player who has read these terms as one is that players from the US and the UK cannot play for real money nor Bitcoin. It's rather odd because it's not illegal for a UK citizen to play at Bitstarz, but it is illegal for Bitstarz to offer it's service to the UK, however it's just as illegal for Bitstarz to offer it's services in many other countries, but they do nevertheless in the knowledge that it's going to be almost impossible for these countries to do anything about it, especially with the Bitcoin side.

They should just be honest and promote themselves as a no-bonus casino, rather than use bonuses as a lure, but have to set all these traps because otherwise the offers would cost them too much money. Being a Bitcoin casino in itself is a new(ish) concept, and SHOULD bring in many players who cannot play in regular casinos due to their nannying governments, unfortunately they seem to have embraced Bitcoin, yet voluntarily placed themselves into the regulatory straight jacket that applies to fiat currency casinos. If they embraced the full spirit in which the Bitcoin community operate, they would throw away all the artificial constraints down to national borders, and accept ALL players who had a valid Bitcoin account. After all, the very nature of Bitcoin prevents things like card fraud due to chargebacks, because once Bitcoin is transferred, there is no way to recall it, and neither can a third party wade in and confiscate the transaction or the float, such as the FBI or DoJ. The Bitcoin casino would only have to obey the laws of it's host country, and there would be nothing the US, or the UK for that matter, could do about it so long as all transactions were in Bitcoin, and the casino didn't try paying players with fiat currency via the regular banking systems.

Bitstarz should alter it's terms so that they are much clearer, and also redesign it's systems such that players are steered into compliance, and have to work hard to get things like a 6th consecutive bonus. Players may complain that the bonus they had expected on their 6th deposit didn't turn up, but this is better than having to confiscate the win after the fact. CS could simply tell the player that the system didn't credit the bonus because they had already had 5 in a row, and that if they were to deposit again, the bonus they were expecting would be credited, along with a maximum of 4 more on the trot until once again the system would hold back due to the 5 in a row rule.

I don't find it at all common for casinos to have different max bets for different games, what is common is for slots to count 100%, but non slots to count far less, even 0%. The max bet is set site wide, but varies considerably from one casino to another. Some are indeed as low as 10%, and a few even lower, but it's 10% across the board, not 10% in one set of terms and 30% in another.
 
Sounds like an excellent idea! If Casinomeister were to adopt that, it would provide motivation for casinos to get rid of ambiguous terms.


As a footnote; Bitstarz has a "spirit of the bonus" term. Under "Advantage Play" they provide examples but they don't offer anything concrete, as if to say advantage play is whatever they say it is. But, it's irrelevant because they are not accredited.

CM already applies something similar, and does not recognise "spirit of the bonus" as a valid reason for confiscating anything. However, CM has no way of enforcing this if a casino decides to ignore this and apply "spirit of the bonus", other than put some pressure on the casino, as he did when Betfair tried a mass confiscation of it's "Happy hour" winners, but Betfair just shrugged it off and carried on.

Players are largely at the mercy of the licencing jurisdiction, as the UK is somewhat unique in being a licencing jurisdiction that allows it's own citizens to play at the casinos it licenses. The UK system also means that UK players can use UK law in any dispute they have, rather than having to hire a lawyer in some offshore jurisdiction that may well have little in the way of consumer protection law that can be used to fight the casino's decision.

Bitstarz actually started this mess by issuing a free chip in the first place. If they didn't like how the OP played, they shouldn't have offered the free chip, and none of this would have happened. This does lead to a thought that they treat losing players differently to winners, and that they are happy to overlook bets of 20% or 25% of bonus when a player is losing and depositing again and again, but quick to jump on a harsher interpretation of the rules when a player's luck changes and they start winning. Surely a long standing player would have been caught out before by such a large discrepancy between a 30% and a 10% max bet, and may have made the mistake of relying on the 30% term before, and thus would have violated this rule far more often than the 50 bets mentioned.
 
