Betsafe now at it.

jjezebel37

Dormant account
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
Location
Belfast (Northern Ireland)
Got an email asking for revertification as part if their new procedures with a clear shot of my income. I honestly haven't a problem with docs but I'm uncomfortable with this request.
 

Jono777

Ueber Meister
CAG
mm1
mm4
Joined
May 13, 2014
Location
Wolverhampton
Any casino who asks for proof of income can go and bloody piss right off.

If it becomes a "UKGC thing" then I'll simply take up knitting and fuck this slotting lark :mad:

Cheeky Twats :rolleyes:
 

goatwack

I’ll have the cleavage, I mean the special
CAG
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
Jesus Christ it's contagious. Not like a really popular delaying tactic used by everyone right now now or anything.

Watch out for that verificitus, it's doing the rounds :mad::rolleyes:
 

lockinlove

Staring into the sun
PABaccred
PABnonaccred
Joined
Jan 17, 2014
Location
Canada
A screenshot of your income? Wow.

Went and closed my account and told them this is the result of them asking people over the top personal things.

The community needs to stand up against this crap or soon they will think its fine to ask for DNA, urine test and dental records.
 

Jono777

Ueber Meister
CAG
mm1
mm4
Joined
May 13, 2014
Location
Wolverhampton
Done something similar to this before but I'm bored.....

In Order to play at Numb Nuts Casino we will need the following

1) Photo ID, Driving Licence and Passports not accepted, just to go that extra mile to help you out
2) Urine sample no older than 24 hours, this will be stored in Cryo after succesful verification and not used to fulfill staff fetishes.
3) Stool Sample to be cut to 2 x 2 cm and no diarrhea please, again no older than 24h
4) A full length naked photo, normal as can be and not in a state of arousal.
5) Sick sample, no carrots please.
6) Breath specimen - used to establish the smokers out there and thus reduced value as customers
7) A fresh blood sample, check your in good health, we don't want any of you depositing, charge-backing and then dropping dead on us now,,,
8) DNA sample, we have friends in high places and will stitch you up if you cross us...


:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
 

Mr Wild

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2015
Location
Malta
Got an email asking for revertification as part if their new procedures with a clear shot of my income. I honestly haven't a problem with docs but I'm uncomfortable with this request.

Unfortunately these are new requirements for all operators in the EU +UK. I have posted about this change last year.

If you spend over a certain amount, the casino need to do an EDD on you. Its new AML requirements from EU's 4th directive that came into force this summer.
 

asidea

®Laugh a little each day!.
PABnonaccred
Joined
Apr 28, 2004
Location
UK
Betsafe

Thoroughly agree to boycotting such appalling rules:eek:
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
CAG
MM
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Sweden
Unfortunately these are new requirements for all operators in the EU +UK. I have posted about this change last year.

If you spend over a certain amount, the casino need to do an EDD on you. Its new AML requirements from EU's 4th directive that came into force this summer.

I remember that thread. But how high is that amount and is it from the sign up date or from when the law came in to place?
If I have spent more than my income are what will happen? Do I need to provide my Neteller history to show my winnings to all casinos?
Isn't the law mostly for high rollers? I know they already ask them for proof when needed.
 

TheAddict

Ueber Meister
Joined
Jan 9, 2013
Location
Kent
Hope this doesnt go mainsteam. Know a few people who play online, myself included atm, who have no way of showing where income is currently coming from unless they are willing to send a rep to come out for a few pints and watch us play fruit machines for a day.
 

TradaCasino

Official rep for Trada Casino
Joined
Mar 5, 2013
Location
Dublin, Ireland
Proof of income is actually a UKGC requirement once players pass certain thresholds (AFAIK this threshold can vary depending on the casino).

I've seen a few posts about this on CM, but it genuinely is a player protection mechanism. I don't speak for other casinos, but perhaps some other operators are sending out the requests before any thresholds are reached just to have to document on file, in case it's needed in the future?

An example of why this requirement is in place is here:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.


"As a result of the crime, the customer was sentenced to 16 months in prison for theft and false
accounting.

Our investigation found no evidence that 888 engaged with the customer to ascertain if they had
any problem gambling issues or to confirm their source of income."


Had this customer been asked for source of income at any stage, it would have been clear they were spending much more than they could afford. The account would have been closed long ago, the customer would have been referred to GamCare or similar, and the issue with the stolen funds from the employer could have been avoided.

While it might seem intrusive when players receive this request (and I completely understand that it IS intrusive), it is a necessary evil which is in place to protect more vulnerable players. The vast majority of the time, everything is fine with source of income documents. However, every now and then this process helps to identify a player that needs someone to step in and help them.

