Betway issue

Gazza4rovers

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Location
England
Hello everyone well this is my first ever post and I am in a little bit of a pickle.

I joined Betway a couple of months ago but didn't deposit any money, but on Sunday I did because of the great sign up bonuses that the casino was offering. My first deposit was for £250, which I was expecting a bonus of £250 to match it, but i was only given £75 bonus so I rung up the casino to ask why this was only £75, the woman on the phone wasn't very helpful and I didn't have a clue what she was going on about so I left it and gambled. I lost both the money I deposited and the bonus money very quickly. I then made a second deposit of £500 which I should of received another £125 bonus but received nothing, I gambled and lost this £500, with my last deposit that was £880 again I didn't receive a bonus which should of been £440 but lucky for me I won and got to £2880 and made a withdrawal for the full amount. I did all these bets on roulette by the way so I rung the casino and asked if they needed any documents etc from me as I wanted things to go as quick as possible into my bank they said I needed to provide a picture of passport, full and back of debit card used and proof of address letter which I sent to them within the hour. They have a 48 hour pending bit on their site which I can reverse the funds and after that the operational team then process the payment.

Whilst waiting for the money I began to think about the sign up bonus that I felt I was short changed so I decided to contact the casino, they agree I was right and put £740 in my account on Tuesday morning. I started playing with the bonus funds and was playing big and got it to around £3000, so I contacted the casino to ask how far I was away from the bonus requirements, I was absolutely miles away so the cashier agreed to remove the bonus funds from my account but left £175 of bonus funds which needed clearing, he said I'd need to stake just under £5000 on slots or £60000 on roulette. So I started playing the slots but soon got bored as I hate the slots and reverted back to roulette. I eventually got the amount to £5035 and collected but some of the bets I were doing were bets on both red and black and a covering bet on zero and I would say about £25000 of the stakes were done doing this.

The next day on the Wednesday I reversed the funds and started playing again, this time betting a lot heavier than ever and I must of stakes around 35k and I eventually collected £11,088.

I am worried now that I won't get either my £2,880 or my £11,088 as I have been looking on the Internet and the casino has some very bad reviews. And looking at the rules which ain't accessible on an iPad or an iPhone which I used to win the stated amounts. The sign up bonus is only to new customers that deposit with 7 days of opening the account, but that's not my fault that theirs. And the other rule which relates to the bonuses received that I am not allowed to do any hedging bets or meet wagering requirements and if I've been seen to do that all winnings and bonuses can be confiscated. My argument for that is I'd of hit the wagering requirements without doing them bets, I am worried that this might also affect my first withdrawal aswell. I should find out today before 5pm whether they have processed the payment of £2880 and sent that to my bank if not ill ring them up again, as the whole process is so long and drawn out. According to there rules I won't get a decision about the £11,088 until next Tuesday, what so you reckon will happen guys I am going crazy thinking about it and have any of you had similar problems with betway???
 

CasinoBen

Dormant account
Joined
Jan 6, 2013
Location
Marbella
Whilst waiting for the money I began to think about the sign up bonus that I felt I was short changed so I decided to contact the casino, they agree I was right and put £740 in my account on Tuesday morning. I started playing with the bonus funds and was playing big and got it to around £3000, so I contacted the casino to ask how far I was away from the bonus requirements, I was absolutely miles away so the cashier agreed to remove the bonus funds from my account but left £175 of bonus funds which needed clearing, he said I'd need to stake just under £5000 on slots or £60000 on roulette. So I started playing the slots but soon got bored as I hate the slots and reverted back to roulette. I eventually got the amount to £5035 and collected but some of the bets I were doing were bets on both red and black and a covering bet on zero and I would say about £25000 of the stakes were done doing this.

Hi Gazza,

Welcome to Casinomeister. The quote above I find a bit strange. Why did they remove all of your bonus funds and leave the odd amount of £175 in your account. I have never heard of a casino retroactively lumping a bonus together that a player did not get after the player had started playing especially since you stated that you had won on those bonus funds. If they were adding the 3 bonuses that you did not get separately and then you asked what the wagering was, then expressed concern over the high wagering I could see at that point that they would remove some of the bonuses, but not after you started wagering and winning. But if this is what happened then is should be cool.

