Absolute Poker is absolutely rigged. (New evidence, near certain proof its rigged).

[mussy]

New Doubts About UB

I'm not sure whether this should have a thread all of its own, but doubts are resurfacing over UB [owned, of course, by the people who own AP]. Some may recall that I posted a PocketFives piece by gank some weeks back, but had to backtrack because it became unclear how reliable it was.

Now there is a

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, and one

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. They revolve mainly around somebody called NioNio, who took a lot of money from highstakes players at UB, only to disappear apparently within days of the Absolute scandal breaking in full. He didn't just stop playing, the account was closed. It might be the employee's son mentioned in the gank piece, although it might be something else entirely. Other possibly suspicious accounts are being named, too.

None of the HH have so far looked terribly suspicious, but the win rate is extraordinary, apparently, and the sudden disappearance clearly looks odd, especially the timing of it.

Phil Hellmuth (who is associated with UB) has been quoted from chat sessions as saying that there is nothing to it, that NioNio is actually a well-known player. A lot of reputable posters view NioNio as suspicious, though.


EDIT: I should have said that some parts of gank's piece have been disputed, and I still don't know how reliable it is.

 

[SeattleSinner]

What really got to me was the line in the report on the first page second paragraph. "As a result of received complaints, the Commission initiated an investigation into AP's operations." This is totally untrue. Kahnawake was called in my AP themselves when they finally admitted the cheating. This is also laughable considering any complaint I have ever made to Kahnawake would be and has been ignored.

Unfortunately I think this just demonstrates the further need for a reputable body like the U.S. government to step into the online gaming world to regulate. If this does not happen innocent unsuspecting consumers will continue to be cheated in a known or unknown fashion.

 

[GaryWatson]

Unfortunately I think this just demonstrates the further need for a reputable body like the U.S. government to step into the online gaming world to regulate. If this does not happen innocent unsuspecting consumers will continue to be cheated in a known or unknown fashion.

I wouldnt want the US government in to regulate anything. They have little respect for international laws & this is an international issue. i think that would be a step in the wrong direction.

 

[KellyBlend]

Why not? The U.S. have already other international treaties with some Mohawks. The Mohawks have a certain right to do business like other countries, but they have to accept also international law, common business practices and ethics; and they have to improve their online gambling regulations (not only on paper - but in practise). I think they would be very interested to agree upon a gambling treaty with the U.S., even if they have to comply with severe additional requirements. We in Europe wait on something like that.

However, I see the problem more with the U.S. than with the Mohawks. The U.S. have more or less the same problem than we in Germany because the legalization of gambling falls under the heading of states rights as guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution and not under U.S. federal law. And the states want to collect taxes and to protect their own gambling business. Each state has other regulations or considerations. Therefore, Barney Franks Proposal was imho a joke which helped him to get some House votes. This is my evaluation of the U.S. scenery - from the far distance.

Online Poker is now banned in Germany. All German States signed a new common law. However, more or less the majority of German players still plays online poker. We wait and see what will happen in the near future.

According to my view the best way would be the UK approach. And I cannot understand why U.S. players are not allowed to play on a poker site with a proper EU-license. I think this will be a major discussion in the near future, too.

 

[GaryWatson]

I think any green light for the US would spell bad news for anyone outside the US. I think to allow a country like the US to have full regulatory powers would be a bad move

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I consider the UIGEA more of a ploy to steal control. I consider the UK as a more stable option & thats not because I am based in the UK. Ideally it should be an iinternational thing. Laws vary from country to country.

Our biggest issues.....

Dishonest sites.
Sites held accountable to no-one but themselves.
False & misleading terms.
Full public disclosure of ownership

I think sites should be run like banks & held accountable as such. Each participating country should have a rep to ensure their own laws are covered & a voting system in place for universal issues. Kahnawake to be scrapped for being a shell of a company. Bring in true regulators or keep it as it is, the ones in place are nothing more that a licence to print money. they are actually worse than that because they lead players into a false sense of security.

 

[same_old]

Thanks very much for your reporting on this Jetset, you have been great.

 

[KellyBlend]

It is time to let some other people speak, too. Here is a discussion on Pokerrati, were Chuck Barnett, member of the Board of Supervisors of MIT says something - not very much, but nevertheless he tried it.