Rachel.
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
CAG
MM
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Sweden
Proof of income is actually a UKGC requirement once players pass certain thresholds (AFAIK this threshold can vary depending on the casino).

I've seen a few posts about this on CM, but it genuinely is a player protection mechanism. I don't speak for other casinos, but perhaps some other operators are sending out the requests before any thresholds are reached just to have to document on file, in case it's needed in the future?

An example of why this requirement is in place is here:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.


"As a result of the crime, the customer was sentenced to 16 months in prison for theft and false
accounting.

Our investigation found no evidence that 888 engaged with the customer to ascertain if they had
any problem gambling issues or to confirm their source of income."


Had this customer been asked for source of income at any stage, it would have been clear they were spending much more than they could afford. The account would have been closed long ago, the customer would have been referred to GamCare or similar, and the issue with the stolen funds from the employer could have been avoided.

While it might seem intrusive when players receive this request (and I completely understand that it IS intrusive), it is a necessary evil which is in place to protect more vulnerable players. The vast majority of the time, everything is fine with source of income documents. However, every now and then this process helps to identify a player that needs someone to step in and help them.

Rachel.

It's not just UK. It's also EU now.
This is the thread MrWild talked about. https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...private-financial-information-about-me.76980/ I could see that I asked the same questions there. Good I can start to blame my age for not remembering everything :)

It seems like BML group is doing this more often though. I've heard several being forced by Neteller and Skrill lately too, and it doesn't matter if the person is in the UK or EU.
 

TradaCasino

Official rep for Trada Casino
Joined
Mar 5, 2013
Location
Dublin, Ireland
just tell them you're a drug dealer and can't declare your income

Exactly the point - proceeds of crime. That's one of the reasons casinos have to ask for this information when the player hits a certain threshold. These days you can't even pay cash in a car dealership without proving where it came from (which is a good thing, it ensures spending funds obtained criminally is now extremely difficult wherever you go).

It's not just UK. It's also EU now.
This is the thread MrWild talked about. https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...private-financial-information-about-me.76980/ I could see that I asked the same questions there. Good I can start to blame my age for not remembering everything :)

It seems like BML group is doing this more often though. I've heard several being forced by Neteller and Skrill lately too, and it doesn't matter if the person is in the UK or EU.

Ah yes you're absolutely right, its an EU directive too. When I first got notification we had to ask certain players for source of funds I was appalled! I completely understand why it's a necessity now though, it's positive that this is now in place.
 

jjezebel37

Dormant account
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
Location
Belfast (Northern Ireland)
Proof of income is actually a UKGC requirement once players pass certain thresholds (AFAIK this threshold can vary depending on the casino).

I've seen a few posts about this on CM, but it genuinely is a player protection mechanism. I don't speak for other casinos, but perhaps some other operators are sending out the requests before any thresholds are reached just to have to document on file, in case it's needed in the future?

An example of why this requirement is in place is here:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.


"As a result of the crime, the customer was sentenced to 16 months in prison for theft and false
accounting.

Our investigation found no evidence that 888 engaged with the customer to ascertain if they had
any problem gambling issues or to confirm their source of income."


Had this customer been asked for source of income at any stage, it would have been clear they were spending much more than they could afford. The account would have been closed long ago, the customer would have been referred to GamCare or similar, and the issue with the stolen funds from the employer could have been avoided.

While it might seem intrusive when players receive this request (and I completely understand that it IS intrusive), it is a necessary evil which is in place to protect more vulnerable players. The vast majority of the time, everything is fine with source of income documents. However, every now and then this process helps to identify a player that needs someone to step in and help them.

Rachel.

I would understand if I were a high roller but I'm pretty low.
It may be that Betsafe was one of my first casinos and as you say, I've reached that threshold.
I trust what you are saying so I may rethink what I'm going to do.
 

Jono777

Ueber Meister
CAG
mm1
mm4
Joined
May 13, 2014
Location
Wolverhampton
I would understand if I were a high roller but I'm pretty low.
It may be that Betsafe was one of my first casinos and as you say, I've reached that threshold.
I trust what you are saying so I may rethink what I'm going to do.


As much as I appreciate, understand and believe the various points made in this thread, to an extent / in certain cases I still do not agree and think its bloody cheeky.

Its all about how this rule / requirement is originally written and later understood and governed correctly.

Scenario A) A player deposits 3-4 times £50 - £100 per week, player has been a member a couple of years and deposit frequency has slightly, although not majorly steadily increased over this period.

