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Be The Dealer Casino is truly a unique concept....

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by dave_r, Feb 24, 2002.

  1. dave_r

    dave_r Dormant account

    There are rumors everywhere that this casino is owned by Tony Friedman and Avi Goldman of Windows Casino. Regardless, this place is worth checking out, as it is a very impressive concept. There are real opportunites here for an intelligent player.

    You can play as a regular player OR as the dealer in every game they offer. Right now they have double deck blackjack, single-0 roulette, video poker, and slots.

    Every member of this casino is permitted to spend up 50% of his total play AS THE DEALER.

    What's amazing about this concept is when 2 humans are playing against each other, there is absolutely NO INCENTIVE for the casino to rig thier games. The casino itself HAS NO MONEY AT RISK, and is not gambling. In fact the casino isn't making bets at all. It is simply collecting its 1.5% commission from the dealer ONLY, and it doesn't matter which member WINS (the player or the dealer) since the casino gets its fee no matter what.

    When you choose to BE THE DEALER, this increases your chances of winning, since you gain some of the favorable odds reserved for the casino. At the end of every round the casino takes a commission of 1.5% of the total bets bet against the Dealer. The casino never charges THE PLAYER a commission. (Original Mary is WRONG about this. Its rare for her to be wrong, so I figured I'd point out this single instance. :) )

    Example
    A Dealer chooses to play in Table III. This means that the Dealer meets the minimum requirements for playing in this table type: a minimum of 755 Credit Points and a minimum balance of $755. The system then matches a Player to the Dealer and after the Dealer 'Approves' the next round, the Player places his/her bets on the table. Notice that the view of the table has changed to that of the Dealer's. Let's say the Player places $137 and receives a 'K' and a '3' and the Dealer's upcard is a '7'. The Player decides to 'Hit' his/her hand and receives a 'J', and therefore busts. The Dealer's hole card is then revealed to show a '5'. The Player loses his/her bet and since the bet against the Dealer was $137 the casino takes a commission of
    1.5%*137 = $2.06, which means the Dealer wins 137-2.06 = $134.94 on this round.
    The casino's edge in Blackjack with these rules is approximately 2% (bear in mind that this percentage depends on the knowledge of the player in Blackjack. Also, this 2% is how the casino makes a profit on Blackjack) so as the Dealer you actually gain an edge of about 0.5%.

    If you are competing against a player who is smart and plays optimally, you will no doubt lose at a rate greater than 1%.

    The roulette game there is single-0, and therefore the house advantage as a player is only 2.7% making it a good deal. But what's amazing about the concept is that when you play as the DEALER, the house only takes its same 1.5% cut.
    Therefore, you actually have an advantage of
    2.7%-1.5% = 1.2% on every spin of the wheel.
    WOW!! But remember you must spend half of the time as the dealer and the other half the time as the player. So as the player you lose at the normal 2.7% rate. As the dealer, you win at the normal 1.2% rate. Therefore for your TOTAL play as both player and dealer you are only losing 1.5%.

    I believe there may be real opportunities here when dealing the jacks or better VP. As the dealer, I ran into a few players who have NO IDEA what it means to play optimally. This is good news for me. These players were probably exposing themselves to a 4% advantage, and I was raking in a the profits (4%-1.5%) = an astounding 2.5% advantage for me. While playing as THE PLAYER, I was playing optimally (8/5 Jacks) and was losing ar the rate of 2.7%. This means I was losing 0.02% overall.

    However, bare in mind you can't pick and choose the humans you are playing against. They desperately need to change this. If you can find a true idiot to play against, you stand a good chance of coming out ahead. But thier system randomly selects a player for you. Since I don't know who these players are, I had doubts whether or not these players were real players or ROBOT players. The only thing I could do is go into chat mode and find someone whome I assumed to be real.

    The customer service there is by email only. No phone support. No live chat.

    Support responded to my email within 7 hours. (Not the speediest reply - but acceptable)

    The email gave me a lengthy explanation of the deposit/withdrawal process, and it answered all 7 out of my 7 questions. Very good.

    So what's the verdict? I don't know yet. I know they will be offering bonuses to regular players there - which will ultimately give the smart player an advantage. The problem is -- with the likes of Friedman/Goldman, who wants to take the chance of these bonuses(and possibly winnings) being witheld?
     
  2. mrracetrack

    mrracetrack Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    North of Pluto
    Dave,

    The concept seems like a good one.
    It is good to see innovative features
    such as this being tried.

    The only "downside" to this is stated
    in the first sentence of your post;

    "There are rumors everywhere that this casino is owned by Tony Friedman and Avi Goldman of Windows Casino."

    If this is true, I would definitely "pass" on
    this one. The past history of "Friedman/Goldman",
    what with the numerous problems that occured at Windows Casino, Magic Oasis Casino, the involvment with the infamous
    "On line Casino Managers Assoc.", and the problems associated with RTG in general,
    SafeBet, and anything else associated with
    these two, have a very high probability that
    "problems" will occur. Their track record
    speaks for itself.

    I would like to see MicroGaming get involved
    with this type of concept. Other than the
    complete incompetence of Microgaming's
    E-Cash processor, Proccyber, they have
    shown that they are capable of conducting
    the running of their casino's in a professional manner.