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[KellyBlend]

Absorbing phrasing on Pokerrati:

Yesterday, Chuck Barnett, member of the Board of Supervisors of Mohawk Internet Technologies, told me that the delay was due to the size of the audit report and the time it took to properly analyze it. Speaking of the members of the Commission, he said, I will say that this has been at the forefront of their attention for the past month. I know that theyve taken time away from their families during the holiday season to commit themselves to this task This is a very serious situation which is being afforded the same sense of seriousness that it deserves.

The only questions that remain have to do with Absolute Poker and Mark Seif. Will they make any statements with regard to the decision?

 

[lots0]

The only questions that remain have to do with Absolute Poker and Mark Seif.

Now that is funny.

Who cares about that has been Seif?

There are a lot of important unanswered questions in this Absolute Poker cheating scandal.

 

[jetset]

I've read through that Pokerati link and frankly I don't see anything fresh and new other than the Mohawk Technologies guy pushing the KGC line we have all followed here.

Nobody answers the valid questions surrounding people allegedly involved like AJ Green and Scott Tom, or how the scam was carried through, and the legitimate questions that have been asked here at Casinomeister and elsewhere remain unanswered.

It just leaves one feeling frustrated that the full story is clearly not going to be divulged by either AP, KGC, GA or....eventually if these current allegations amount to anything, UB.

 

[GaryWatson]

What I would like to have seen is logs of each and every grandfathered account over that period & all of the accounts considered involved.

Full details passed over to a real authority with legal powers. Im sure there is more than enough to make a case.

I would like to know where the serurity team were playing at the time, if it was their day off or they were just browsing porn.

I would like a follow up on why it took a delay on blocking the accounts after it became public knowledge.

I would like a reason why AP initially denied any wrongdoing only to reverse the decision when they were left with little choice.

I would like to know why a multi million dollar fraud has been met with a mere $500k fine and no further action taken.

I would like to know why AP/UB are still live and allowed to process financial transactions.

I would like to know why credit card companies have not withdrawn their support to the site.

I have a few other questions but that's a start.

 

[lots0]

This is part of a post I just did in another thread.

AP must have hired some political advisor's, because they are using political tricks and gimmicks for damage control.

* KGC Releases the report on a Friday evening. - All politicos know you release bad news on a Friday evening, No one watches Friday evening news and by Monday morning some other bit of news is all the rage at the water cooler.

* Admit what everyone knows anyway. - Politicos know that you can't deny something after it has already been admitted, so you admit it again and then say in a very ambiguous way that all the other problems have been 'addressed'.

* Don't admit or acknowledge anything other than what has already been previously released to the public.

* Spread around a lot of money to the 'friendly' press (in this case outfits like gambling911 and CAP)

* Get your spokespeople and shills to start the misinformation campaign. - This should start in earnest today. (in fact it looks to have already started...)


All in all a Absolute Poker is doing a very political job of handling an issue they don't want the public to know about or get upset over.

The fact Absolute Poker is handling things this way is just more evidence that Absolute Poker are as dirty as I thought they were... and it don't get any dirtier than that.

 

[GaryWatson]

Here's a funny statement

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[GaryWatson]

Question to Pokeraddict.

Now as you were at AP during their early days, do you not think it is conceivable that the cheating has been going on from day one? Im sure an experienced player would have been less obvious. Now it could either have been a sign of them getting smug & feeling untouchable about the scamming, total greed or it could be that they passed the account over to a play money level player. KGC, has shown that AP can do what they want. They look as corrupt as AP in this matter.

Maybe AP didnt see the point in investing the time in taking $1000 dollars an hour. Maybe they started using more accounts and started getting sloppy. Its fine to iscolate the high stakes, but theres no reason why this hasnt been tested right through the chain.

 

[KellyBlend]

.... do you not think it is conceivable that the cheating has been going on from day one?

I think we could draw further conclusions like in a buzzle if we exactly knew with which trick or software the cheaters have worked. If they used old client software then I think we could recombine some facts. This is a task for inspector Columbo and no task for an auditor.