Scenario B) A player has been a member just 3-4 months and tends to make 4-5, £500+ deposits per month.

Scenario C) A player deposits £25 - £50 once a week or thereabouts, has been a member over 12 months and also has periods where no deposits at all are made for 3-4 week breaks at a time.

With (A) and (B) I'd agree with this rule, with (C) I would not

My take / opinion only but also I feel a sensible and more realistic take :thumbsup:
 

goatwack

I’ll have the cleavage, I mean the special
CAG
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
Indeed, said player deposits £100+ a week for months/ years and no income requests are forthcoming.....because it doesn't matter where the money came from there.

I'd be peeved having to provide my income, especially as a long-standing player. Of course a 'fly-by'night' punter who wants to make a quick buck and has made one deposit is different altogether. It used to be a thing called 'discretion' whereby a business would use some common sense without needlessly antagonizing its loyal players...

Now if Christmas came early and I had a £20,000 withdrawal pending, they can have my shoe size and urine sample, I don't really care at that juncture. Yet all I see happening is casinos making unreasonable, invasive demands for ever- smaller amounts. And that's not a good thing :cool:
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
CAG
MM
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Sweden
As much as I appreciate, understand and believe the various points made in this thread, to an extent / in certain cases I still do not agree and think its bloody cheeky.

Its all about how this rule / requirement is originally written and later understood and governed correctly.

Scenario A) A player deposits 3-4 times £50 - £100 per week, player has been a member a couple of years and deposit frequency has slightly, although not majorly steadily increased over this period.

Scenario B) A player has been a member just 3-4 months and tends to make 4-5, £500+ deposits per month.

Scenario C) A player deposits £25 - £50 once a week or thereabouts, has been a member over 12 months and also has periods where no deposits at all are made for 3-4 week breaks at a time.

With (A) and (B) I'd agree with this rule, with (C) I would not

My take / opinion only but also I feel a sensible and more realistic take :thumbsup:

Did you get those examples from somewhere or made them up?
 

Jono777

Ueber Meister
CAG
mm1
mm4
Joined
May 13, 2014
Location
Wolverhampton
Did you get those examples from somewhere or made them up?

I made them up.

I do strongly feel though that they are realistic examples and should be considered seriously by the 'powers that be'

My points in previous post, together with Goatwack's "time served player" point I feel could make an acceptable rule and even turn what seems like a negative into a positive.

As I say it is all about how it is implemented, governed, etc, something tells me however that this will not be done well :rolleyes:
 

goatwack

I’ll have the cleavage, I mean the special
CAG
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
Did you get those examples from somewhere or made them up?

They're pretty good actually ;)

I'm Scenario A myself.

Ok ok, maybe I'm Scenario C :oops:
 

Tirilej

Still a Lady
CAG
MM
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Sweden
I made them up.

I do strongly feel though that they are realistic examples and should be considered seriously by the 'powers that be'

My points in previous post, together with Goatwack's "time served player" point I feel could make an acceptable rule and even turn what seems like a negative into a positive.

As I say it is all about how it is implemented, governed, etc, something tells me however that this will not be done well :rolleyes:

I believe you can forget those examples.

They are already implemented so if no casino have asked you yet I doubt they will.
Unless you start playing as a high roller or deposit high amounts in a short time then you're safe.
I believe the op is playing a bit higher than you are, but that's just a guess.
 

goatwack

I’ll have the cleavage, I mean the special
CAG
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
People play higher than 20p?

I've heard the stories but didn't believe them. No one can afford that! :eek2:
 

TradaCasino

Official rep for Trada Casino
Joined
Mar 5, 2013
Location
Dublin, Ireland
As much as I appreciate, understand and believe the various points made in this thread, to an extent / in certain cases I still do not agree and think its bloody cheeky.

I understand this may come across as cheeky, but I can assure you - there is no casino out there that is asking for these documents out of curiosity or cheek. They are just trying to ensure players have the means to gamble the money they are depositing.

In your third scenario, where you wouldn't agree with this document being requested - it would never be requested in that scenario anyway.

While it would seem objectionable for a player who is happily gambling within their means to receive this request, don't forget there will be someone else spending the same amount who simply cannot afford to lose that.
 

paul7388

Ueber Meister
MM
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Location
glasgow scotland
Well i would never be in position where my deposits should require such documents if any casino started asking i would just then stick to UK bookies sites.

But to be fair i understand why its needed.

For example if a player that stays in an area that is classed as really poor yet deposits thousands a week then its understandable they would want proof
 
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