Online Casinos - Casinomeister Logo
Likes Likes:  0
Page 1 of 10 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 97

Thread: Slotland Fraudulent "Video Poker" Games

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    181
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 46 Times in 20 Posts
    Rep Power
    55
    Reputation Points: 264

    Slotland Fraudulent "Video Poker" Games

    I noticed Slotland listed on Casinomeister's Reputable Casino list and thought Id give them a try.

    I deposited $100 and played some Jacks or Better video poker. About halfway through losing my initial deposit and bonus, I was dealt four to a Royal flush (I missed, hit a pair of Kings).

    About that time is when I noticed that the progressive jackpot for a Royal was very big -- over $61,000 for a $10 bet. Surprised, I first e-mailed support to verify that was a dollar amount, not a credit amount.

    Then I ran a few numbers, and got excited to see that the long-term expected payoff was well over 100% due to the size of the jackpot.

    I switched to their 3-line double-joker variant (WildHeart) at $15 per bet which offered even better odds vs. the jackpot (despite a worse pay table) because each maximum line bet is only $5. I even e-mailed support to make sure that I was correct that the jackpot was paid off if it hit on any of the 3 lines, which they verified.

    Then I went to work betting before somebody else snagged the jackpot. I figured it was a once-in-years opportunity at a nice progressive. I hadn't seen a progressive video poker jackpot as good since one in Reno over 10 years ago.

    I knew it wasn't likely I'd hit, but I'd be getting a fair shot at a big score.

    Or so I thought.

    About $1500 later I started wondering if I was just having a really bad run (having never hit any significant win along the way) and started doing some more investigating.

    Yes I should have investigated them further first, but I was confident in Casinomeister's recommendation, never having had a problem in the past with any casino he's recommended.

    On a Google search I happened to find this little tidbit mentioned somewhere else, subsequently verified on Slotland's web site... waaaaay down in the fine print, and located under the "Technical Tips" section along with other important (haha) information like "What browser should I use" I found this gem (emphasis mine):

    "Our games have been designed by software experts to perform just like its counterparts in land-based casinos. The random number generator used in SLOTLAND's proprietary software has been tested and found to conform with the results of similar games found in Atlantic City with respect to randomness and payout frequency. For your protection, all wagers at SLOTLAND are recorded and there is a complete audit trail available on all games that are played."

    "Please note that all games share the same mechanism which determines the jackpot win. Thus, with card games, the probability of hitting the jackpot combination is not natural but controlled by this shared random mechanism in the same way as slot machines' wins."

    What?? WHAATT??? How do these two paragraphs reconcile with each other?

    In EVERY OTHER INSTANCE that I have seen a video poker game, the odds are the same as from a REAL CARD DECK. That is certainly the case in Atlantic City, which Slotland compares itself to in the same breath.

    Even worse, earlier in the FAQs, Slotland touts their Jacks or Better game as follows (again emphasis is mine):

    "You may try your luck at the Jacks Or Better, the classic video poker game. Our pay table for this game is the highest and most generous in the industry; you do not need to place a maximum bet to get a bonus pay out on the Royal Flush (although a maximum bet with a Royal Flush WILL win the jackpot!)."

    Their pay table is the highest and most generous?? Well, yes, it is a good pay table... full pay Jacks or Better. But what good is a pay table if it's not paid with the correct frequency??

    The entire concept doesn't even make sense to me. How do I as a player know how to correctly play their video poker? Should I break up my pat flush to draw 1 card to a royal flush? In a real video poker game, without question I should. But in an artificial game, who knows?


    And even worser than worse... take a look at their Jacks or Better play screen, including the pay tables. This is the screen where the player sticks his money in.

    Click here: Slotland Jacks Or Better

    Note that there is NO mention on the pay table of the jackpot being artificially controlled.

    And in fact note the following words to the contrary:

    "THE CLASSIC VIDEO POKER GAME.
    SLOTLAND casino proudly presents the Jacks Or Better, the most popular video poker game ever."

    ... and...

    "Our payout and odds are comparable to the top slot machines found in Las Vegas and conform to the Nevada Gaming Rules. "


    Now, I ask you... given that it looks like a standard video poker game, and in fact has language right on that page claiming that it is, shouldn't a reasonable person expect this to act like a Jacks or Better game as found EVERYWHERE else in the world?

    And by the way, their game certainly does NOT conform to Nevada Gaming Rules. In Nevada the law REQUIRES video games featuring images of cards to act like (surprise!) a real deck of cards!

