A MG promo-run tail

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steinhaug

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Feb 21, 2006
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For those who knows already knows me, I am a gambling addict and a firm beliver online casinos are rigged. Anyway, I convinced my girlfriend to have some fun and have a promo run on her behalf, not for winning really since I know that's impossible, but rather have some fun for a cheap buck.

So I went for all the play an hour for $500 free money bonuses! Depositing 20 and get another 250 in bonus money are always a good fun, and much cheaper than going to the pub anyways.

So the point of the game, manage to win 250 above the initial 500, ending at a balance of +750 after a minimum og 100 bets. It all sounds easy, but I went through 6 casinos before accually getting a profit. The 7th casino I managed to get 750, yeha! (That would be +3000 in losses to win 250 by the way).

I have told her all about my views on this, so I prepared her for my procog capabilities in predicting the gameplay...

Starting with Prime Property the 5 first spins revaled 2x 3 scatters! This is in my head a sign of the times, so I told her - hey, this is good! Normally I would do 20x0.01 and 10x0.40, however the scatters is a very good sign so we seem to be in a good moode. I upped to 40 lines at once and got freespins in the next few spins, and ended up with 36 freespins x4 multiplier. During freespins get 5 ladies, so final win was around a whopping 100! Great! I was overly excitet as this never happened before, then going for Isis and freespins on 0.45 in the first 5 spins! Not to bad a 50 win.

I now predict a winning cycle and want to let my girfriend pick any game to win, which we do! We stay a while at Big Break getting far to many freespins, I belive it was 7 times in 50 spins or so.

We started with 20 deposit + 250 bonus, and whatever playing increased steadily up to 750 at the max (the 7 freespins on Big Break made the balance from around 600 to 750, at 3 wager all spins). I felt aftet this that my precog skills was at place, and was pretty sure that now it all goes!

I remember at some time, checking the cashout, I was able to cashout 460 at the most, but didn't want to do that since I would then loose around 250 in bonus money.

We continued playing, now decreasing the betsize to around 1 and 1.5, even down to minimum as 0.20 for 20 liners since all the slots (like in all just won, now all just loose) started loosing. I was expecting this since the previous win cycle was very "in your face".

We stopped at 500, only to experience we could now cash out $240...

Today we continued, and what a play! I was infact shocked to see the games eating away. Not on my behalf, since I personally don't give a crap anymore on this, but for my girlsfriends sake which could become a customer - MG surely made her hate the game and share my opinion.

We were playing many games (I have logs if you want, playcheck is your friend). Doing many spins on 0.20, even 0.01 to see (I always check if I miss any, but didn't). I was shocked to see that the system just ate away, the best win was a 20x bet win.

When we were down to 10, Tomb Raider finally gave the last wheel and after loosing 150 (well, infact we went in total from 750) we got a whopping 38! At this point I had no more interest in the game and went for 13 spins at 3 on cashapiller to quit the game.

I will also add, when starting the 500 downplay today I started with a little "crazy blackjack", low wagers, but by crazy I mean OMG the dealer cards! Maby BJ is a nice precursor for what the system have in store for you!

To make it better, we tried 2 other casinoes last week aswell. 100% match deposit, $50 deposits $100 in total bank. I made both casinoes up to around $300, where after this both casinoes identically as today went into a "impossible to win". All slots seems to enjoy a %55-%65 payout when they want the money back.

So that means, 3 out of 3 casinoes I doubled the money and more! The last casino I could infact have cashed out a profit aswell, however my intention was more to "prove my idea" - which for some anoying reason stands!

So there you have it, my new way of gambling!

I find it truly impressive that I can convince the people I share a new account with in less than a few hours that the gameplay doesn't add up, it's predetermined, not random (seems random to fit the stats).

Anyway, just wanted to share my thoughts since I believe the meister accepts also thoughts like this!

Kim signing out!
Peace and love!
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
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Location
United Kingdom
You should use your predictive skills to better use. Maybe use them to take MG to the cleaners on SLOTS, and they would have to keep paying or else ADMIT that you were "banned" because you could PREDICT the outcome of a session from how the scatters fell on the first few spins.

Their argument seems to be that eventually such a relationship breaks down since the system is actually random, and that such predictions can be explained by chance alone.

