"888 has opened you an account..."

[vinylweatherman]

IMO this is pretty serious stuff for many reasons, not the least of which is the HUGE margin for error that could seriously and adversely affect players. Casino assurances are well and good but it's the player who will have to dig themselves out of the hole when something goes wrong. In any case given the Accred status of the casino this is definitely something Bryan needs to be aware of so I've have flagged him on Rachel's recent post. AFAIC this issue isn't done until his position on this is known.

I understood Rachel's post to be an indication that management won't budge on the issue, and will continue to create accounts for players as a means to offer them additional bonuses. The additional comment that management disagree with the points raised is even more worrying, because it isn't just conjecture on our part, but is based on actual issues that players have suffered as a direct consequence of taking up some of the cross marketing offers sent to them by means of a personal invite to open an account at a "sister site" and claim the bonus outlined in the email. I fail to see how taking up the offer when it requires the account to be created by the player should be any less safe than when the account is pre-created by 888.com so that the player simply has to log in.
A further possible complication is that the pre-created account does not allow the player to input their personal details, so if the information used to create the original account is out of date, this will be propagated to the new account. A problem will then occur should the player create their own account at a third casino running Cassava software with up to date information that does not match the other two accounts.

Given that the system has even created more than one account on the same skin for an individual player does NOT inspire much confidence in any assertions from the casino that players will not have problems because they used one of their pre-created accounts. It suggests their records are in a mess, and in addition to this issue, this records-in-a-mess problem could also be responsible for innocent players getting accused of abuse or fraud.

 

[maxd]

... innocent players getting accused of abuse or fraud.

Exactly my primary cause for concern. It's like they've dug deep holes in the paddock, removed all the signage, blind-folded the players and called out "easter egg hunt!": what could possibly go wrong?

 

[Casinomeister]

Admin Note: Totally uncool tactics

...
With regards to the claims concerning multi accounting and various white labels, I would like to make it clear that we do not agree with the comments raised, and it is not a conflict of interest. The creation of these accounts is essentially a bonus offer. We are creating these accounts to provide our members with the ease of entering their new account and readily accessing any bonus that they are entitled to. It is very different to the situation whereby a single member opens multiple accounts – in the same brand, or across various websites we operate - in order to maximize the amount of bonuses they receive. There is a different intent. One is the member going against our bonus policy, and the other is us, “the company”, offering our members a cross sell bonus. This is in line with our Terms and Conditions where we state that the members can have an account in each brand that we operate.
Overall, we see that there are benefits to the members from these campaigns, and as our main goal is to provide entertainment to our clients we see this as a more than legitimate offer.

Like I mentioned several times, this cross promotion is a bad idea - I've stated this all along. It's problematic and it's a minefield. Your bosses may not agree with me, or with the members of Casinomeister (both player and affiliates) who have raised their concerns here, but they need to wake up and listen.

The bottom line is that 888 is not doing players any favors. How is confusing everyone a favor? These promos also seep with bad ad-copy and greed. For example the ad-copy on one of the promotions "A winner never stops spinning." Who was the Einstein that came up with that gem? A "winner" knows when to stop spinning since the odds are, and always have been in, the favor of the house.

This whole cross promotion is unnecessary, but your bosses don't and possibly never will "get it." It may be good for the casino's bottom line, but it is certainly not user friendly.

Sorry, but I can't have Accredited Casinos using these tactics.

I'm also concerned about this marketing strategy for another reason: - I received one of the 888 promos "Now or Never" 3 Top Games in 3 Top Casinos:
Casino-on-net
ReefClub
Euro-City (??)

I have an account at 888.com. What's Euro City have to do with 888? Euro City is a Rushmore property - and if Rushmore was in the Rogue pit - you'd be promoting a rogue to me. Lucky for you they aren't. But they were removed from the Accredited Casino list over a year ago for being dicked up - and 888 is promoting this casino to players that have signed up via Casinomeister.