    Slotland's Wild Heart (ostensibly Double Joker Poker) game screen contains similar false language.

    I have never, over the course of playing at MANY casinos, encountered anything remotely like this.

    I guess if Slotland wants to create a pseudo-video poker game, well it's the wild west and anything goes.

    But to make their game look EXACTLY like a real video poker game, and put absolutely NO DISCLAIMER to the contrary on the pay table or ANYWHERE on the game screen itself -- and in fact explicitly equate their games to Nevada's video poker games -- is FRAUD in my opinion.

    And unfortunately for me, I played (and lost) hundreds of dollars on their games under a false pretense.

    From my further research on this site, Slotland apparently enjoys a reputation for good customer service and I will be contacting them directly about this and hope they remedy my situation. But in the meantime other players should be made aware of how their games are operated.

    And I would hope Casinomeister will remove them from the "Recommended" list if they do not immediately (at a minimum) add a prominent disclaimer to their games. Right there on the main game screen, with an asterisk on the pay table -- is that so much to ask?
    Last edited by chalupa; 28th August 2004 at 08:49 AM.

  2. Thanks Zoozie thanked this post
  3. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    London, England
    Posts
    675
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    61
    Thanked 72 Times in 54 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation Points: 529
    Thats one of the best written posts I have seen and I agree with you wholeheartedly on this.

    How can it be "random" if the jackpot ie
    RF
    is determined by a central RNG.

    Say you hit the deal button and the central RNG decides that this is the big jackpot it must have to deal the
    RF
    straight in (PAT) Otherwise you may have someone discard the 3 cards of the royal and then what!!

    Anyway I can only echo your words on this and think it needs to be displayed very prominently that this is a slot machine and the odds of getting any winning combinations are set by something other than a random deck of cards.

    Very sorry that you lost a considerable sum of money under totally false pretenses mate.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    1,028
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    55
    Thanked 193 Times in 98 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation Points: 1212
    Completely agree - also played the sign-up bonus thinking there was a reasonable chance of keeping some of it as they had video poker. Only realised afterwards it was a slot machine.

    I can't see any reason whatsoever they couldn't change the software to point this out (call it a Jacks or Better Slot or whatever), unless their aim is to trick video poker players into playing at the casino. Casinomeister, why not have a quick word with them as they seem to be one of the most prominent advertisers on here?

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    The Boonies
    Posts
    2,137
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    993
    Thanked 992 Times in 484 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation Points: 5513
    Slotland has slots only. The
    VP
    is a slot with cards instead of fruit and bars. It functions just like any other slot, and it is as fair as any other slot.

    Please note that all games share the same mechanism which determines the jackpot win. Thus, with card games, the probability of hitting the jackpot combination is not natural but controlled by this shared random mechanism in the same way as slot machines' wins
    The place is called Slotland. They disclose that their video poker is a slot machine. Everything at Slotland is a slot.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    England
    Posts
    1,662
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 141 Times in 64 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation Points: 0
    Quote Originally Posted by chalupa
    "Our games have been designed by software experts to perform just like its counterparts in land-based casinos. The random number generator used in SLOTLAND's proprietary software has been tested and found to conform with the results of similar games found in Atlantic City with respect to randomness and payout frequency. For your protection, all wagers at SLOTLAND are recorded and there is a complete audit trail available on all games that are played."

    "Please note that all games share the same mechanism which determines the jackpot win. Thus, with card games, the probability of hitting the jackpot combination is not natural but controlled by this shared random mechanism in the same way as slot machines' wins."

    What?? WHAATT??? How do these two paragraphs reconcile with each other?
    Easily: the "similar games" referred to are SLOT games. Neat, eh?

    Chalupa: Do a search next time - you'll save yourself some money:

    http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...ead.php?t=5023

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    1,028
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    55
    Thanked 193 Times in 98 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation Points: 1212
    Quote Originally Posted by dominique
    Slotland has slots only. The
    VP
    is a slot with cards instead of fruit and bars. It functions just like any other slot, and it is as fair as any other slot.


    The place is called Slotland. They disclose that their video poker is a slot machine. Everything at Slotland is a slot.
    Well, it's hidden in the small print - and as it's called 'video poker' you'd have to admit a few naive souls might mistake it for video poker

    I'm not sure how it functions, to be honest. As mentioned above it doesn't quite function like a slot as you have to hold or discard cards - so it's hard to know how the slot mechanism takes that into account. My guess at the time was that it actually works like a video poker machine except that it stops the player getting a royal flush unless it's time for a payout... but who knows - they don't explain it.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    North America
    Posts
    506
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    13
    Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation Points: 74
    It plays like a fixed video poker machine, simple as that. How they get away with calling it video poker, I have no idea.