Hi again

First of all, i feel really upset about shit-canned PAB. I know that's my fault. I acted as impatient while i put a PAB i opened a discussion topic. Even I've read FAQ, i didn't understand fully, as English is not my main language while you can see on my posts. After Max suggested that i should read again FAQ, i realize that i shouldn't open a topic while i submitted a PAB. I tried to find a "remove topic" button. However that was impossible or i couldn't find. At that moment i posted a new reply on this topic, and my PAB went to shit-canned. I know this is my fault but i have nowhere to go on this issue. I live in Turkey and noone will take care with my topic. I feel unjustified on this topic. Even i respect your decision, i am ready to do anything to have my PAB processed again; if anything else is possible.

Apart from PAB, this is a "loyalty bonus". This casino gave me this bonus for i lost the 2.54 btc amount. A highroller can be said for me. Neither I know that rule at the moment, nor casino told or send me the terms. Moreover, i won most of my chips with under 25 mbtc bet. Then support representative Mike, canceled my withdrawal immediatly regarding bonus terms. While i checked bonus terms, as you can see, they have 2 different bonus rule on their site. According to one rule, i am fully right because i didn't bet over %30 of the bonus amount.

I do not know what to do. I feel alone in this problem while gambling is banned in Turkey. I have nowhere to go to solve or to get help on this issue. Then my PAB is also shit-canned. Casino removed my balance. Casino manager - Nick - has not made a announcement on this subject. Only Mike posted while he was the person that remove my balance.

If i need to do anything else to get my PAB canned, i am ready.
 
... i realize that i shouldn't open a topic while i submitted a PAB. I tried to find a "remove topic" button. ...

That's not what the PAB says. What it does say is:
We reserve the right to discard any PAB that where that same issue has been posted to the boards. ... In the case where the material was posted after the PAB was filed there is a very high probability that we will suspend or discard the PAB at that point.

At that is precisely the problem: I asked you to read and respect the FAQ __after__ you had originally posted and you said (in PM) "haven't read your FAQ" and continued posting. :axeman:

We didn't write the PAB rules because we had nothing better to do. They're there because PABs cost us time and money to do and as such we are perfectly entitled to spell out the conditions under which we will offer, and continue to offer, that service. You ignored our guidance to read and respect the FAQ -- both in the pre-amble to actually posting your PAB and here in the thread -- and as such we withdraw our offer to assist you.

And "it's not my language" is no excuse: aside from the fact that you've already admitted you didn't read the FAQ -- it doesn't matter what language it's written in if you don't bother to look at it -- we make it perfectly clear that if you can't read and understand the FAQ that you should get an English speaker to assist you AND that if you need help finding someone to assist you we can probably help with that too.

Moaning about this after the fact is, again, totally missing the point: our preconditions for the PAB service are clear and readily available and you couldn't be bothered. So be it, but don't expect us to feel bad for you now that you've finally realized that it probably would have been wise to have followed those basic instructions from the beginning.
 
There are several reasons why we can't deal with your PAB.

Besides ignoring our instructions that during the PAB process you were to refrain from posting, this was also your second PAB and we have strict rules on PABs. One free shot which means we will accept PABs for any casino, but if you have another formal complaint - it must be against a casino listed in our accredited section. Bitstarz is not an accredited casino.

Since this was your second PAB, not knowing the PAB rules is not an excuse.

Besides, your issue would not succeed in your favor. We have dealt with these same sorts of bonus claims where there are two sets of terms and conditions: one general set of terms and conditions, and then there are the bonus rules. When you took the bonus, you agreed to those bonus terms thus your complaint is not valid. Many of the more informed members have mentioned this in your thread.

My suggestion to you is to not play with bonuses if your English is not that good. This way you won't run into these sorts of problems in the future. Bonuses are not obligatory, and you will find that playing without a bonus will be more enjoyable.

And if online gambling is illegal in Turkey, I would find something else to do with your time since you will only run into problems like this in the future.
 

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