Do you see why this is a problem? I certainly do. And I'm willing to bet that the affiliates who brought you players are not getting the credit for players you are sending to Euro City.

That is totally uncool. And that is a conflict of interest - mine.

888.com has been removed from the Accredited list.

 

[chuchu59]

Did 888 for a second think they can post such nonsense and get away with it? This is starting to become a worrying trend. To varying degrees accredited casinos are making up excuses for not paying, confiscation of comps and slapping hefty processing fees on to the players. 888, Gowild, CWC and JC seem to care less about their accreditation status and focus on shortsighted tactics to rip off players. The excuses they give would make a 3-year old blush.

 

[Mousey]

Exactly my primary cause for concern. It's like they've dug deep holes in the paddock, removed all the signage, blind-folded the players and called out "easter egg hunt!": what could possibly go wrong?

Thanks to Bryan for removing 888 from the accredited list.

I am of the very firm opinion that white label casinos are evil. I am only a player, but I've been hanging around here reading for years and I still do not understand precisely how a white label casinos work. They are only problems waiting to happen.

What 888 is doing (opening up accounts for players, cross promoting willy nilly) is very thoughtless, and in the end, players will get burned.

 

[rainmaker]

.

I think you did the right decision here Casinomeister

As for Euro City. I think this is a in-house brand together with for example Reef Club and Casino-On-Net. They are definitely a Cassava operated casino, but a bit unsure if they are in-house or not.

 

[Pinababy69]

I am of the very firm opinion that white label casinos are evil. I am only a player, but I've been hanging around here reading for years and I still do not understand precisely how a white label casinos work. They are only problems waiting to happen.

Ditto here Mousey. Remember that thread a few years back re: the Playshare Group (MG) and all their white labels? And how we banged on about it incessantly. This is EXACTLY the type of thing we were all worried about back then. Am very glad to see that MG decided not to go down this route after all, at least not to the extent originally planned.

Wise move Bryan, IMO.

 

[Casinomeister]

...
As for Euro City. I think this is a in-house brand together with for example Reef Club and Casino-On-Net. They are definitely a Cassava operated casino, but a bit unsure if they are in-house or not.

You're right, but they are being promoted by C-Planet affiliates:

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[Petrer10]

thats ok

that's ok. 888 is not fair.
But when will it finally inet bet away from the accredited section?

 

[rainmaker]

that's ok. 888 is not fair.
But when will it finally inet bet away from the accredited section?

I am not a moderator on this forum. But I started this thread, and this thread is about 888 and not iNetBet.

From the forum rules (you should read them here):

1.15 - Do not hijack threads. If you have something to say - say it, but please respect the other members by keeping threads "on track". If you have an issue that needs addressing, then please start another thread. Hijacking threads for your own agenda is not only rude, it is troll-like and can lead to a suspension.

 

[Jasminebed]

I've never played with 888, although I did open an account. I had thought I'd be receiving a free chip, but it was a communication error and I was not entitled. I felt it was the casino that was not communicating that clearly, but I wasn't entitled.

They opened no additional accounts for me.

But I thought to offer their players additional bonuses was hooey as a reason. You want to offer me more bonuses, or entice me back to play, then send me an email offer to my existing account.

I wouldn't be willing to be certain, although I'm sure Rachel did her best to clarify the Casino's position, that an affiliate's explanation would be upheld, or that at the least an account would be "flagged" or "confiscated", even if it was cleared eventually.

I heartily agree with Casinomeister's decision to remove them from the accredited list.

 

[DiamondGeezer]

A sensible decision in the circumstances. I don't see how there could have been any other conclusion.

I myself am up to about four accounts now, they just keep on generating. Quite bizarre.

It's well known 888 have been on the sales block for some time, having been linked with a number of companies in recent times. And the number of player accounts and affiliate liabilities will be a big part of any bid offer calculations. Guess we'll have to draw our own conclusions...