Many have similar theories, and we have even got as far as cracking the reels of many MG slots, but so far no "smoking gun" has been found. MG know that they are under such analysis though, and would take great care not to do anything that would be seen as "rigging the games".

MG DO in fact have a few NON RANDOM games, but these are described as "shite". This is because although non random, they are not exploitable.

The most obvious is the AWP offering "Treasure Ireland" where it soon becomes clear that progress on the feature trail is strongly related to the current RTP the player has experienced since starting to play the game.

When you first play on a new account, I predict your first feature round will be a 6 or 12 followed by a lose or "continue - no". Brief, and to the point. As you pump more money in, you will get further in the feature before hitting "lose". Collect a big paying feature, and although you might still find the game "lively", your next feature will losr very quickly indeed, showing that the prior big payout has "killed" the game in terms of how far you can get on the feature. Overall, this meets the RTP, but is most certainly NOT random!
 

Alexishot69

Banned User
Joined
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Location
Edinburgh
Along those lines

Bored the other night i decided to play a few casinos offering ND bonus ALL rival casino software offering between $7 and $20 paradise8 , cocoa, mayan and superior.Every single ND bonus won upto $70-80 excepot cocoa i got that up to over $290.When you first start u just cannot and i mean cannot lose no matter what you do i even on cocoa put 2x $1 on roulette which came up 3x in 5 spins on slots i got bonus round after bonus round.Now forgive me if im wrong but this is not a random thing this is merely to entice the player in with he/she thinking gee this is too easy but the secong you start playing with your won /$ you know its gonna be oh so different..
 

steinhaug

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
Norway
Collect a big paying feature, and although you might still find the game "lively", your next feature will losr very quickly indeed, showing that the prior big payout has "killed" the game in terms of how far you can get on the feature. Overall, this meets the RTP, but is most certainly NOT random!

With your own words, you state the obvious. There is a weighting going on, to balance the overall 95% payout. When you are down the wins are skewed and features - especially easy to detect in picking games - gives strangely big wins (also often in pairs, two great wins, also when winning you can play what game you like you will win anyways during a streak)! After your overall payout is ajusted your gameplay will suck, no wins on paylines and features will not give any good wins at all. It's all about stuffing the right amount of dollars back into a losing streak, and you will win, choose your game and get a great win there! It's bollocks - and when you are aware of it it really becomes stupid.

We can argue this to the end of days, the playcheck data doesn't lie - so does not 12 years of gaming experience!

Also, prooving this with the data - what's in it for me? I already talked to people in the business, and the BJ is easy! It's impossible to deliver a random BJ experience since it's to easy to cheat for the user by counting cards, meaning... They can't deliver it! So there you have it! We are screwed - we knew it all the time - but being gambling addicts we want to belive it's all fine!

Hope to get over to Britain in near future, I would love to sit down over some beers with you gyes. I belive it could be very interesting!
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
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Location
Pennsylvania
since it's to easy to cheat for the user by counting cards,

Can you please explain how counting cards online would even work? The deck(s) are "reshuffled" after every hand, which means that counting is impossible. You could get the exact same hand, down to the same suits, as the hand right before it. Basically, you're playing against an infinite shoe.

I'm not saying online BJ is or isn't random; just noting that counting cards doesn't even come into play.
 

steinhaug

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
Norway
Can you please explain how counting cards online would even work? The deck(s) are "reshuffled" after every hand, which means that counting is impossible. You could get the exact same hand, down to the same suits, as the hand right before it. Basically, you're playing against an infinite shoe.

I'm not saying online BJ is or isn't random; just noting that counting cards doesn't even come into play.

I almost feel insulted with such remarks Winbig! You obviously know about cheating in live casinoes also referred to as counting cards, there have also been movies about counting cards and cracking BJ. We know some MIT-students made a forytune on this, there are several ways. There is a reason why card counting is illegal in a casino. I see no reason in explaining this any further since you can get this information on your own, this is basic blackjack information!
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
Pennsylvania
I almost feel insulted with such remarks Winbig! You obviously know about cheating in live casinoes also referred to as counting cards, there have also been movies about counting cards and cracking BJ. We know some MIT-students made a forytune on this, there are several ways. There is a reason why card counting is illegal in a casino. I see no reason in explaining this any further since you can get this information on your own, this is basic blackjack information!