I would be more worried about point 9 of their bonus terms and conditions:
9. Before any withdrawals are processed, your play will be reviewed for any irregular playing patterns. In the interests of fair gaming, equal, zero or low margin bets or hedge betting, shall all be considered irregular gaming for bonus playthrough requirement purposes. Other examples of irregular game play include but are not limited to, placing single bets equal to or in excess of 30% or more of the value of the bonus credited to their account until such time as the wagering requirements for that bonus have been met. Should the Casino deem that irregular game play has occurred, the Casino reserves the right to withhold any withdrawals and/or confiscate all winnings.

Wagering £25k by betting on red/black and a straight up bet on zero in their eyes breach this term and conditions.

If, as you say the first win was from your deposit and no bonus funds I wouldn't see why you would not get paid.

Cheers,

Ben
 

Gazza4rovers

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Location
England
Hi Gazza,

Welcome to Casinomeister. The quote above I find a bit strange. Why did they remove all of your bonus funds and leave the odd amount of £175 in your account. I have never heard of a casino retroactively lumping a bonus together that a player did not get after the player had started playing especially since you stated that you had won on those bonus funds. If they were adding the 3 bonuses that you did not get separately and then you asked what the wagering was, then expressed concern over the high wagering I could see at that point that they would remove some of the bonuses, but not after you started wagering and winning. But if this is what happened then is should be cool.

I would be more worried about point 9 of their bonus terms and conditions:
9. Before any withdrawals are processed, your play will be reviewed for any irregular playing patterns. In the interests of fair gaming, equal, zero or low margin bets or hedge betting, shall all be considered irregular gaming for bonus playthrough requirement purposes. Other examples of irregular game play include but are not limited to, placing single bets equal to or in excess of 30% or more of the value of the bonus credited to their account until such time as the wagering requirements for that bonus have been met. Should the Casino deem that irregular game play has occurred, the Casino reserves the right to withhold any withdrawals and/or confiscate all winnings.

Wagering £25k by betting on red/black and a straight up bet on zero in their eyes breach this term and conditions.

If, as you say the first win was from your deposit and no bonus funds I wouldn't see why you would not get paid.

Cheers,

Ben

I found it strange that the cashier took most of the bonus money of and left the amount of £175 which needed clearing, so you think they will pay me the £2880 and refuse the payment of £11088 even though without wagering the 25k I'd of met the requirements anyhow as I reversed the withdrawal and gambled the £5000 to £11088, as to be honest I was going to reverse my £2880 and play with that if they hadnt of given me the bonus, and with the casino taking forever to process things I really wish I had some sort of decision now.
 

CasinoBen

Dormant account
Joined
Jan 6, 2013
Location
Marbella
I found it strange that the cashier took most of the bonus money of and left the amount of £175 which needed clearing, so you think they will pay me the £2880 and refuse the payment of £11088 even though without wagering the 25k I'd of met the requirements anyhow as I reversed the withdrawal and gambled the £5000 to £11088, as to be honest I was going to reverse my £2880 and play with that if they hadnt of given me the bonus, and with the casino taking forever to process things I really wish I had some sort of decision now.

Well if you won the £2880 from a straight up deposit with no bonus funds attached then I would think it will be fine as your not tied to any bonus terms and conditions. The £11088 I am not really sure, the fact that you reversed the withdrawal would not really make any difference if you breached their terms as the £5000 was money was won from the bonus funds that they gave you. Betway is accredited here so if you do not like the outcome then your first action should be to contact the rep.

Cheers,

Ben
 

Gazza4rovers

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Location
England
They have sent me an email saying the £2880 has been processed and its on its way to me now just have to worry about the £11,088 now and obviously wait until the £2880 is actually in my bank.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
They have sent me an email saying the £2880 has been processed and its on its way to me now just have to worry about the £11,088 now and obviously wait until the £2880 is actually in my bank.