 

[pokeraddict]

I have two of the accounts exposed in my PT from the early days. One was a huge winner in 10/20 and 15/30, the other was a small loser. What always struck me as odd in those early days was I could beat 5/10 for 2-3 bb/100 in some tough games. The 10/20 games appeared to have much more action but I would get raped in them. We're talking 15-20bb/100 losing sesions one after another after another. My prop managers thought I was crazy. Many other props had the same experiences on a bigger extreme. The trouble is that we don't have the massive smoking guns like an email of the master hh's etc. As a matter of fact as we found out AP destroyed the hh's from all games more then 2 months out. This always made me wonder.

I guess the answer is many of the old props have varying degrees of suspicions but none of us can really prove it.

 

[KellyBlend]

All these speculations stay sticky. A reliable company would publish more ore less all important facts and in case of cheating like in this case, such a company would also contact the district attorney. Guess why they do nothing or not more?

 

[jetset]

60 Minutes program on Absolute Poker debacle?

ANOTHER 60 MINUTES SHOW ON INTERNET GAMBLING IN PROSPECT

Popular investigative television program asking questions regarding the Absolute Poker scandal

Top online poker bloggers, posters and writers are predicting that the popular US television investigative program "60 Minutes" could be about to launch an expose on the Absolute Poker cheating scandal (see previous InfoPowa reports). The program, which has a viewership in the millions, has previously covered online gambling in 2001, 2005 and 2006...and not always in the most positive terms.

Top blogger and 2+2 contributor Nat Arem, who made a major contribution in investigating and exposing the Absolute Poker.com affair which resulted in the company paying a $500 000 fine to the Kahnawake Ga,ming Commission that regulates the company, wrote on his blog Nat Arem.com that he has known about the new story for some weeks but had respected the confidentiality requested by the 60 Minutes producer. However, as several other poker information websites had picked up on approaches to industry personalities made by the producers, he would reveal what he knew.

"A few weeks ago, I was contacted by 60 Minutes in conjunction with a reporter from the Washington Post regarding a story about the Absolute Poker scandal from last fall," Arem wrote. "I was told that they wanted Adanthar (another 2+2 investigator) and myself for on-camera interviews with Steve Kroft. I later found out they were also interested in interviewing Michael Josem and Marco Johnson.

"Basically, I spent a little while on the phone with the producer and the Washington Post reporter and recapped the whole story as well as I could from memory. I talked about my involvement and contribution, along with all the other people who were involved.

"After that conversation, I found out that 60 Minutes plans on going to a number of different locations. Ive heard that Canada, Costa Rica and Las Vegas are all possible travel locations. I may or may not be meeting up with 60 Minutes in Costa Rica, if and when they come down. Theres also the possibility that I will end up on-camera in Atlanta.

"In terms of agenda, Ive been told that the goal is to tell the story from soup to nuts. I dont really know if that means a negative agenda for online poker, but I get the feeling that it might.

"That means that this story is unlikely to be a good thing for online poker on the whole. I wish that programs like 60 Minutes would always tell the whole story (ie, get PokerStars involved, explain why some sites are secure and clean, etc), but I cant really be sure that will happen.

"If I do end up on-camera, I will be sure to explain that this scandal was online pokers Enron ie, the biggest and worst scandal in the history of the industry. It is not a commonplace occurrence and people should not take it as such.

In terms of the certainty that this will get on the air Im not sure. Ive been told that its definitely happening. But, considering that it has not been shot yet, anything is possible. And if it does end up on the air, I have no idea when that will be or what the 60 Minutes airing schedule looks like."

Several other poker writers have been approached by 60 Minutes, Tom Somach reported, observing that with another online poker cheating scandal breaking this time the allegations against Absolute sister poker website Ultimate Bet its a sure bet the 60 Minutes piece wont just address the Absolute Poker situation. Infopowa has covered the Ultimate Bet story, which appears to have gone very quiet in recent weeks.

The story about the Absolute Poker debacle, initially denied and then confirmed as an "insider issue" involving a "consultant" alleged by other sources to be one Alan John Grimaud, a Canadian citizen who disappeared from public view in the wake of the issue, is likely to make fascinating television.

It has all the elements for a penetrating expose; big money, high technology, Internet gambling, mysterious figures in the background, unresolved questions and some expert detective work by the poker-playing community.