 

[rainmaker]

...............

It's well known 888 have been on the sales block for some time, having been linked with a number of companies in recent times. And the number of player accounts and affiliate liabilities will be a big part of any bid offer calculations. Guess we'll have to draw our own conclusions...

Yes, you have a point here.

888 usually reports about how many real money accounts that has been opened. Their latest report (third quarter 2011) said :

-As at 30 September 2011, 888 had 10.1 million Casino, Poker and Sport real money registered customer accounts, representing an increase of 24% since 30 September 2010

You know that 888 "only" has a market cap of about £120 M. So 10,1 million accounts sounds very very high when we know that for example Unibet (much higher market value than 888) reports that they have 5,7 million customers.

The difference is probably that 888 includes every single account while a company like Unibet will count the number of customers rather than accounts.

So yes, the number of reported real money accounts from 888 in their reports may be misleading.

 

[lewisnadasurf]

Rachel appears to have gone very quiet.

Any thoughts on losing your accredited status?

It seems as though you don't have to do much to be put back onto the accredited section, i mean you appear to payout on time/dont annoy too many regular customers etc. Just maybe need to stop being so sneaky about things!

Why cant people use the same account across the whole board and get monthly bonuses? Why on earth would you need to open NEW accounts? Seems like a waste of time, confusing and very unnecessary.

 

[Fortuna]

OK, here is what I think:

1. New Bonuses invites for Existing accounts (even if dormant accounts) can be very well offered via account registered email address.

2. Under NO circumstances they shall be allowed to open new accounts at sister casinos within the group because of some (affiliate) issues:

- first one is the suspicion that the original affiliate will not keep taking commissions for player deposits at sister casino account (valid or not)

- second one, me as the player, I may very well CHOOSE to use DIFFERENT AFFILIATES at each of my casino accounts within Cassava Group

* Note: if on the other hand, Cassava will be sending email invites for taking new bonuses asking its existing players to open new (multiple) accounts, how they will know what separates abusers from honest players ? How they will accurately know which players were sent invites ?

** And on the same line, how a honest player will be able to accurately know what constates in rogue affiliate spam mail invites and real legit Cassava invites ?

 

[Seventh777]

Interesting that this thread has been necroed, and I quote......

Hi Guys,

As promised I brought up the issue, and we have resolved it

I also noticed that people had assumed that we would block players who didn't know that they had this account created if they created one on their own. That is NOT the case at all, we are not evil and not trying to trap people. Of course the accounts that had been created had been tagged as ones that had been created internally.

In regards to receiving welcome bonuses across our brands, if we have invited you to take part in a welcome bonus then we will NOT block you for taking us up on this offer. If someone has felt that they have been wrongfully blocked this is something that we deal with on a case by case issue.

[highlight]The promotion that started this thread has been stopped, and we are launching another one that will give our 888 players the option to create a Casino On Net account using their existing 888 details.[/highlight] This will be done with the complete consent of the player, it is a way to make life easier for our players. So the account will not be created until the player has authorized it, the mechanism is linked to the link in the email that is being sent out, if it is not activated within 24 hours then the offer will be shut down.

I hope that this has settled the issue.

You ask and we listen, we are not out to get people and like I said we have changed our ways.

Regards,
Rachel

You may want to redefine what listening entails.........

 

[Seventh777]

Rachel appears to have gone very quiet.

Any thoughts on losing your accredited status?

It seems as though you don't have to do much to be put back onto the accredited section, i mean you appear to payout on time/dont annoy too many regular customers etc. Just maybe need to stop being so sneaky about things!

Why cant people use the same account across the whole board and get monthly bonuses? Why on earth would you need to open NEW accounts? Seems like a waste of time, confusing and very unnecessary.

Out of sight out of mind, they are resorting to exactly the same behaviour as to what induced this thread in the 1st place, let `em burn imho.