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    europe
    Posts
    169
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 7 Times in 5 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation Points: 62
    Quote Originally Posted by dominique
    Slotland has slots only. The
    VP
    is a slot with cards instead of fruit and bars. It functions just like any other slot, and it is as fair as any other slot.

    The place is called Slotland. They disclose that their video poker is a slot machine. Everything at Slotland is a slot.
    That is nonsense. It is called video poker ("SLOTLAND casino proudly presents the Jacks Or Better, the most popular video poker game ever."), it looks like
    VP
    , it has the paytable of a
    VP
    , the only warning is hidden away from the actual game screen.

    I like the initial poster assumed it was a
    VP
    . We are not alone, I can guarantee.

    Slotland wants people to think it is a
    VP
    . It is so obvious that no intellectually honest person can argue otherwise. They fooled me once, it won't be twice.
    Last edited by Freudian; 28th August 2004 at 10:00 PM.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    181
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 46 Times in 20 Posts
    Rep Power
    55
    Reputation Points: 264
    Thanks, I appreciate the support. I didn't think I was just being utterly stupid due to the late hour, but you never know.

    If you read nothing else in my first obscenely long post, take away only this. On the MAIN PLAYING SCREEN they explicitly state:

    "Our payout and odds are comparable to the top slot machines found in Las Vegas and conform to the Nevada Gaming Rules."

    That is a pretty explicit (and blatantly false, as it turns out) statement. How can they reasonably expect a player to go searching for fine print under an obscure "Technical Tips" section to find something to contradict that?

    Not to mention that the main screen gives every possible visual and common-sense cue that it is a normal VIDEO POKER game?

    But wait, there IS a link on the main page to full instructions, so maybe there's a disclaimer there? Nope. That just further reinforces the (false) notion that it is a normal video poker game. Again you must dig further using the link at the bottom of that page. Keep going... going... there! Right next to other critical information like... like... WebTV compatibility?!?


    The bottom line is that I was led to believe the game was something other than it was. Had I known what it was, I wouldn't have played at all.

    And when I did play, I played Wild Heart (their Double Joker poker) instead of the much better pay table Jacks Or Better game. That was a specific decision based on the smaller maximum bet relative to the jackpot size which (should have) overcome the pay table disadvantage.

    And then I played the game completely incorrectly. For example, holding 2 to a royal instead of a pair. Again that was based on the jackpot size and what I expected were normal royal flush odds.

    In other words, I played a bad game I wouldn't normally play, and then played it horribly to compound my mistake. It's no surprise I went through my bankroll as fast as I did.


    The bottom line is I threw my money away based on false information.

    I have returned an e-mail to a customer service supervisor at Slotland who said he is available 7 days a week to address problems. That was several hours ago but I remain hopeful that they will make good on their reputation for customer service and make me whole.

    I also hope for the benefit of future customers, as well as their long-term reputation, that they make the operation of their games clear. It would be trivial to do. The slightest little asterisk on the main pay table screen and I would have absolutely no argument to make.
    Last edited by chalupa; 28th August 2004 at 11:59 PM.

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    uk
    Posts
    55
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation Points: 20
    Just played the
    VP
    and if its a slot payer then its a poor one,played 82 hands and lost 69 the rest was at best a pair so in theory played 82 lost 82.
    Dross after dross continuosly appeared,it felt like a switch was turned on and set on deal dross mode
    Hmmm even gfed
    VP
    performs better than that

Page 1 of 10 123 ... LastLast

Bladwijzers

Bladwijzers

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Legal Statements and Privacy Policy
Casinomeister.com does not intend for any of the information contained on this website to be used for illegal purposes. You must ensure you meet all age and other regulatory requirements before entering a casino or placing a wager. Online gambling is illegal in many jurisdictions and users should consult legal counsel regarding the legal status of online gambling and gaming in their jurisdictions. The information in this site is for news and entertainment purposes only. Casinomeister.com is an independent directory and information service free of any gaming operator's control. Links to third party websites on Casinomeister.com are provided solely for informative/educational purposes. If you use these links, you leave this Website.

Casinomeister is a registered trademark ®.  You must be 18 years or older to participate in any casino listed here