    RTG in general, and Windows, MagicOasis and
    "Friedman/Goldman" specifically, have NOT
    run their casino's in a professional manner,
    and until they can prove they can do so,
    over a substantial period of time, I would
    be very leery of playing, or depositing any money with them.
     
  3. mary

    mary Dormant account

    It's not a rumor.
    Plus, you can hear the RTG recycled soundbites in the game.

    You sure that players don't get hit with rake, too? I got that from the help files. Maybe they've changed it.
     
  4. mary

    mary Dormant account

    Dave's right; the 1.5% is out of the dealer's pocket, and no rake for the player.

    Further evidence of an Avi/Tony partnership is that these fine establishments are approved by

    You must register/login in order to see the link.

    Which is Avi and Tony's own competition for Safebet in the shill oversight game.

    I agree it's a great idea. The casino takes in a constant revenue stream per wager and offloads the variance on players willing to bank as dealers. Too bad it's *these guys* idea.

    They will also sell you software at www.beejack.com so you can spot the sharp players at your blackjack table when you're the dealer!

    They go their hands on every side of the table--the regulators,the house, the eye in the sky, the crossroaders!
     
  5. timothychan

    timothychan Dormant account

    I have been away from this forum (and many othet forum ) for really a long time so I did not follow up on this Avi and Tony's story.

    But I can prove that those guys at www.beejack.com never paid me commission for a long long time. In fact I am the first few who recommended the system on my website when they just started to sell the app over the net.
     
  6. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    Hi Timothy!!

    Welcome back!!

    Bryan
     
  7. timothychan

    timothychan Dormant account

    Thanks Bryan,

    Hey you got some great radio show.
    KEEP IT UP.

    :)

    Tim
    You must register/login in order to see the link.
     
  8. dave_r

    dave_r Dormant account

    I recently read elsewhere that the software development company for Be The Dealer IS not owned by Friedman/Goldeman and that only the Play&Deal licensee is owned by them.

    Now I don't know what to believe.

    Mary?
     
  9. the_cpa

    the_cpa Dormant account

    Here's a release I had up back in January when they came out. It's still uploaded if you want to read it.
    You must register/login in order to see the link.

    My understanding is that Windows does NOT actually own the product and has been enlisted as an affilite of sorts...to market the Casino. Much like,say, Referback is to MG. Difference obviously being, Windows also owns Casinos too.

    I beleive that Be the Dealer wanted to tap into the mainstream and hook up with an outfit with affiliate recruiting capabilities and could provide immediate exposure for them on a large scale.

    Windows is one of several...I beleive. My account is thru Windows as an affiliate for them. But again, I don't think they actually own the place! LOL I think Windows saw it as a way to get a piece of a new and unique idea, not all bad thinking on their part either and gets some of eggs into another basket.

    I haven't really promoted them yet because I haven't played there in real mode. Did do the Fun mode and seriously, it's not bad.

    I can't tell you who collects the deposits and pays the winners, just that when I do start to promo them, our money will come from Windows, Hopefully!
    Does sound like a job for Mary in order to get all the correct info.

    PS: If you're going to download this and Casinomeister has it available, please use his link since we're on his forum! If he doesn't,get it from me! The kids are hungry! LOL
     
  10. dave_r

    dave_r Dormant account

    I have played here quite a bit lately, and won an enormous amount. Probably the second largest amount I've ever won all at once in an online casino.

    This place has real opportunites for advantage players. Outsmarting other players here is like playing chess. You need to take detailed notes on the way other "regulars" here play, until you have thier pattern of betting down pat. Capitalize on players who don't have clue how to play optimally. Look for the players that constantly overbet thier bankroll (when they are on a losing streak) and make sure you have enough credit points so you will make all of his/her money.

    Normally I don't recommend casinos without telephone or online chat support, but
    BeTheDealer is one of the few exceptions.
    Thier customer service is above average and thier responses to my emails have almost always been immediate.

    They sent me my $$$ after a 5 day waiting period. I wish they did it faster, but I can't complain.

    Based on the past few months of play here, in real mode, I am very satisfied. I like the concept quite a bit better than a regular online casino, and if the $$$ keep rolling in, I will play here every couple of days.
     
  11. stacy

    stacy Dormant account

    So I'm quite interested in this casino, does anyone else have any experience playing there?
    Thanks,

    Stacy
     
  12. greyhound

    greyhound Dormant account

    Dave,
    you've correctly said that "when 2 humans are playing against each other, there is no incentive for the casino to rig their games". But what if the player is a shill? Then you, as a dealer, are losing 1.5% plus anything that the shill wins and the casino gets it all, if rigged then even more. I find this a truly unique concept how a casino can make money.
     
  13. stacy

    stacy Dormant account

    Please excuse me for being ignorant but what is a shill?
     
  14. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    Hi Stacy,

    A shill is someone who poses as a customer/player, but is in fact in league with the casino.
     
  15. stacy

    stacy Dormant account

    Thanks Brian :D
    So is there a way to tell if it's not a shill besides having your friend go and play at the same time you are?
     

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