The problem is the wagering on red, black, and zero. This is done purely to make it through WR, and at best you can expect this wagering contribution to be nullified and the WR reset to it's value before any Roulette play.

You will probably get bonus banned too, which is a shame because loyal VIP players get a few 50% and 100% boni throughout the month. For Platinum VIP, this is 100% up to £400, and about 3 times a month.

Far more likely they will pay the original £2880, but reset the later session done with the missed boni and tell you to play again, and steer clear of Roulette.

This claim that the rules were not available on an iPad or other mobile version seems doubtful, otherwise how could they claim that such a player had agreed to them. I don't have an iPad, so I can't check this myself.

Common sense alone should tell you that betting on everything just to clear WR is not a good idea when you have won a considerable sum. If anything, playing slots would have been better, and less time would have been needed to meet the WR.

There is also a max bet rule of 25% of bonus credited. It is likely that your "high stakes" part of the session breached this rule, and this would be a second reason to void the win and at best "reset" the account and tell you to play again.

They could just as easily say that since this was a free chip made up from the missed bonuses, with no deposit from yourself, they could simply void the lot.

If they offer anything better that voiding the lot, take it, your case is very weak.

Betway also own GNUF, and use the Palace group for support. This means that ALL Palace Group casinos can find out about this episode, and are unlikely to offer you bonuses in the future. It may also be that you HAVE tried something like this at another Palace Group casino, and this is why the system didn't credit the bonuses automatically.
 

asadzareef89

Meister Member
MM
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
Hello everyone well this is my first ever post and I am in a little bit of a pickle.

I joined Betway a couple of months ago but didn't deposit any money, but on Sunday I did because of the great sign up bonuses that the casino was offering. My first deposit was for £250, which I was expecting a bonus of £250 to match it, but i was only given £75 bonus so I rung up the casino to ask why this was only £75, the woman on the phone wasn't very helpful and I didn't have a clue what she was going on about so I left it and gambled. I lost both the money I deposited and the bonus money very quickly. I then made a second deposit of £500 which I should of received another £125 bonus but received nothing, I gambled and lost this £500, with my last deposit that was £880 again I didn't receive a bonus which should of been £440 but lucky for me I won and got to £2880 and made a withdrawal for the full amount. I did all these bets on roulette by the way so I rung the casino and asked if they needed any documents etc from me as I wanted things to go as quick as possible into my bank they said I needed to provide a picture of passport, full and back of debit card used and proof of address letter which I sent to them within the hour. They have a 48 hour pending bit on their site which I can reverse the funds and after that the operational team then process the payment.

Whilst waiting for the money I began to think about the sign up bonus that I felt I was short changed so I decided to contact the casino, they agree I was right and put £740 in my account on Tuesday morning. I started playing with the bonus funds and was playing big and got it to around £3000, so I contacted the casino to ask how far I was away from the bonus requirements, I was absolutely miles away so the cashier agreed to remove the bonus funds from my account but left £175 of bonus funds which needed clearing, he said I'd need to stake just under £5000 on slots or £60000 on roulette. So I started playing the slots but soon got bored as I hate the slots and reverted back to roulette. I eventually got the amount to £5035 and collected but some of the bets I were doing were bets on both red and black and a covering bet on zero and I would say about £25000 of the stakes were done doing this.

The next day on the Wednesday I reversed the funds and started playing again, this time betting a lot heavier than ever and I must of stakes around 35k and I eventually collected £11,088.

I am worried now that I won't get either my £2,880 or my £11,088 as I have been looking on the Internet and the casino has some very bad reviews. And looking at the rules which ain't accessible on an iPad or an iPhone which I used to win the stated amounts. The sign up bonus is only to new customers that deposit with 7 days of opening the account, but that's not my fault that theirs. And the other rule which relates to the bonuses received that I am not allowed to do any hedging bets or meet wagering requirements and if I've been seen to do that all winnings and bonuses can be confiscated. My argument for that is I'd of hit the wagering requirements without doing them bets, I am worried that this might also affect my first withdrawal aswell. I should find out today before 5pm whether they have processed the payment of £2880 and sent that to my bank if not ill ring them up again, as the whole process is so long and drawn out. According to there rules I won't get a decision about the £11,088 until next Tuesday, what so you reckon will happen guys I am going crazy thinking about it and have any of you had similar problems with betway???