Did you even read my post? I know you're dead set on trying to prove that online casinos cheat, but at least READ what's being said before you jump off the handle.

Can you please explain how counting cards online would even work?

I quite specifically said ONLINE a number of times in my post. I guess you're so blinded with your own agenda that you just ignored that.

I'm also insulted, due to the fact that I've been playing BJ online and off for 15 years, and it's painfully obvious to me that of course you can make some good money by counting cards OFFline.

And of course I know about the MIT team (There were several, even before this one.) I even took time to read the BOOK"Link Removed (invalid URL)" which was published in 2002; a good 6 years before the movie "21" was even thought of.
 

steinhaug

Senior Member
Joined
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Location
Norway
The deck(s) are "reshuffled" after every hand

What you are doing are giving the casino an excuse in every corner, and they are not reshuffled just look at the results of the gameplay by increasing bets and such. Results are skewed in winning streaks and loosing streaks depending on your overall global payout.

Also - I have spoken with people investing in casino software stating in plain words to me over some beers "It's impossible to deliver a fair game of BJ (meaning that the casino is supposed to win on this)".

The system is flawed - and any sain person already knows it. Some have problems believing it, however its already staring you in the face!
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
Pennsylvania
What you are doing are giving the casino an excuse in every corner, and they are not reshuffled just look at the results of the gameplay by increasing bets and such. Results are skewed in winning streaks and loosing streaks depending on your overall global payout.

Also - I have spoken with people investing in casino software stating in plain words to me over some beers "It's impossible to deliver a fair game of BJ (meaning that the casino is supposed to win on this)".

The system is flawed - and any sain person already knows it. Some have problems believing it, however its already staring you in the face!

Dude, get over yourself already. I simply made a point, and this point is:

THERE IS NO WAY TO COUNT CARDS ONLINE. EVEN IF YOU DID IT DOESN'T HELP YOU ANY.

Next time, read (and understand) my *#&$#@[email protected]#$ POSTS before you go off on a tangent.

And of course "the casino is supposed to win on this." They are on ANY game. That's why you'll rarely see a game that has a positive EV.....you're better off playing VP with a great paytable for this reason.
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
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Location
Pennsylvania
And this comment is for not just you, but for anyone else that thinks online casinos are rigged:

QUIT GAMBLING ONLINE - And if you do, quit bitching about it.
 

steinhaug

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
Norway
So who do I believe? People involved with the programming part of the industry or you?

Call me stupid, I don't really care! Namecalling really don't help any of us either since it has nothing to do with what we are really talking about!

You doom the online BJ fair because it is impossible to count cards, online!

As this is your one and only point, you put all your reasoning on this fact. A facy which is impossible to proove since we are working with proprietary software nobody wil ever see - I have lost before I have a chance in prooving anything.

Making a none random sequenze look random is very easy! Skewing a random sequence a tiny bit, it's still random. But...

I could deliver you statistical data of cards, spins, balls, however crazy the cards or spins are dealt it will always be a possible result due to chaos theory. I am just a very unlucky player as we heard earlier inquieries resulted in. I am not just unlucky, I am a very unlucky player. This is the same reasoning every time, and we seem to give the casino the upper hand all the time at all audits.

So I have a lost cause here, and have nothing to offer your argument.
 

steinhaug

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
Norway
And this comment is for not just you, but for anyone else that thinks online casinos are rigged:

QUIT GAMBLING ONLINE - And if you do, quit bitching about it.

Oh I did - but I still play for fun, but as mentioned I play with my precog skills to amuse my friends! Which I also do - and each time i do - I get more pissed at why not eveybody else sees what we are seeing when playing! It's the same pattern emerging over and over again!

So yes, I quit gambling online - now I only play for fun - and take note on how the gameplay works out, download playcheck data as backup in case I meet people who tell me "that is not true".

I could also tell you Irak had weapons of mass destruction, ironically still some people belive this!
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
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Oh I did - but I still play for fun, but as mentioned I play with my precog skills to amuse my friends! Which I also do - and each time i do - I get more pissed at why not eveybody else sees what we are seeing when playing! It's the same pattern emerging over and over again!

