Bogus Complaint AllSlots won't pay my $865 back to my moneybookers account!

rivalfan

banned user: fraudulent PAB claims
Joined
Sep 7, 2008
Location
europe
I'm very sorry, that i must open this thread, but if i make a withdrawal on any casino, i also want to get my money back on my last deposit method, which is even mentioned on the T&C from AllSlots.
But the problem is now, that they've transfered the money to my formerly click2pay account, which is closed (because they don't accept cashouts under 1,500.- = about $2,200), so i can't get the money from it now!
I told them more times, that i've made a withdrawal to my moneybookers account, like also the last 2 years, on which i've played on this casino!
But the live chat only told me the following:

"Our withdrawal policy states:" A withdrawal will first be processed back to the last deposit method used. If you have used more than one method to deposit, your withdrawal will be processed using one of the methods listed by priority: 5. Click2Pay - 6. EziPay - 7. Neteller - 8. MoneyBookers"

Yes, i've used a Click2Pay account too, but my last deposit was made with moneybookers and i only used click2pay for one time, so why did they send the money to this account, although i could make a withdrawal to my moneybookers account in my cashier and i even got no information for this very mysterious rule!?

The money is now away, because i can't log in on my click2pay account and even if i could do this, i can't do anything with this money, because their minimum cashout limit!

I didn't get any answer from the Supervisor from AllSlots, although the live chat promised it to me, but nothing happens and my money is only lost!

I had never any problems before with this casino, but now it looks like, that they violate their own T&C which says for me exactly:

"A withdrawal will first be processed back to the last deposit method"

So what can i do now, because i don't want to lose the money and i also want not to call/see this casino as a roguish one.

thanks for your help!
 

anniemac

Ueber Meister
PABnoaccred
MM
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Location
Texas, USA
They have a rep listed here. Contact him through this site. Then if they are not rogued, Pitch a Bitch with Maxd.

Hope you get it worked out.
 

anniemac

Ueber Meister
PABnoaccred
MM
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Location
Texas, USA
Thanks, Rivalfan. Then that's the way to go. First, contact rep. then Maxd if all else fails.

How did they deposit to Click2Pay if you account is closed? Would seem to me C2P should have kicked the money back to Allslots.
 

rivalfan

banned user: fraudulent PAB claims
Joined
Sep 7, 2008
Location
europe
How did they deposit to Click2Pay if you account is closed?

That's really also a very good question, because normally they should not be able to withdraw money to any closed account, or am i false?

At first, thanks for your answers, but can you tell me, how can i find the rep from this casino here, or is there any list from the casino reps?
Maybe i must only look a little bit better on this side, to find it? ;)

Edit: Ok i've found him now, because there exist another complain thread about this group: https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...factory-bonus-requirements-tournaments.26510/

Hope that i get a fair solution from him.
 

maxd

Complaints (PAB) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia

RobWin

closed account
Joined
Apr 24, 2004
Location
A Vault!
I'm very sorry, that i must open this thread, but if i make a withdrawal on any casino, i also want to get my money back on my last deposit method, which is even mentioned on the T&C from AllSlots.
But the problem is now, that they've transfered the money to my formerly click2pay account, which is closed (because they don't accept cashouts under €1,500.- = about $2,200), so i can't get the money from it now!


Well that is something that I think we would ALL like to know here !! How in the world could Allslots (Jackpot Factory) have paid this cashout back into an ewallet account that has been closed ?? :confused:

I mean it is either closed or it isn't...which is it ??

Does this also mean that casinos can also go back into our ewallet accounts and remove money at will too ?? That casinos have access to our ewallet accounts that we have used to deposit with or receive payment back from them in the past ??
 

catrina m

Dormant account
PABaccred
Joined
Feb 8, 2007
Location
US of A
I accidentally processed an inet payout to click2pay a few months ago.

I haven't used click2pay in 2 years, but thankfully I still had my login info.

I redeposited back to inet, so it worked out. Even though I am US, I can still log in to my click2pay. Do you remember your account info?
 

rivalfan

banned user: fraudulent PAB claims
Joined
Sep 7, 2008
Location
europe
Sorry, htat i must also post it here!

But it looks like, that he don't want to find a solution!

He only told me, that he can't make a reversal, because it's just send to click2pay, although this account is closed!