Regardless of the fact that u couldnt see the t&c's on ur ipad, almost every casino bars players from even betting on roulette to meet the wagering requirements but still just wait for their reply as they might end up approving it.
 

Gazza4rovers

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Location
England
The problem is the wagering on red, black, and zero. This is done purely to make it through WR, and at best you can expect this wagering contribution to be nullified and the WR reset to it's value before any Roulette play.

You will probably get bonus banned too, which is a shame because loyal VIP players get a few 50% and 100% boni throughout the month. For Platinum VIP, this is 100% up to £400, and about 3 times a month.

Far more likely they will pay the original £2880, but reset the later session done with the missed boni and tell you to play again, and steer clear of Roulette.

This claim that the rules were not available on an iPad or other mobile version seems doubtful, otherwise how could they claim that such a player had agreed to them. I don't have an iPad, so I can't check this myself.

Common sense alone should tell you that betting on everything just to clear WR is not a good idea when you have won a considerable sum. If anything, playing slots would have been better, and less time would have been needed to meet the WR.

There is also a max bet rule of 25% of bonus credited. It is likely that your "high stakes" part of the session breached this rule, and this would be a second reason to void the win and at best "reset" the account and tell you to play again.

They could just as easily say that since this was a free chip made up from the missed bonuses, with no deposit from yourself, they could simply void the lot.

If they offer anything better that voiding the lot, take it, your case is very weak.

Betway also own GNUF, and use the Palace group for support. This means that ALL Palace Group casinos can find out about this episode, and are unlikely to offer you bonuses in the future. It may also be that you HAVE tried something like this at another Palace Group casino, and this is why the system didn't credit the bonuses automatically.

The reason the bonus wasn't added straight away is because I opened the account a couple of months ago, I haven't tried anything like this before if I had I'd of had the common sense not to do the red/black thing but the £2880 is in my bank now. Ill just have to wait and see what happens but thank for everyone's feedback least it's something I'll learn for the future.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
The reason the bonus wasn't added straight away is because I opened the account a couple of months ago, I haven't tried anything like this before if I had I'd of had the common sense not to do the red/black thing but the £2880 is in my bank now. Ill just have to wait and see what happens but thank for everyone's feedback least it's something I'll learn for the future.

That's a hard concept for a newbie to understand, unless they have read about it on "certain types" of affiliate sites that tell you step by step how to beat bonuses, yet not step by step how not to have the results confiscated by the casino. Instinct is to play to WIN, and the red/black/zero tactic can NEVER result in a gain, only a steady loss.


It would be pretty amazing if they DID pay the 11K without argument.
 

Gazza4rovers

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Location
England
From what you guys have been saying on here I've already accepted that they ain't going to pay me pay me out, so if and when they reject the withdrawal is there any point in me arguing or not?
 

Redbet-Andy

Dormant account - New account: AndyB-MrGreen
Joined
Jun 22, 2010
Location
Malta
From what you guys have been saying on here I've already accepted that they ain't going to pay me pay me out, so if and when they reject the withdrawal is there any point in me arguing or not?

I honestly doubt it Gazza, the Red/Black/Zero would preclude almost every casino from paying up and understandably so to be fair.

Still, you made a profit and learned a lesson. Onwards and upwards!
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Betway and GNUF are actually owned by the same parent company that own the Palace Group.

This cannot be proven, and it is denied when one asks.

It's something I know to be true, but cannot prove (yet).

The official line is that Palace Group have been contracted by the Betway Group to provide all the services involved in running the casino, but do not "call the shots". It's similar to the relationship they have with Prime casino. Unlike Palace Group and the Betway casinos, Prime's owners have decided not to cooperate with PAB, and are on the no-can-do list. Prime also pulled out of the accredited section because the owners didn't want to keep up the standards.