So yes, I quit gambling online - now I only play for fun - and take note on how the gameplay works out, download playcheck data as backup in case I meet people who tell me "that is not true".

I could also tell you Irak had weapons of mass destruction, ironically still some people belive this!

Again, DID YOU READ MY POSTS?

I never once ******* said any damned thing about online casinos not cheating (ie: Rigged.) I was simply stating THAT IT DOES NO GOOD FOR A PLAYER TO COUNT CARDS ONLINE. IT IS POINTLESS BECAUSE THEY USE AN INFINITE SHOE.

For you to even mouth off about the WMD bullshit is just plain insulting, and I'm tired of it. Yet another person to go on my ignore list.

AND NOT ONCE DID I EVER ***********SAY THAT ONLINE BLACKJACK IS FAIR BECAUSE YOU CAN'T COUNT CARDS. WHERE IS THE ************ RELEVANCE IN THAT?


edit: I've reported myself, and hopefully this thread is going to be shut down. I'm getting sick of your insults.

Oh, btw, it's iraQ not iraK
 
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steinhaug

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
Norway
Well you jumped into the argument with a deal-breaker, it's impossible to proove. Why you and me are arguing I do not understand either, it doesn't help anybody and especially not my initial post! You just threw it off with your comment, and then you attack me for not responding to your impossible problem/quest/competition!

If you for some reason have a problem with me so be it, I do not have a problem with you!

Peace and love!
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
Pennsylvania
Well you jumped into the argument with a deal-breaker, it's impossible to proove. Why you and me are arguing I do not understand either, it doesn't help anybody and especially not my initial post! You just threw it off with your comment, and then you attack me for not responding to your impossible problem/quest/competition!

If you for some reason have a problem with me so be it, I do not have a problem with you!

Peace and love!

What the **** man. Lay off the pipe already.

This is my initial post:

Can you please explain how counting cards online would even work? The deck(s) are "reshuffled" after every hand, which means that counting is impossible. You could get the exact same hand, down to the same suits, as the hand right before it. Basically, you're playing against an infinite shoe.

I'm not saying online BJ is or isn't random; just noting that counting cards doesn't even come into play.

Where in the hell do you see ANYTHING that suggests that I'm taking any sides in the matter? I only made one small point about this whole thing, and you have to go off and insult my intelligence.
 

steinhaug

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
Norway
Well obviously I am doing my classical mistake and assuming this is more of a "total" thread and all past threads are taken into account when we are talking. This is not the first time we are talking in this forum, theese are not new thoughts but an old ball where I do not see any reason in repeating myself.

I must appologise if I offended you, that was not my intetion. However you should know me by now, using capital letters and name calling doesn't really help the argument as I easily get critical myself just as you do. But we are fueling a lost cause here - we (that means me aswell) should be more civilized.

I cannot roll over and die just because your small point is impossible to proove. It's just like saying 1+1=2, I know that to be a fact! Problem here is that online gambling RNG's will survive an audit, ususally ending up in the player having an extremely bad luck.

Then again, sorry for insulting you or making you angry, I just didn't find your comment helping out in any way.
 

winbig

Keep winning this amount.
Joined
Mar 10, 2005
Location
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Well excuse me for trying to correct your mistaken points. You said right-out that one of the reasons that ONLINE casinos cheat is because players count cards; which is totally ridiculous.
 

steinhaug

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
Norway
Well excuse me for trying to correct your mistaken points. You said right-out that one of the reasons that ONLINE casinos cheat is because players count cards; which is totally ridiculous.

This is true, which is what I was told by people in the industry. maby my reasoning is flawed here, "It's impossible to deliver a fair BJ experience" - I do not know how otherwise to interpret this looking from the stock-holders perspective unless counting cards. Are there any other way of beating the BJ game? For some reason an online-casino-software cannot deliver a real random gameplay as it's to easy to exploit, atleast from a programming perspective.

I would have to talk more in detail with theese people for more info regarding the topic, however I have much more interest in the statistical data from slot spins than BJ which is so in your face looking at bank roll and overall payout%.

Anyhow, time to get back to work as we are on a stand still here!
 
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