I got now really problems, because i've lost now about 550.- and this is nearly 1 month of work for me, so i can't pay some bills, because i've trusted them, but that was a very big error!
 

jas2587

Ueber Meister
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Location
FL
I am in the USA an can to this
day still deposit an withdraw using
Click2Pay into an outta casinos

try an log into your Click2pay account
an see if it is closed it just might
surprise ya


also I have noticed when I am doin Quicktender
an it acts like its gonna time out a pop up
comes up that says Eco next time it happens I am
catchin that bad boy on a screen shot as that tells
me they are 1 in the same

Good Luck

Cindy
 

jas2587

Ueber Meister
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Location
FL
have you tried emailing Click2pay to see if infact your
withdrawel went there? just cause they say it did
does not mean it is so
you know what I mean

service@click2pay.com

I just logged into my account
no problems

Good Luck
Cindy
 

rivalfan

banned user: fraudulent PAB claims
Joined
Sep 7, 2008
Location
europe
click2pay never answerd me, when i write them, so it's unnecessary and as i said, it was not my fault, because AllSlots have withdrawn my money to this closed account, although moneybookers was always my prefered method!
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Well that is something that I think we would ALL like to know here !! How in the world could Allslots (Jackpot Factory) have paid this cashout back into an ewallet account that has been closed ?? :confused:

I mean it is either closed or it isn't...which is it ??

Does this also mean that casinos can also go back into our ewallet accounts and remove money at will too ?? That casinos have access to our ewallet accounts that we have used to deposit with or receive payment back from them in the past ??

Well, in a nutshell, YES, and it has been done too, and complained about here.

It seems that a casino simply request that a payment they made to a player's eWallet account be reversed as it was made in error. The casino does NOT have to explain the error to the Ewallet, the money simply has to still be there.
This certainly was the case when a player complained that a casino was able to "charge back" their already paid winnings from Neteller some two weeks later. The casino simply told Neteller the payment was an error, and they were able to get it back WITHOUT even INFORMING the player, let alone bothering to ask permission.
In the melee, the rep for the casino admitted that this had indeed been done, and because a later audit determined that the player had comitted "bonus abuse", and would NOT have been paid if this had come to light at the time.
The rep soon became educated to the fact that this kind of behaviour was not acceptable, and gave a promise it would never happen again (although some might say it had to be dragged out of them).

One thing this incident DID expose though, was absolute PROOF that casinos can indeed issue a "chargeback" for a payout they have previously made to a player's Neteller account, and there is no need for them to expand on the "error" claim, and thus cannot be said to have LIED to Neteller about any justification for the action.

Although Click2Pay is NOT Neteller, I would expect the same would apply to ALL the eWallets that were originally set up for the purpose of conducting gambling transactions in the wake of credit cards pulling out of the market.

If Click2Pay really ARE based in the EU, it should be possible to complain over their heads to the regulator, presumably German, in order to either recover the money, or provide access to it.

If Click2Pay have implemented a policy of not allowing members to withdraw their money, or spend it outside of gambling, if the balance is not rather large ($2,200), then this should be seen as a breach of the requirements to support "responsible gambling", as in effect, the player can ONLY gamble his money up to $2,200, or lose the lot trying - it can not be used for other purposes.

If JF have these peculiar policies that create situations where players are paid into closed accounts, or accounts that no longer allow them access to their money, then JF are responsible for losing the money UNLESS the payout was as instructed by the player, and it being the PLAYER that mistakenly chose a closed account as a payout method.

Click2Pay seem to have a very cosy relationship with casinos, and despite the fact that they have been under fire even more than Neteller for dis-service to customers, it seems Click2Pay remains the "top" eWallet provider as recommended by casinos, over and above the others.

A similar problem happens when payments are made back to credit cards that have been either closed in the meantime, or have been re-issued by the banks with new details (not "rocket science", it happens every 2 to 3 years and is a banking security measure). Some credit card companies leave the money in limbo, and it can be hard to get at it, and these are REGULATED BANKS, not lightly regulated (read - EXEMPT) "small eMoney issuers".

JF have already p****d off many US players with the (understandable) processor issues, but now seem intent on p*****g off EUROPEAN players too, by inflicting completely unnecessary "processing issues" on players, and when money goes AWOL they seem to wash their hands of the problems they have created.

They have misprocessed MY withdrawals a number of times (although not recently), and it can be like pulling teeth to get things resolved. All I need now is them processing withdrawals to some obscure account I may have had crreated for me as a "service to our customers", such as the Quicktender account I was nominated for, quite unnecessary for me as an EU citizen, as well as the Payspark duo of accounts that I received from TWO casino groups, that I thankfully never used when it turned out they got caught up by the troubles in LEBANON of all places!!
 

RobWin

closed account
Joined
Apr 24, 2004
Location
A Vault!
Well, in a nutshell, YES, and it has been done too, and complained about here.