The connection must lie above the level of the Palace Group, the same type of parent relationship that meant Jackpot Factory ran it's own processor, even though this was denied.
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
... Prime's owners have decided not to cooperate with PAB, and are on the no-can-do list. Prime also pulled out of the accredited section because the owners didn't want to keep up the standards...
You're behind the times, bud. Prime Casino has a rep here and they are no longer on the no-can-do list.
 

maphesto

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 5, 2009
Location
Sweden
This cannot be proven, and it is denied when one asks.

It's something I know to be true, but cannot prove (yet).

The official line is that Palace Group have been contracted by the Betway Group to provide all the services involved in running the casino, but do not "call the shots". It's similar to the relationship they have with Prime casino. Unlike Palace Group and the Betway casinos, Prime's owners have decided not to cooperate with PAB, and are on the no-can-do list. Prime also pulled out of the accredited section because the owners didn't want to keep up the standards.

Just to add...
Betway/Gnuf have their own license and Prime are using the exact same license as the Palace Group.
 

irmster

Non-Gambler
PABnononaccred
Joined
May 5, 2010
Location
UK
well in some respects you are lucky you did not get the bonus when you expected it, as your method of playing through the WR would have invalidated the first withdrawal as well.

Many casino's would have invalidated your winnings merely for playing roulette with bonus money. In this case it seems it's allowed but with a much larger WR. Of course anyone could clear that betting on Red/Black - you'll know for the future, but you'll probably have to kiss goodbye to the 2nd withdrawal and I don't think anyone on here would argue against that.

Still, you've made a small profit so could have been worse.
 

Gazza4rovers

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Location
England
I am pissed off with myself really as I only started betting on red/black near the end as I was going to be late for work, I'd of easily been able to do it I actually would of hit it without doing the red/black thing as I reversed the amount :(
 

sparkz

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 27, 2007
Location
Earth
In some regards it should be common sense though.

Betting red and black means you simply cant lose much of your balance and guarantee yourself to meet the WR.

Every bet has to be played with a risk, casinos don't just hand out free cash.

100% winnings will be void. It will be checked in the payout audit
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
You're behind the times, bud. Prime Casino has a rep here and they are no longer on the no-can-do list.

What changed? Ownership?

They were once accredited, but slipped quietly to the no-can-do list. I continued playing there under the impression that they were still accredited, and came damn close to getting my fingers burned.

What first made me suspicious was the phonecall asking me to reverse my withdrawal for the offer of further bonuses, supposedly from the "owner", but it was all a lie as I discovered when phoning the "direct" number he gave me which was answered "Ruby Fortune..........".

After refusing their reversal offer, my next withdrawal, a mere £500, caused my account to be "investigated", quoting eCogra eGap regulations, followed by a lightning U-Turn when I replied that I was fully aware of the provisions of eGap.

I then discovered that they had quietly pulled out of the accredited section and entered the no-can-do list.

If this is the same people now as back then, this could just be a stunt, perhaps in the style of 888.com's efforts earlier.

They have recently begun to email me again.
 

Gazza4rovers

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Location
England
As you guys know already know they paid me £2880, which really was never in doubt looking back, but I am happy to say they also paid the £11088.50, without any arguments I got the final payment today as they did split it over two payments.
 

Sovietsky

Experienced Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2012
Location
Swe
As you guys know already know they paid me £2880, which really was never in doubt looking back, but I am happy to say they also paid the £11088.50, without any arguments I got the final payment today as they did split it over two payments.

Nice congrats!
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
As you guys know already know they paid me £2880, which really was never in doubt looking back, but I am happy to say they also paid the £11088.50, without any arguments I got the final payment today as they did split it over two payments.

You have been VERY lucky that they have been so lenient. It's possible that they didn't check so deeply into gameplay as you had played without bonuses at first. I don't expect you would have been paid had you played in this manner after the bonus had been credited as a welcome bonus on your first deposit.

If you get a lucky start in the future, don't use shortcuts like this to make WR and finish the session. A better approach would be to take a break and play again the next day. It's better to take an extra day to finish WR than spend a week worrying about them not paying.

You may find now that you don't get offered further bonuses at Betway as you have quickly gone well ahead.
 
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