It seems that a casino simply request that a payment they made to a player's eWallet account be reversed as it was made in error. The casino does NOT have to explain the error to the Ewallet, the money simply has to still be there.
This certainly was the case when a player complained that a casino was able to "charge back" their already paid winnings from Neteller some two weeks later. The casino simply told Neteller the payment was an error, and they were able to get it back WITHOUT even INFORMING the player, let alone bothering to ask permission.
In the melee, the rep for the casino admitted that this had indeed been done, and because a later audit determined that the player had comitted "bonus abuse", and would NOT have been paid if this had come to light at the time.
The rep soon became educated to the fact that this kind of behaviour was not acceptable, and gave a promise it would never happen again (although some might say it had to be dragged out of them).

One thing this incident DID expose though, was absolute PROOF that casinos can indeed issue a "chargeback" for a payout they have previously made to a player's Neteller account, and there is no need for them to expand on the "error" claim, and thus cannot be said to have LIED to Neteller about any justification for the action.

Although Click2Pay is NOT Neteller, I would expect the same would apply to ALL the eWallets that were originally set up for the purpose of conducting gambling transactions in the wake of credit cards pulling out of the market.

If Click2Pay really ARE based in the EU, it should be possible to complain over their heads to the regulator, presumably German, in order to either recover the money, or provide access to it.

If Click2Pay have implemented a policy of not allowing members to withdraw their money, or spend it outside of gambling, if the balance is not rather large ($2,200), then this should be seen as a breach of the requirements to support "responsible gambling", as in effect, the player can ONLY gamble his money up to $2,200, or lose the lot trying - it can not be used for other purposes.

If JF have these peculiar policies that create situations where players are paid into closed accounts, or accounts that no longer allow them access to their money, then JF are responsible for losing the money UNLESS the payout was as instructed by the player, and it being the PLAYER that mistakenly chose a closed account as a payout method.

Click2Pay seem to have a very cosy relationship with casinos, and despite the fact that they have been under fire even more than Neteller for dis-service to customers, it seems Click2Pay remains the "top" eWallet provider as recommended by casinos, over and above the others.

A similar problem happens when payments are made back to credit cards that have been either closed in the meantime, or have been re-issued by the banks with new details (not "rocket science", it happens every 2 to 3 years and is a banking security measure). Some credit card companies leave the money in limbo, and it can be hard to get at it, and these are REGULATED BANKS, not lightly regulated (read - EXEMPT) "small eMoney issuers".

JF have already p****d off many US players with the (understandable) processor issues, but now seem intent on p*****g off EUROPEAN players too, by inflicting completely unnecessary "processing issues" on players, and when money goes AWOL they seem to wash their hands of the problems they have created.

They have misprocessed MY withdrawals a number of times (although not recently), and it can be like pulling teeth to get things resolved. All I need now is them processing withdrawals to some obscure account I may have had crreated for me as a "service to our customers", such as the Quicktender account I was nominated for, quite unnecessary for me as an EU citizen, as well as the Payspark duo of accounts that I received from TWO casino groups, that I thankfully never used when it turned out they got caught up by the troubles in LEBANON of all places!!

Good post VWM :thumbsup:...I am still baffled though as to how any casino could pay out money winnings to a closed ewallet account, to me this would be the same as me being able to use a closed credit card account that I had to make a deposit with now...:confused:
 

daera

Dormant account
Joined
Apr 24, 2001
Location
USA
Once when I requested a cashout from another casino group, back when it was still common practice to credit back credit cards that were used before sending your money to your preferred cashout option......... I had a cashout go to a Visa/Debit card that was from a closed checking account from a bank I no longer banked with. I thought that was impossible, beings that bank account had been long closed. But the bank did accept the money and temporarily re-opened the account on it's own. I freaked out at first. But it wasn't such a problem afterall. After contacting the bank, I was able to go right in and they paid me the money sitting in my closed account, right then and there.

I don't think Click2pay is so easy to contact, but I'm sure the situation can be resolved once you do communicate the problem to them. I remember in the past some players contacted Click2pay by telephone.

Here's the telephone number from their website:

Any further questions? Please feel free to contact us. PHONE

US phone number 011 49 180 5 113090 INTERNATIONAL +49 180 5 113090
Charges may apply

If all you've done so far is send an email, I'd suggest calling. You can pick up a prepaid calling card at the grocery store or online, and it shouldn't be too expensive. Definitely worth a small long-distance fee if that's what it takes to collect your money. I doubt they'd prevent you from re-depositing it somewhere, once you politely explain the problem. Worth a try anyway..

Good luck..
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
Good post VWM :thumbsup:...I am still baffled though as to how any casino could pay out money winnings to a closed ewallet account, to me this would be the same as me being able to use a closed credit card account that I had to make a deposit with now...:confused:

I dont know if this is the same but you can definitely deposit into a closed credit card account. I cancelled all my credit cards with a certain bank but mistakely paid an outstanding balance to the wrong credit card account (also in my name). It was accepted without hesitation and later I had a knock on the door from debt collectors. The bank didnt even know that the positive balance covered the other account although I explained this to them in detail.

So is this the same as depositing to a closed ewallet account I wonder?
 

rivalfan

banned user: fraudulent PAB claims
Joined
Sep 7, 2008
Location
europe
Thanks maxd, but i'll wait for another response from david and if he won't to resolve this issue, then i will do this certainly.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
I dont know if this is the same but you can definitely deposit into a closed credit card account. I cancelled all my credit cards with a certain bank but mistakely paid an outstanding balance to the wrong credit card account (also in my name). It was accepted without hesitation and later I had a knock on the door from debt collectors. The bank didnt even know that the positive balance covered the other account although I explained this to them in detail.

So is this the same as depositing to a closed ewallet account I wonder?

It can be down to the receiving bank as well. Some may take the position that it is more helpful to the customer to hold the money than to bounce it back. Where the bank has a branch network, this is certainly the case, but when we have entities that exist only on the internet, and are often hard to contact, the opposite applies. Click2Pay in particular are bordering on rogue, since they are making up rules that would be ILLEGAL were any normal bank try to operate in the same manner. Mainly, changing the rules such that customers are unable to get their funds out should they wish to discontinue using the service. They started this with US players, and pretended it was forced on them because UIGEA created difficulties. Now, they prove this was all a lie by implementing the same rules for EUROPEAN customers, where UIGEA is NOT a problem. The purpose of the rule seems to be to trap players in the gambling network run between Click2Pay and casinos, never being able to get money out of this closed system until they can work their way up to the threshold of $2,200 and can withdraw.

Neteller does not have the same problem. It is easier to withdraw, they CAN be contacted easily by phone, even if they can take a while to answer, and not necessarily get it right. Although Neteller now charge 5 to withdraw, you at least CAN, and are not comitted to gambling it all away.

The JF withdrawal system is by far the most complicated I have ever seen, with it's convoluted rules that even THEY don't appear to understand and operate correctly. They have a long explanation as to how withdrawals are processed when more than one deposit method is used. It is hard to understand, but it's wrong anyway, so don't bother - they actually use a different method for allocating withdrawals, and it can mean not really knowing where your funds will end up until you receive them.

I have spoken to their CS, who revealed that their systems are even more complicated than the long explanation given. They allocate back to different deposit methods over different timescales, and they also use this to determine not just the return of past deposits, but where WINNINGS are to end up. The method the PLAYER selects is not by any means a "choice", the JF system treats it as a method of LAST RESORT should their own formula be unable to determine where a balance of winnings should be sent.

JF cannot know that a particular registered deposit method has been closed to the player unless the player tells them. The onus is on the PLAYER to do this once they have closed an account that might still be registered on the system. JF shouod then deregister the account, and should then NOT send any funds back to it, as this could make them liable should they subsequently be lost in the banking system.
 

rivalfan

banned user: fraudulent PAB claims
Joined
Sep 7, 2008
Location
europe
They're all liars, because they said:

"He said he did not deposit through Click2Pay -but in actual fact he did, that was his last deposit method before the withdrawal"

I never said, that i haven't make a deposit with click2pay, i even said, that i make a deposit with them, but directly after that, my account was closed and that's why i've made a deposit directly after it with my moneybookers account!

So how can they write, that my last deposit was made with click2pay?

And they're also very ignorant!

"We on our side fullfilled "our part of the deal" -th emoney is still in his Click2Pay account and we can't do anything about it.. He should settle his account with Click2Pay before blaming us."

Very funny!

So i can only tell you all, never play at this rogue casino, thanks!
 

maxd

Complaints (PAB) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia
Well, I warned you about continuing to post here while the PAB was in progress but since you've decided to do so we'll play it your way.

Can you tell us about your situation at Click2Pay? Are there reasons why they might not want to transfer the money back to AllSlots in order to have it re-routed to Moneybookers?

If, for instance, there was some trouble with your account at Click2Pay and _that_ was in fact the stumbling block here then it's hard to see what exactly AllSlots has done to deserve the slagging you've been giving it.
 
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